Whole Foods Removes EV Charging Stations

[TomT]

I seriously doubt his views have anything to do with the removal of the chargers. I suspect it was simply a business decision. They decided that the ROI was not there...

It's doesn't take much web searching to learn about the views of the Whole Foods CEO. He thinks climate change is happening, but it's natural and won't cause harm. He compared Obamacare to Fascism because, he says, the dictionary definition of Fascism is the government controlling the means of production. Whatever you think of Obamacare that statement is wrong - he's confusing Fascism with (apparently) Communism. He's said some other interesting stuff - research and judge for yourself.

 

[greengate]

It's doesn't take much web searching to learn about the views of the Whole Foods CEO. He thinks climate change is happening, but it's natural and won't cause harm. He compared Obamacare to Fascism because, he says, the dictionary definition of Fascism is the government controlling the means of production. Whatever you think of Obamacare that statement is wrong - he's confusing Fascism with (apparently) Communism. He's said some other interesting stuff - research and judge for yourself.

I know

I have. :shock:

And they are picking up 4 of the recently closed Dominick's stored in The Chicago metropolitan area.

I wish I could view this a purely an act of service. :roll:

 

[kubel]

I think they decided that they liked the image that charging stations provided while they were getting subsidized installs and free service from ChargePoint. Now that it's all dried up and ChargePoint is charging service fees, it's just an expense with no real return on a continuing investment.

I think we'll start seeing a decrease in the number of network-based charging stations from here on out. The government subsidies are disappearing, and companies like Coulomb Technologies that existed solely because of government grants will quietly pack up and disappear. I never saw random public charging stations as something that would be here for long. I think the new future will be market driven rather than government driven, primarily manufacturer operated stations, like Superchargers.

 

[greengate]

I think they decided that they liked the image that charging stations provided while they were getting subsidized installs and free service from ChargePoint. Now that it's all dried up and ChargePoint is charging service fees, it's just an expense with no real return on a continuing investment.

I think we'll start seeing a decrease in the number of network-based charging stations from here on out. The government subsidies are disappearing, and companies like Coulomb Technologies that existed solely because of government grants will quietly pack up and disappear. I never saw random public charging stations as something that would be here for long. I think the new future will be market driven rather than government driven, primarily manufacturer operated stations, like Superchargers.

Unfortunately that's the way the world turns these days.

In my day, before MBO's and the like, our first question would always be: Is it good for the community, the employees, the company and the share holders.

Community and employees are painfully absent from this equation, seemingly having been replaced with the CEO. :roll:

 

[mbender]

It's doesn't take much web searching to learn about the views of the Whole Foods CEO. He thinks climate change is happening, but it's natural and won't cause harm. He compared Obamacare to Fascism because, he says, the dictionary definition of Fascism is the government controlling the means of production. Whatever you think of Obamacare that statement is wrong - he's confusing Fascism with (apparently) Communism. He's said some other interesting stuff - research and judge for yourself.

One of the oddest and most ethically questionable things he's done is spend eight years praising Whole Foods (and himself, the really weird part) on Yahoo Finance forums under a pseudonym. This was eventually discovered, partly because the pseudonym was an anagram of his wife's name. Here is the WSJ's compilation of his "Greatest Hits". I don't think charges were ever brought against him, so he must have stayed within the letter of the law, but it's still weird.

 

[EVDRIVER]

This probably has more to do with rude EV drivers bitching to the staff at Whole foods and constantly disrupting them from their jobs, I see this all the time at one store with all sorts of fools parking in the charging spots for 12 plus hours. There are more and more entitled EV owners using public charging and disrupting business with petty complaints they can resolve themselves, this is not isolated to broken equipment. Those that frequent many public stations know who these people are and they drive many Nissan dealers crazy as well. I bet many WF customers would start bitching constantly over time that there are not stations available if they were available in every spot. Regardless, WF still is a sad excuse for what they market.

 

[cwerdna]

One of the oddest and most ethically questionable things he's done is spend eight years praising Whole Foods (and himself, the really weird part) on Yahoo Finance forums under a pseudonym. This was eventually discovered, partly because the pseudonym was an anagram of his wife's name. Here is the WSJ's compilation of his "Greatest Hits". I don't think charges were ever brought against him, so he must have stayed within the letter of the law, but it's still weird.

