Oh yeah - and I would never trade in any car. $15k sounds about right - dealers rip you off on trade in. The car will sell for $19k in the real world - meaning that you ate $5k in depreciation over 2 years or $2.5k/year. Anything in the $2k/year range is reasonable from my perspective - particularly for new technology and given the gas savings.
The official "I got my Leaf" thread
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bobsfreeleaf
Well-known member
Great job! I wonder how many Leaf owners, like you and me, are driving this fun vehicle for free. I am keeping records of all cost changes in my life from lower elec rates to gas savings, HOV stickers, etc. (no free parking for memybleaf said:
), and will report back to this site. In the end I am pretty sure I am getting paid to drive this car. My scenario is that it is a second car, and it still works out. Take care, BobTimLee
Well-known member
Oh, you're on the Whole Home Plan, instead of the Dedicated Meter Plan.mybleaf said:
Peak penalties aren't as severe on Whole Home Plan. But with Dedicated Meter they are supplying the EVSE, right?
Are most people preferring Whole Home to Dedicated Meter?
Chattanooga Electric Power Board hasn't rolled out Time of Day metering yet, but plan to soon.
TimLee said:
I'm not sure what most folks are doing. The folks at SMUD put together a spreadsheet for me and recommended the whole home plan - given the $100/month savings in my bill. It works for me since I am only using basic charging anyway (I average 35 miles/day of drive). Time of day just makes sense to me anyway - I can setup all of my major energy work for the evenings (our house is well insulated - so whole house fan/ac at night, pool filter at night, etc.).
It's interesting how these incentives work out though - unintended consequences. I was ready to put up solar, but the enhanced rates moved my payback from 6 years to 10!
LEAFer
Well-known member
SMUD is very progressive. I like what they've done for the adoption of EVs here in Sacramento County.
Having said that ... the new Whole-House-Plan is for charging at 120V (Level 1) only :-( To do L2 you need the dedicated meter plan ... still a good deal, though.
Having said that ... the new Whole-House-Plan is for charging at 120V (Level 1) only :-( To do L2 you need the dedicated meter plan ... still a good deal, though.
LEAFer said:SMUD is very progressive. I like what they've done for the adoption of EVs here in Sacramento County.
Having said that ... the new Whole-House-Plan is for charging at 120V (Level 1) only :-( To do L2 you need the dedicated meter plan ... still a good deal, though.
I don't think it ever makes $$ sense to do the dedicated meter plan. I can still setup L2 charging - but instead of limiting my preferred rates to the car charger, I get better rates for my whole house (dropping my $300 SMUD bill to $200)... Am I missing something? What is the benefit of the meter only plan?
ptititoi
Active member
Well it's my turn now, after looking for 2 weeks for a good in Orange County, California, I finally got my Leaf S + 6.6 KW charge pack at Connell Nissan in Costa Mesa, they were the only to do not give me dirt cheap for my Porsche Carrera Cab. So, a big thank you to Hector Abad the Connell Sale Rep, really professional, he owns a 2012 Leaf too so he knows really well about the car, I asked him to sign up on our forum, we'll see if he will join us.
My 2 kids loves way more this car than the 911, they say that it sounds like a spaceship
My 2 kids loves way more this car than the 911, they say that it sounds like a spaceship
LEAFer
Well-known member
There's not really a major benefit to the dedicated meter with L2 plan, if (and only if) you are completely happy with the L1 charging speeds. Naturally, if you can refill the miles you need to drive using L1 alone and don't need to compromise on the use of the car, then L1 is cheaper. In some cases SMUD will pay for the L2 EVSE too, though ... still you will face some extra expense. And as a final note, remember that L1 is only about 75% efficient compared to L2 85-90%, so you are paying for some electricity that doesn't get you from A to B.mybleaf said:LEAFer said:SMUD is very progressive. I like what they've done for the adoption of EVs here in Sacramento County.
Having said that ... the new Whole-House-Plan is for charging at 120V (Level 1) only :-( To do L2 you need the dedicated meter plan ... still a good deal, though.
I don't think it ever makes $$ sense to do the dedicated meter plan. I can still setup L2 charging - but instead of limiting my preferred rates to the car charger, I get better rates for my whole house (dropping my $300 SMUD bill to $200)... Am I missing something? What is the benefit of the meter only plan?
The whole-house plan does have the cheaper rates for everything else ... and that's where your particular situation makes a big difference.
HTH.
cgaydos
Well-known member
The discussion of SMUD (Sacramento) electric rates sounds complicated.
I'm on Mountain View Electric Association - a small rural electric co-op in Colorado. On the plus side, rates are simple and low. 10.565 cents/kWh to start then 9.8 cents after 1500 kWh. On the minus side, way too much coal-generated electricity and no benefits for home solar. Also a minus is that their time-metering program has been revised in a manner that will make it unattractive to all but a tiny few.
Anyone have suggestions for who to contact regarding affordable solar installations in places that don't have nice Xcel-energy-style rebate programs?
I'm on Mountain View Electric Association - a small rural electric co-op in Colorado. On the plus side, rates are simple and low. 10.565 cents/kWh to start then 9.8 cents after 1500 kWh. On the minus side, way too much coal-generated electricity and no benefits for home solar. Also a minus is that their time-metering program has been revised in a manner that will make it unattractive to all but a tiny few.
Anyone have suggestions for who to contact regarding affordable solar installations in places that don't have nice Xcel-energy-style rebate programs?
TimLee
Well-known member
Does the local inspection authority only allow installation of an L2 EVSE on a dedicated meter?LEAFer said:
In Chattanooga the installation did have to be inspected, but that was done by the government inspector.
