Rolling 2013 Features into 2011/2012 models

[jkirkebo]

I'd love to have the new 'B' mode for extra regen. That would effectively boost my range. I'd pay something for the upgrade...

I'd like the 'B'-mode too, but not if it effectively removes the ECO-mode and has the same throttle-mapping as the 'D'-mode (which I find too agressive and not very linear).

But please, please give me 100% regen on throttle release in ECO. I hate feathering the brake pedal...

 

[sirenbrian]

I'd love to have the new 'B' mode for extra regen. That would effectively boost my range. I'd pay something for the upgrade...

I'd like the 'B'-mode too, but not if it effectively removes the ECO-mode and has the same throttle-mapping as the 'D'-mode (which I find too agressive and not very linear).

But please, please give me 100% regen on throttle release in ECO. I hate feathering the brake pedal...

I want the opposite - I like coasting, not regen, on our flat Florida roads. I'd like the option to have no regen on lifting the accelerator. It should just coast. If I want regen, I would press lightly on the brake pedal. But I don't mind the current system, really, as I've learned to feather the accelerator in my 2011 Prius, so I'm hoping that skill will work in the 2013 Leaf (or 2011 Leaf if I buy a used one).

 

[jkirkebo]

I want the opposite - I like coasting, not regen, on our flat Florida roads. I'd like the option to have no regen on lifting the accelerator. It should just coast. If I want regen, I would press lightly on the brake pedal. But I don't mind the current system, really, as I've learned to feather the accelerator in my 2011 Prius, so I'm hoping that skill will work in the 2013 Leaf (or 2011 Leaf if I buy a used one).

The problem is that it is MUCH easier to feather the throttle so you get no regen than to feather the brake to get full regen but no mechanical braking. The energy screen will happily show if you are coasting, but nowhere does any screen show if mechanical braking is taking place.

Also using the brake cancels cruise control, so on steep downhills where the CC can't keep the speed down because of insufficient regen, I have to cancel it. It would be nice if CC could have access to the full regen level, and I guess it has in 'B'.

 

[planet4ever]

I'd like the 'B'-mode too, but not if it effectively removes the ECO-mode and has the same throttle-mapping as the 'D'-mode (which I find too agressive and not very linear).

Based on what Phil said yesterday, they are independent. You can have either, neither, or both.
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=11057&p=257416#p257416 (See note on 12th photo.)

Ray

 

[jkirkebo]

I'd like the 'B'-mode too, but not if it effectively removes the ECO-mode and has the same throttle-mapping as the 'D'-mode (which I find too agressive and not very linear).

Based on what Phil said yesterday, they are independent. You can have either, neither, or both.

Yeah, but you need the extra button on the steering wheel. No way to upgrade that on my 2012 through software

 

[Ingineer]

Yeah, but you need the extra button on the steering wheel. No way to upgrade that on my 2012 through software

Actually, it would be simple to dual-purpose the cruise control. Simply hold down the on/off button for 1 second to toggle Eco. A quick press turns on the cruise. If cruise is on, any press will turn it off (for safety).

That's only a few lines of code in the VCM, but I don't ever see it happening. Who knows, maybe someday I'll end up with nothing to do and can reverse-engineer the VCM and write my own firmware. Then the sky's the limit! =)

Or maybe Nissan will publish the source code. (In our dreams)

-Phil

 

[garygid]

Getting SoC does not tell you how much remaining usable e-fuel you have.

A battery pack with ony 70% remaining stills shows SoC of about 95% when full.

GIDs, percent GIDs, or usable kWh remaining would be much more useful.

 

[Deleted member 770]

...Who knows, maybe someday I'll end up with nothing to do...
-Phil

OK, now THAT's funny! :lol:

 

[sling]

I'd love to have the new 'B' mode for extra regen. That would effectively boost my range. I'd pay something for the upgrade...

I'd like the 'B'-mode too, but not if it effectively removes the ECO-mode and has the same throttle-mapping as the 'D'-mode (which I find too agressive and not very linear).

But please, please give me 100% regen on throttle release in ECO. I hate feathering the brake pedal...

I want the opposite - I like coasting, not regen, on our flat Florida roads. I'd like the option to have no regen on lifting the accelerator. It should just coast. If I want regen, I would press lightly on the brake pedal. But I don't mind the current system, really, as I've learned to feather the accelerator in my 2011 Prius, so I'm hoping that skill will work in the 2013 Leaf (or 2011 Leaf if I buy a used one).

Well, coasting with no regen can already be done... drop it into neutral. It would be a hassle if you had to do it all the time... in and out, but not much more than if you're driving a stick.

 

[TomT]

They could simply provide a one or two page addendum for the changes if they wanted to. No need to reprint the entire manual.