Interesting... I didn't know about that as I normally don't care about Whole Paycheck. From that, he does sound like a weird guy and yes, it sounds ethically questionable given the type of things that the SEC might raise an eyebrow over.

Because of the above, I found out about a story that you can visit by Googling for Whole Foods Is Hot, Wild Oats a Dud -- So Said 'Rahodeb'. Googling for the title of the earlier story and then clicking thru from Google to WSJ is the way to get around their paywall.

 

[ERG4ALL]

I have used the charging stations at our local restaurant. They are Blink stations. The last time we went there one was on the blink and not functioning and the second one said something about the account (I used the restaurant's card) being denied. Fortunately, we didn't really need the charge. But I have noticed that the hosts that greet you usually know next to nothing about the charging equipment sitting in their own parking lot. We need some standardization to make these chargers ubiquitous.

In a way this really shows something about Tesla. I believe all of those Superchargers are owned by Tesla so if there is a problem I would expect that the problem would be corrected quickly because you aren't working through one or two intermediaries and there is no concern as to whether the account for the charger is in good standing (charging is free for a Tesla owner). Also, if you have a Tesla you are sure what kind of equipment you will be dealing with. Now if Tesla will just get the Model E out. Nissan better help resolve some of these public charging issues or they may be in trouble.

 

[r1234567]

Here's the reply I got back from Whole Foods regarding the removal of the EVSE in Northbrook and Kildeer:

"We're looking for a new provider and we hope to be able to provide electric charging stations again very soon."

 

[DaveEV]

Here's the reply I got back from Whole Foods regarding the removal of the EVSE in Northbrook and Kildeer:

"We're looking for a new provider and we hope to be able to provide electric charging stations again very soon."

Interesting - so I can see them pulling out the 350 Green CHAdeMO stations, but why pull out the Chargepoint stations unless they have proven to be too unreliable or expensive? While Chargepoint fees are probably the most expensive, the stations themselves seem to be one of the most reliable.

 

[greengate]

Here's the reply I got back from Whole Foods regarding the removal of the EVSE in Northbrook and Kildeer:

"We're looking for a new provider and we hope to be able to provide electric charging stations again very soon."

Interesting - so I can see them pulling out the 350 Green CHAdeMO stations, but why pull out the Chargepoint stations unless they have proven to be too unreliable or expensive? While Chargepoint fees are probably the most expensive, the stations themselves seem to be one of the most reliable.

Are you implying this, "we are looking for a new vendor," might be something other than the truth?

If not, perhaps we could help them find a vendor :lol:

 

[TRONZ]

Well Costco yanked out (most of) their chargers a while back. Lots of reasons speculated about that. I am actually getting to the point where I think its kinda silly to make a grocery store (or random whatever) responsible for my cars energy supply. I get that some drivers have patched together a charging routine and really count on some of these sites but we really need to break out of this park-all-day-to-charge-level-2 mindset. Badgering a jerk CEO might seem like a good idea (and fun) but its trivial and a waste of time because they actually don't matter. As mentioned already, the best and most useful EV infrastructure is by Tesla. Its growing and working because it in no way relies on "others" to carry out its disruptive mission. If you want something done right, do it yourself. If you want something REALLY REALLY important done right, you REALLY REALLY need to do it yourself!

 

[EatsShootsandLeafs]

I still don't care about charge stations. Basically never have. It's pretty obvious that they are not reliable enough to be truly counted on. I have never, nor ever will take a trip that relies on charging at some point in it or else I cannot return home. Contrast with the massive ubiquity and 99.99999% reliability of gas stations. In the latter you can entirely count on gas always being available, but with electric you can't. IMO you can only rely on charge stations available to you at home.

I guess it may be different in certain cities with a ton of stations, but where I am there are 1-2 and it's just irrelevant. Imagine going to the mall and they're either down or other cars are in the way and you're sucking your thumb waiting for somebody to leave so you can charge up. It's really just silly. I think there is something essentially wrong with public charging infrastructure because at the least it requires a car to be in a spot for quite a while. Gas stations don't have that problem, and at home you have your own dedicated spot.

