rcm4453 said:
GRA said:
garsh said:
Oh definitely. 315 miles is their estimate for the EPA rating. Here's an old graph that includes range curves for the old 85, 60, and 40:
There's an interactive "Range per Charge" calculator that will give you the range of the various models as you input speed, temperature, and tires:
link. It's not yet updated for the P100D, but the 90D at 55mph, 70° F with 19" wheels gives 366 miles of range.
They sure as hell can't get 4 mi/kWh at anything approaching normal freeway speeds, which is when range is most critical. Per Tesla's range estimator, an S90D/19" wheels can go 403 miles at 50 mph/70 deg. F, with no HVAC use. Up the speed to 55 and the range drops to 366 in the same conditions; @ 60 mph it drops to 332; @ 65, 302; @70, 275. This is with no wind and no climbing.
There are only 7 states in the contiguous U.S. that have rural interstate limits of 65; 10 allow 75, 7 allow 80, and the other 24 allow 70. If people drive the same way in the rest of the country as they do in the west, most people cruise at least 4-5 mph over the speed limit, if it's set well under the road's design speed. You can knock 8-10 miles of range off those ranges for the P90D/19" wheels & AW tires, even more for the 21" wheels with performance tires. Even an S100D/19" may still be under 300 miles @ 70 mph as above, although it will be close. It should be noted that achieving any of the above ranges requires using the full usable capacity of the battery (bad), and no reserve. While this income demographic may not care that much about battery life, presumably most of them are prudent enough to keep an emergency reserve.
Yeah, yeah, yeah it's called physics.......All vehicles get less range at 70mph on the freeway, including your beloved FCEVs. Why do you make a big deal about it when it's a BEV but never mention it with other types of vehicles?
We were talking specifically about the Tesla S100D here, and what kind of efficiency it could get.
As to your question. BEVs suffer more range loss from other causes in addition to higher speeds, and take longer to refuel. I've mentioned winter range loss on ICEs and other cars, but we all know what those causes are. BTW, I've been trying to get real world range vs. speed info in various conditions from FCEV owners as well, but there are so few posting on those boards that there's very little to go on as yet. I have posted some data from Edmunds' Long-term test Mirai, but they have yet to take it on a road trip.
FCEVs aren't beloved by me - they're tools, and have pluses and minuses just like any tech. They happen to be a much closer fit for my operational requirements at the moment than BEVs, although neither with the necessary characteristics is currently affordable, but that will change. I'll be happy whichever way it goes. As ti happens, I'm writing this from the library in June Lake, which is currently (conveniently) unreachable from the Bay Area owing to lake of range/quick charging infrastructure/H2 fuel statiosn by any BEV/FCEV other than a Tesla Model S (85 kWh or larger battery). On the way here I scoped out the permitted SC location in Groveland to see if there was any construction (nope), which will be needed to allow S60s and Models 3s, plus S70s in some conditions, to reach Mammoth Lakes SC from the Bay Area. OTOH, the trip is quick and convenient in my far less expensive ICE, thanks to more than a century of development of both technology and infrastructure. The hope is to get a ZEV/infrastructure with the same capabilities for about the same price, so we can ALL kick fossil fuels for good.
rcm4453 said:
You're so negative towards BEVs I can't help but wonder why you post on a Nissan Leaf forum? Why not come here to support them? You don't have any threads where you post positive info about BEVs, but you do for FCEVs? What gives? Why not join a forum that focuses on FCEVs? You claim you're neutral and you like both but your posts say otherwise.
What you call being 'negative' I call being objective. BEVs have their uses, and I've posted plenty of 'positive' threads about them here and elsewhere, but 1st gen BEV uses remain seriously constrained compared to far less expensive ICE/HEV. Tesla is starting to change this, but there's still a long way to go, as they're simply unaffordable for most people. PHEVs are starting to become practical and cost-effective for mainstream buyers, while BEVs remain niche vehicles, primarily for well-off multi-vehicle families. Gen 2 BEVs should expand the market, and I'll be far more willing to recommend them to people I know in that category without first needing lots of info about how they plan to use the car, but it remains to be seen if it will be enough to move beyond early adopters and reach mainstream consumers. FCEVs are just starting to be available in more than token numbers and have a nascent infrastructure, and they're also restricted to well-off owners, but they can be a family's sole car (albeit currently restricted to major metropolitan areas of California and a few in state get-away destinations), and with long-term fuel costs and ultimate success or failure unknown. I thin Gen 2 BEVs will have reached a stage where their success, although possibly remaining limited to a niche, is assured, although low fuel prices aren't helping matters.
