What would you pay to "upgrade" from 2012 SL to 2013 SV?

[DaveinOlyWA]

Thank you to BOTH of you for educating me on the system.

As I said previously, I own the 2012 SL and it is not lease... So the only question is how much is okay to pay more to get the 2013 SV (leaving out the taxes and registeration). By the way, if I do trade in my 2012 Leaf, I do not pay taxes!!! as MD has brought back the tax credit for sales tax. Of course, I will also be eligible for $7500 credit.

So how much is okay enough? to pay more for a better heater, regen feature and 6.6 kW charger. Of course, I would be going from a car with 10,000 miles on the car to a brand new car so that ought to mean something....

Alternatively, I do not believe that 2013 S provides either of those features!

Mukarram

i have the perfect solution for you;

2 LEAF family!@!

 

[TimLee]

Keep in mind that the "hybrid heater" is little more than a heat pump with a backup resistive heater, no different than a heat pump for the home. And like with home systems, heat pumps are only effective down to a certain temperature.

I don't know at what point the Leaf's heat pump becomes ineffective, but I've seen figures for home units anywhere from +17 F to as much as +35 F. If temps where you are regularly fall below freezing, a 2013 Leaf may not offer you improved range under such conditions.

While this has been repeated often enough, a heat pump becomes as inefficient as a resistive heater around 10 F. It's typically 3 to 4 times more efficient at 50 F, and somewhere in-between at 30 F. A lot will likely depend on the individual implementation, but it's not fair to say that a heat pump offers no benefit around the freezing point. It could be twice as efficient as a resistive heater at that ambient temperature, which is significant.

which is the exact problem. I dont need heat when its 50º. In fact, its almost that cold nearly every morning in the Summer and i always drive the 5 miles to the freeway with both front windows down because i would sweat while drinking hot coffee. There is no improvement to an already efficient heater and range improvements are not worth the extra money. But in my case, if I had more time on my lease, i might have done it to save money but i put too much down and only have 7 months left so i am good.

The graph is wrong Dave. Its for an old style home heat pump system.
Not correct for the current mini-split heat pump systems or the one the 2013 SV & SL LEAF.
As pointed out earlier in the thread, the Nissan Japan graph shows the hybrid heat pump is effective down to around 5 F.

 

[RonDawg]

So how much is okay enough? to pay more for a better heater, regen feature and 6.6 kW charger.

Only you can answer that question. It's very difficult to compare two people in this scenario, due to the differing down payments, different ages of the cars, different conditions of the cars, different used car values depending on area etc.

It comes down to how much extra do you want to pay to get those features? In my case, the answer would be "not for what I would have to pay to get out of my current lease," but I'm not you. A few early buyers did trade in and leased instead to alleviate any concerns about battery degradation, so in their case they felt it was worth it especially with all the improvements.

Alternatively, I do not believe that 2013 S provides either of those features!

The charge package gets you the 6.6 (really, 6.0) kW on board charger, but the better heater and B mode require stepping up to the SV or SL.

 

[surfingslovak]

which is the exact problem. I dont need heat when its 50º. In fact, its almost that cold nearly every morning in the Summer and i always drive the 5 miles to the freeway with both front windows down because i would sweat while drinking hot coffee. There is no improvement to an already efficient heater and range improvements are not worth the extra money. But in my case, if I had more time on my lease, i might have done it to save money but i put too much down and only have 7 months left so i am good.

The graph is wrong Dave. Its for an old style home heat pump system.
Not correct for the current mini-split heat pump systems or the one the 2013 SV & SL LEAF.
As pointed out earlier in the thread, the Nissan Japan graph shows the hybrid heat pump is effective down to around 5 F.

Yes, thanks for pointing that out. Please use this chart from the 2013 LEAF presentation. I couldn't get it in higher resolution, my apologies. While the range of the vehicle will be impacted at lower temperatures, the new heating system offers a significant efficiency gain all the way down to 14F (-10°C).

The charge package gets you the 6.6 (really, 6.0) kW on board charger, but the better heater and B mode require stepping up to the SV or SL.

Right, that's my recollection also. My friends went for an SV recently for similar reasons.

 

[Goodtohave]

Interesting topic for me...

I am in Canada and the 2013 has yet to be released. They are talking July but wanted to get rid of all the 2012's first.

I was back and forth as whether to wait or buy a 2012.

I ended up buying a 2012 SL with QC.

Heat is a big issue where I am but on the really cold days the hybrid system may be useless anyways, time will tell, I plan to preheat, I have a level 2 at home and am used to relying on heated seats and steering wheel as I had on my BMW.

The 6.6 would be nice but I am realizing that the level 2 aside from at home is useless for me. Whether it charges 1 bar or 2 in an hour makes no difference to me, I charge overnight....what really bites is we have no QC's here and it looks like nothing soon. Go figure all our Hydro power.

As far as the light interior it worries me but I am a friend of the owner of the Nissan dealer I got it from and he just said not to worry about it, when the lease is up they will shampoo it and send it back to Nissan. Another problem solved.

Another plus for me is the 12 is made in Japan, the 2013 is not, will this effect reliability? 2012 is the safer bet.

I got an $8500 manufacturer rebate (plus an $8000 gov't tax credit) so it just didn't seem to me that the 2013 was worth $8500 more.

I leased it but either way only time will tell.

The around view camera on the 13 is awesome, tried it on a Murano....I do wish I had it , along with the charge port release on the 13, but again not missing it for $8500.