It all just feels like a bandaid on the real ill, which is battery range. When that gets better charge stations will be even more irrelevant.

 

[adric22]

I still don't care about charge stations. Basically never have. It's pretty obvious that they are not reliable enough to be truly counted on.

You are partially correct. Blink stations in particular are very unreliable and I would not plan a trip somewhere that I knew I'd have to rely on a blink station. But to say that all stations are unreliable is just not accurate. I've found that the EVGO stations in DF/W are very reliable and also unlikely to be ICE'd because they have tow-away signs. Although one time I did encounter an EVGO station that was ICE'd, so I called the number on the sign and they came and towed them away. I didn't feel in the least bit guilty about that.

There is another problem, which I think will be rectified in time. That is that most charging locations have either 1 or 2 stations. So it isn't too difficult to imagine situations where they can be unavailable due to either being in use, ICE'd, or broken. Tesla has been installing at least 6 and sometimes a lot more stations at each location. So even if one is broken, you can just move to the next station. I hope to see a future where parking lots of malls and other big stores have dozens of charging stations.

 

[Nubo]

Contrast with the massive ubiquity and 99.99999% reliability of gas stations. In the latter you can entirely count on gas always being available...

I get what you're saying, but I also think you must be younger than me

\

 

[dgpcolorado]

I get what you're saying, but I also think you must be younger than me

Hah! That was my immediate reaction also. I remember waiting in those gas lines. I was fortunate that most of my travel at the time was discretionary, as opposed to necessary, so I didn't have to do it very often. Remember "odds and evens"? (Odd and even number license plates had different days of the week when they were allowed to buy gas.)

 

[EatsShootsandLeafs]

I get what you're saying, but I also think you must be younger than me

Hah! That was my immediate reaction also. I remember waiting in those gas lines. I was fortunate that most of my travel at the time was discretionary, as opposed to necessary, so I didn't have to do it very often. Remember "odds and evens"? (Odd and even number license plates had different days of the week when they were allowed to buy gas.)

I was not around for those. I hope they don't happen again

 

[aqn]

I get what you're saying, but I also think you must be younger than me

Hah! That was my immediate reaction also. I remember waiting in those gas lines. I was fortunate that most of my travel at the time was discretionary, as opposed to necessary, so I didn't have to do it very often. Remember "odds and evens"? (Odd and even number license plates had different days of the week when they were allowed to buy gas.)

I was not around for those. I hope they don't happen again

What do you care? You drive a LEAF.

 

[aqn]

John Mackey != Whole Foods.

You need to look at what Whole Foods is doing, and talk to Whole Foods employees. My cousin has been at Whole Foods HQ for 21 years. She paints a much different picture.

 

[hill]

From what I've heard... Whole Foods is a right wing run company.

I've heard the same thing about them myself. The one down the street just installed two ABB DCFCs, but the parking garage is owned by Vulcan, so Whole Foods didn't have any hand in it. Seems like the greenwashing theory is a likely one. Aside from their stellar assortment of organic bacon, I usually take my business elsewhere. :twisted:

oh pleeez . . . take the ("if our party was in power, they'd solve the problems because our lacky's are more honest than your lacky's") - right wing-left wing simple minded blame game some where else. There is a subforum for that already, so why not make use of it.

Well Costco yanked out (most of) their chargers a while back. Lots of reasons speculated about that. I am actually getting to the point where I think its kinda silly to make a grocery store (or random whatever) responsible for my cars energy supply. I get that some drivers have patched together a charging routine and really count on some of these sites but we really need to break out of this park-all-day-to-charge-level-2 mindset. Badgering a jerk CEO might seem like a good idea (and fun) but its trivial and a waste of time because they actually don't matter. As mentioned already, the best and most useful EV infrastructure is by Tesla. Its growing and working because it in no way relies on "others" to carry out its disruptive mission. If you want something done right, do it yourself. If you want something REALLY REALLY important done right, you REALLY REALLY need to do it yourself!

Thank you Tronz, for the voice of sanity and reason.

.