The local utility had nothing to do with it.
In fact, I think an L2 EVSE could be installed without even informing EPB, the electric utility.
But I think the contractor for Ecotality did inform EPB, but only as a courtesy, I don't think it was mandatory.
But I could be wrong about EPB involvement. EPB is owned by Chattanooga. So it is possible that the government inspector does inform EPB of all L2 EVSE installations.
LeafinThePark
Well-known member
After almost 3 years I finally pulled the trigger...leased a 2013 SV yesterday. I never thought I would lease a car, but the deal was too good. $2k down, $154/month for 15k miles/year for 2 years. The big kicker is what the car will be worth in two years...too much uncertainty there for me to go with the purchase.
Everyone is right....what a fun car to drive! Between driving it home from the dealer and having a date night last night I have about 80 miles of driving in so far. Charged it overnight and it is reporting 91 miles of range. We'll me taking it on a little tour this afternoon to show it off to the in-laws today.
EV smiling all the way!
Everyone is right....what a fun car to drive! Between driving it home from the dealer and having a date night last night I have about 80 miles of driving in so far. Charged it overnight and it is reporting 91 miles of range. We'll me taking it on a little tour this afternoon to show it off to the in-laws today.
EV smiling all the way!
LEAFer said:There's not really a major benefit to the dedicated meter with L2 plan, if (and only if) you are completely happy with the L1 charging speeds. Naturally, if you can refill the miles you need to drive using L1 alone and don't need to compromise on the use of the car, then L1 is cheaper. In some cases SMUD will pay for the L2 EVSE too, though ... still you will face some extra expense. And as a final note, remember that L1 is only about 75% efficient compared to L2 85-90%, so you are paying for some electricity that doesn't get you from A to B.mybleaf said:LEAFer said:SMUD is very progressive. I like what they've done for the adoption of EVs here in Sacramento County.
Having said that ... the new Whole-House-Plan is for charging at 120V (Level 1) only :-( To do L2 you need the dedicated meter plan ... still a good deal, though.
I don't think it ever makes $$ sense to do the dedicated meter plan. I can still setup L2 charging - but instead of limiting my preferred rates to the car charger, I get better rates for my whole house (dropping my $300 SMUD bill to $200)... Am I missing something? What is the benefit of the meter only plan?
The whole-house plan does have the cheaper rates for everything else ... and that's where your particular situation makes a big difference.
HTH.
To set the record straight for folks in the SMUD area - you can have the whole house plan and also have a level 2 charger installed (not locked into L1). In fact, this is the best plan to use because it will decrease your cost for all other electricity useage. The above note is not correct.
LEAFer
Well-known member
We need to move this SMUD discussion to a separate thread -- it's OFF TOPIC here. Once moved I'll respondmybleaf said:
bobsfreeleaf
Well-known member
INSURANCE ISSUE! My new Leaf is insured now as a third car (50% usage) under 12k miles a year. Anyway, I was surprised at the cost of adding a third car to my family policy with Liberty. I thought 3rd cars were supposed to be inexpensive? Turns out, it is around $700 a year!!!!!!!!!!! I know new cars cost more to insure than old ones, but I think we are victims of the rebate math.
What I leased was basically a $19,000 vehicle, after rebates. I also suspect what it would sell for used tomorrow, would be about that (keep in mind, I leased the stripped S model).
What I insured was a $35,000 generic Leaf. Turns out Liberty does not recognize the S model as any different than the SL, and does not factor in the rebate. Now that was a surprise :x . Thoughts?
What I leased was basically a $19,000 vehicle, after rebates. I also suspect what it would sell for used tomorrow, would be about that (keep in mind, I leased the stripped S model).
What I insured was a $35,000 generic Leaf. Turns out Liberty does not recognize the S model as any different than the SL, and does not factor in the rebate. Now that was a surprise :x . Thoughts?
DNAinaGoodWay
Well-known member
Wow! $700! That's so cheap! It costs $700 here just for the extra comprehensive coverage.
Bet you have less snow than we do too.
Bet you have less snow than we do too.
cgaydos
Well-known member
bobsfreeleaf said:
Was that Liberty Mutual? I had them for decades but dropped them last year due to huge price increases on home and auto. Google around and you'll see they had some financial issues and responded by raising rates on their loyal customer base.
Shop around - likely you'll find several insurers who give very low premiums on LEAFs ... as I found.
bobsfreeleaf
Well-known member
cgaydos said:
Yes, I will. The problem is that I have tied ALL of my insurance into one bundle with Liberty. So, moving one policy raises all my rates on all my policies. Effectively, I need to move everything to another bundler of insurance. What a pain.
Was also thinking of filing a department of insurance claim. Why should they get to charge me to insure a $35k car, when replacement value is $19k? You tend to get a response to those kinds of claims. THx, bob
bobsfreeleaf said:
AAA wanted DOUBLE what I was paying Allstate to insure my Audi. On previous quotes AAA was close to Allstate, so clearly AAA is charging a lot for the Leaf. OTOH esurance insured both the Leaf and the Audi for what Allstate wanted for the Audi alone.
Liberty Mutual was also one of the more expensive quotes I got, but still less than AAA.
bobsfreeleaf said:
Good luck, because for all you know they are charging all Leaf owners and lessees based on the $29k MSRP of the 2013 Leaf S. The insurer does not have to account for any rebates since not everybody qualifies for them.
The car's MSRP is only one of many factors that determine rates. The price to insure a $25k Honda Civic Si is NOT going to be the same as an equivalently-priced Accord.
