Water We Gonna Do Now? (Or..Welcome to year 8 of drought...)

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klapauzius said:
AndyH said:
<snip>
Same for my electric bill. It's more expensive in the summer, and less expensive during the short period of time that passes for 'spring' and 'fall' around here. But the overall trend is clear - and it's not going down.
I would suspect that you would have to show a 50 year range to convince Herm :D
With only five years of data it would be hard to dispel a 10 year cycle. Also, did you correct your plot for inflation?

Still, I think the long-term trend is there an can probably be inferred from the weather data.
Thanks! Just after posting the chart - in that 'OhNoSecond' ;) - I realized that in spite of intending to show only that a trend can exist within cycles, that the brains here would have their way. :lol:

Not sure 50 years would work for Herm (who loves ya, man?!) as he's like a climate denier Columbo. :lol:
 
Herm said:
Very interesting.. look at the bottom of this GIF, I selected area 205 at random.

http://midgewater.twdb.state.tx.us/cgi-bin/Evaporation/parseevap.cgi?quad=205&options=G&submit=SUBMIT" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
You mean the uptick in evaporation rates? Or?
 
I think so...Is there a way to upload figures directly to a post?
If you low-pass filter the precipitation data, the spectrum shows a 5 year cycle.
But no clear trend.
I would definitely see an uptick in the evaporation though...
 
Herm said:
AndyH said:
You mean the uptick in evaporation rates? Or?

that one.. must be GW, cant be anything else..
Herm? :shock: Who is this really?! :lol:

The state climatologist seems to agree with you (Keep in mind as you scan this that we have two factors - El Nino/La Nina for rainfall, and average temps for evaporation...)

The 2011 Texas Drought
A Briefing Packet for the Texas Legislature
October 31, 2011
http://atmo.tamu.edu/osc/library/osc_pubs/2011_drought.pdf
Beyond the next few years, climate change must be taken into account. Projected changes
in precipitation are relatively small compared to past natural precipitation variations
(Nielsen-Gammon, 2011), so it seems unlikely that anthropogenic climate change will
induce a substantial decrease in Texas precipitation by mid-century. Natural variations
presently have Texas in a dry phase, so it seems relatively likely that as the PDO and AMO
evolve over the next couple of decades Texas will pass into another relatively wet phase,
albeit temporary. Scientists also do not know whether La Niña, which exerts such a strong
influence on Texas weather from year to year, will become more or less frequent as the
climate changes.

Projected temperature changes are much larger than past decade-scale temperature
variations in Texas, and the projected warming is robust across models. While it is not
known how much warmer temperatures will become, an increase of several degrees
Fahrenheit by mid-century in Texas is well within the realm of possibility.

Whether such a large temperature increase comes to pass or not, it seems very likely that
temperatures will become at least somewhat warmer than present, so that evaporation will
have an increasingly large impact on water supplies throughout Texas. Future droughts will
almost certainly be warmer than the Texas droughts of the past, and consequently will tend
to be more severe even if precipitation is unchanged. It took rainfall only a third of normal
to achieve summertime Texas temperatures five degrees warmer than their 20th century
average; perhaps by mid-century a drought with two-thirds of normal precipitation will be
sufficient to achieve similarly warm conditions
 
Herm said:
AndyH said:
Not sure 50 years would work for Herm (who loves ya, man?!) as he's like a climate denier Columbo. :lol:

200k years would do it, most definitely.
You dont happen to have lots of ice and glaciers in Texas? Real climate researchers look at ice-cores, which actually allow to look back on time scales like this.
If there had been an upward trend like we currently have due to human caused climate for 200k years, we would not be here writing...
If you are not entirely convinced that the whole GW business is bad for everyone, take a look at the planet Venus ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venus" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ).
Its actually quite earth like, in size, length of the year etc.

Today we know what a runaway greenhouse effect can do and at 460 degrees Celsius Venus is probably a good place for
outdoor grilling (without having to light a fire). Not to mention the acid atmosphere (which is 96.5% carbon dioxide...yes THAT carbon dioxide). Needless to say it is so hot there because of the same processes that warm up our planet right now.
If we try hard enough, I guess we could turn earth into something like this.
 
But very un-earth like in distance from the sun, which is a signifiant contributing factor to it's inhospitable environment. At it's furthest distance from the sun, Venus is within the 'habitable zone', but for much of its orbit it is a bit too close. (Mars, fwiw, is within the habitable zone for its full orbit.)

Earth, although comfortably within the habitable zone, would be a bit too cold for comfort without a small 'greenhouse effect' (remember the ice ages), but you are correct that too much of a good thing is not so good at all.

klapauzius said:
If you are not entirely convinced that the whole GW business is bad for everyone, take a look at the planet Venus ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venus" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ).
Its actually quite earth like, in size, length of the year etc.
 
just saw NBC nightly News. 2011 goes done as the most expensive and deadliest weather year in history. 12 Billion dollar events breaks record of 9 Billion Dollar Disasters set in 2008. more people died this year than any on record and Climatologists states GCC is the culprit and its gonna get worse.

but then again, its just the nightly news.
 