 

[Mukarram2000]

Thank you all for your replies

I am not leasing my current 2012 SL but intact I own it.

Yes, I am only looking at trading it in for 2013 SV as of right now

 

[Yogi62]

Yogi and all.....

We are in the same exact boat as you..., we are thinking of trading in our 17 month old 2012 SL with only 10k miles for a new base 2013 SV with only floor mats added....So, what do you think I should end up paying with everything added??? Our state tax in MD is 6% but the good thing is one is taxed after subtracting the trade....

Since I live in MD, the hybrid heater, the new regen B mode and 6.6 kW fast charger (not L3) is appealing me... We do not have any incentives in MD.....

Look forward to hear your thoughts

Mukarram

So I got a pretty good deal for the old car, 21,500 but it was 3 months and 2,500 miles.

Relative to the deal I got, your battery has 15 more months on it (which apparently is worth about $1500 based on the battery lease program). You also have 7,000 more miles....what is a mile worth? $30K / 100K miles? 30 cents each? So that would be $2100 off what I got. I guess in your position I would hold out for $19K and a net difference of 4 to 4.5K. I am assuming you can use the full federal credit.

 

[Mukarram2000]

Yogi and all.....

We are in the same exact boat as you..., we are thinking of trading in our 17 month old 2012 SL with only 10k miles for a new base 2013 SV with only floor mats added....So, what do you think I should end up paying with everything added??? Our state tax in MD is 6% but the good thing is one is taxed after subtracting the trade....

Since I live in MD, the hybrid heater, the new regen B mode and 6.6 kW fast charger (not L3) is appealing me... We do not have any incentives in MD.....

Look forward to hear your thoughts

Mukarram

So I got a pretty good deal for the old car, 21,500 but it was 3 months and 2,500 miles.

Relative to the deal I got, your battery has 15 more months on it (which apparently is worth about $1500 based on the battery lease program). You also have 7,000 more miles....what is a mile worth? $30K / 100K miles? 30 cents each? So that would be $2100 off what I got. I guess in your position I would hold out for $19K and a net difference of 4 to 4.5K. I am assuming you can use the full federal credit.

I agree with you!!! I was hoping to get at least $20k trade for my 2012 SL. Yes, I can take advantage of the $7500 federal credit if I do get the 2013 SV

 

[Mukarram2000]

Interesting topic for me...

I am in Canada and the 2013 has yet to be released. They are talking July but wanted to get rid of all the 2012's first.

I was back and forth as whether to wait or buy a 2012.

I ended up buying a 2012 SL with QC.

Heat is a big issue where I am but on the really cold days the hybrid system may be useless anyways, time will tell, I plan to preheat, I have a level 2 at home and am used to relying on heated seats and steering wheel as I had on my BMW.

The 6.6 would be nice but I am realizing that the level 2 aside from at home is useless for me. Whether it charges 1 bar or 2 in an hour makes no difference to me, I charge overnight....what really bites is we have no QC's here and it looks like nothing soon. Go figure all our Hydro power.

As far as the light interior it worries me but I am a friend of the owner of the Nissan dealer I got it from and he just said not to worry about it, when the lease is up they will shampoo it and send it back to Nissan. Another problem solved.

Another plus for me is the 12 is made in Japan, the 2013 is not, will this effect reliability? 2012 is the safer bet.

I got an $8500 manufacturer rebate (plus an $8000 gov't tax credit) so it just didn't seem to me that the 2013 was worth $8500 more.

I leased it but either way only time will tell.

The around view camera on the 13 is awesome, tried it on a Murano....I do wish I had it , along with the charge port release on the 13, but again not missing it for $8500.

wow .... $8500 manufacturer's rebate..... that is so sweet..

Right now, Nissan has NO incentives on Leaf other than 0% APR for 36 months..... NOTHING else!!!!

 

[Mukarram2000]

So how much is okay enough? to pay more for a better heater, regen feature and 6.6 kW charger.

Only you can answer that question. It's very difficult to compare two people in this scenario, due to the differing down payments, different ages of the cars, different conditions of the cars, different used car values depending on area etc.

It comes down to how much extra do you want to pay to get those features? In my case, the answer would be "not for what I would have to pay to get out of my current lease," but I'm not you. A few early buyers did trade in and leased instead to alleviate any concerns about battery degradation, so in their case they felt it was worth it especially with all the improvements.

Alternatively, I do not believe that 2013 S provides either of those features!

The charge package gets you the 6.6 (really, 6.0) kW on board charger, but the better heater and B mode require stepping up to the SV or SL.

Yes... my plan was to get an SV....

 

[Mukarram2000]

Thank you to BOTH of you for educating me on the system.

As I said previously, I own the 2012 SL and it is not lease... So the only question is how much is okay to pay more to get the 2013 SV (leaving out the taxes and registeration). By the way, if I do trade in my 2012 Leaf, I do not pay taxes!!! as MD has brought back the tax credit for sales tax. Of course, I will also be eligible for $7500 credit.

So how much is okay enough? to pay more for a better heater, regen feature and 6.6 kW charger. Of course, I would be going from a car with 10,000 miles on the car to a brand new car so that ought to mean something....

Alternatively, I do not believe that 2013 S provides either of those features!

Mukarram

i have the perfect solution for you;

2 LEAF family!@!

I wish I could or if we needed to.. We already have another EV and we only need two cars....