I think Obama should resign immediately..

http://www.usatoday.com/weather/news/story/2011-12-07/billion-dollar-disasters/51704362/1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"USA slammed by 12 disasters that each cost at least $1B"
"The breakdown for the 12 disasters: six severe weather/tornado outbreaks; the spring and summer river flooding along the Missouri and Mississippi Rivers; the ongoing Southern drought; the blizzard in February in the Central and Eastern USA; Hurricane Irene in August; and the Southwestern wildfires."
 
Herm said:
I think Obama should resign immediately..

http://www.usatoday.com/weather/news/story/2011-12-07/billion-dollar-disasters/51704362/1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"USA slammed by 12 disasters that each cost at least $1B"
"The breakdown for the 12 disasters: six severe weather/tornado outbreaks; the spring and summer river flooding along the Missouri and Mississippi Rivers; the ongoing Southern drought; the blizzard in February in the Central and Eastern USA; Hurricane Irene in August; and the Southwestern wildfires."
Will you enlighten us what this has to do with the president?
 
Herm said:
I think Obama should resign immediately..

http://www.usatoday.com/weather/news/story/2011-12-07/billion-dollar-disasters/51704362/1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"USA slammed by 12 disasters that each cost at least $1B"
"The breakdown for the 12 disasters: six severe weather/tornado outbreaks; the spring and summer river flooding along the Missouri and Mississippi Rivers; the ongoing Southern drought; the blizzard in February in the Central and Eastern USA; Hurricane Irene in August; and the Southwestern wildfires."


LOL!! well gotta blame someone!
 
What really frightens me is that Newt The Nut is leading on the Republican side... Are voters REALLY that stupid??? Jon Huntsman appears to be the only reasonable, sane and intelligent individual running on that side of the fence and he doesn't appear to have a chance.

Herm said:
I think Obama should resign immediately.
 
klapauzius said:
Will you enlighten us what this has to do with the president?

Well, he is in charge.. through a lack of foresight and/or leadership he has failed to do something about it.. just look at Katrina and Bush as an example.
 
a story that will warm our hearts.. there is still hope!

http://www.grist.org/list/2011-09-23-teens-invention-boosts-solar-panel-output-40-percent" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"My parents instilled a sense of responsibility towards the environment when I was younger and I carried this value with me throughout my life. I had the opportunity to travel to the Canadian Arctic two years ago where I witnessed the depressing lack of sea ice as a result of climate change, which made it hard for animals to find food and land. On a Zodiac boat ride, I had a chance to get within five metres of a polar bear that was so desperately hungry he didn’t even bother to turn away from us. This was an emotional moment for me when I realised that I had a chance to help prevent this problem from getting worse. I would have to help with the reduction of CO2 emissions"
 
Herm said:
klapauzius said:
Will you enlighten us what this has to do with the president?

Well, he is in charge.. through a lack of foresight and/or leadership he has failed to do something about it.. just look at Katrina and Bush as an example.

I must have missed something in the past 5 years....Bush resigned over the poor handling of Kathrina?
Lack of foresight?
Are Presidents supposed to have mythical powers now? Or maybe God did not speak to him, like to the current republican contenders?

In ancient times, people used to ceremoniously sacrifice their kings when stuff like this happened...
I know conservatives want live in the past, but that far back?
 
Herm said:
a story that will warm our hearts.. there is still hope!

http://www.grist.org/list/2011-09-23-teens-invention-boosts-solar-panel-output-40-percent" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"My parents instilled a sense of responsibility towards the environment when I was younger and I carried this value with me throughout my life. I had the opportunity to travel to the Canadian Arctic two years ago where I witnessed the depressing lack of sea ice as a result of climate change, which made it hard for animals to find food and land. On a Zodiac boat ride, I had a chance to get within five metres of a polar bear that was so desperately hungry he didn’t even bother to turn away from us. This was an emotional moment for me when I realised that I had a chance to help prevent this problem from getting worse. I would have to help with the reduction of CO2 emissions"

Well, yes...Let me tell you that elsewhere stories like that come with less cheese. Outside the US people are a little more modest.
I have seen a bunch of stories like this about solar panels, some of which seemed to be BS. That does not make the problem of global warming less problematic though...

I personally dont care much about polar bears, but they are a canary in the mine.
 
TomT said:
What really frightens me is that Newt The Nut is leading on the Republican side... Are voters REALLY that stupid??? Jon Huntsman appears to be the only reasonable, sane and intelligent individual running on that side of the fence and he doesn't appear to have a chance.

Herm said:
I think Obama should resign immediately.

I agree. Why has every vote in this country in the recent past to be like this?
Wouldnt it be nice, for a change, if BOTH candidates for the presidency were reasonable sane beings, who would have REAL issues on their agendas.
 
Jan 13 LA Times ran an Op-Ed, "Adding up the Water Deficit," on the decline of Lake Mead, which is on of the 3 main sources of water to Southern California:

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-debuys-water-20120113,0,6554882.story

What was new to me was the possibility that the lake level could drop below the lowest intake in just 14 years:
After 2026, the risk of failure of Lake Mead, in the words of a member of the second team, "just skyrockets."

Today, Jan 16, the LA Times has a discouraging report "Climate change skepticism seeps into science classrooms":
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-climate-change-school-20120116,0,2808837.story
 
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