Andy Palmer told us they are going to call all Leafs back in for another software update in spring. They are definitely going to flash the CM (Combination Meter), so I asked for the SoC meter to be included. There's no technical reason why they can't do this, but TEG is right, I don't expect them to do it. They probably would also have to issue new owner's manuals again if they did, so that is a big expense and a reason to not do it.

 

[TomT]

Yes, that is why the TCU Communications TSB update had to be done by SD card...

Nissan hired Clarion to make the Head unit, so they depend on them to update code. Clarion's architecture apparently uses a bootloader that needs an SD card for flashing, instead of the normal Consult III+/Asyst Nissan system, so it's much more difficult.

 

[TomT]

Not necessarily. You could use the mostly-worthless map button on the wheel or have it as a third position of the D-mode on the joystick (D-Eco-Eco B), or use Cruise as Phil suggested. There are a lot of possible ways to implement it if they really wanted to...

Yeah, but you need the extra button on the steering wheel. No way to upgrade that on my 2012 through software

 

[Ingineer]

Not necessarily. You could use the mostly-worthless map button on the wheel or have it as a third position of the D-mode on the joystick (D-Eco-Eco B), or use Cruise as Phil suggested. There are a lot of possible ways to implement it if they really wanted to...

All the buttons on the left are connected to the head unit, and all the buttons on the right are connected to the VCM. So any drive-affecting functionality would only be possible on the right. Any left button function updates would require a head unit flash (SD card), and I doubt they'll do this unless it's a major issue.

-Phil

 

[Electric4Me]

Not necessarily. You could use the mostly-worthless map button on the wheel or have it as a third position of the D-mode on the joystick (D-Eco-Eco B), or use Cruise as Phil suggested. There are a lot of possible ways to implement it if they really wanted to...

All the buttons on the left are connected to the head unit, and all the buttons on the right are connected to the VCM. So any drive-affecting functionality would only be possible on the right. Any left button function updates would require a head unit flash (SD card), and I doubt they'll do this unless it's a major issue.

-Phil

What I've thought of doing in the past is getting another radio source/channel control button from the left of the steering wheel and trying to replace the cruise control button on the right with it. I would then move the wire from the cruise control cancel button to the new source button on the right (and re-label it) allowing the cruise control to be cancelled with a straight in press of that button. Reaching over that to find the current cancel button drives me nuts. That would free up the current cancel button for Eco or B or whatever.

Of course, this assumes that there's a connection through the steering column for another wire... Nissan of course would never do this.

 

[hyperlexis]

Not necessarily. You could use the mostly-worthless map button on the wheel or have it as a third position of the D-mode on the joystick (D-Eco-Eco B), or use Cruise as Phil suggested. There are a lot of possible ways to implement it if they really wanted to...

All the buttons on the left are connected to the head unit, and all the buttons on the right are connected to the VCM. So any drive-affecting functionality would only be possible on the right. Any left button function updates would require a head unit flash (SD card), and I doubt they'll do this unless it's a major issue.

-Phil

What I've thought of doing in the past is getting another radio source/channel control button from the left of the steering wheel and trying to replace the cruise control button on the right with it. I would then move the wire from the cruise control cancel button to the new source button on the right (and re-label it) allowing the cruise control to be cancelled with a straight in press of that button. Reaching over that to find the current cancel button drives me nuts. That would free up the current cancel button for Eco or B or whatever.

Does anyone even really know how B-mode actually works? Not what it does but how it does it. It seems like it may be hardware based, not solely software based?

Anyone know?

And why in the world did they not include a B mode until now? How does the Leaf control itself on steep downhill runs without a 'low gear' setting? Just by riding the brakes? (bad).

 

[dgpcolorado]

...Does anyone even really know how B-mode actually works? Not what it does but how it does it. It seems like it may be hardware based, not solely software based?

Anyone know?

And why in the world did they not include a B mode until now? How does the Leaf control itself on steep downhill runs without a 'low gear' setting? Just by riding the brakes? (bad).

A fair amount of regen is available in Eco now. The B mode would just increase that. The problem with the current Eco regen is that it isn't enough to keep the speed safely controlled on very steep hills, so periodic braking is necessary. On my hill I generally used second gear in my ICE cars. The LEAF in Eco is roughly equivalent to third gear when it comes to regen braking, which isn't enough.

The downside of B mode is that the higher regen levels may heat the battery and that may add to battery degradation, especially in places with hot ambient temperatures. It would be something like Quick Charging the car repeatedly. If the LEAF had a bigger battery over which to distribute the regen charge it would be less of an issue. But with a 24 kWh battery it is something to consider.

 

[TonyWilliams]

fair amount of regen is available in Eco now. The B mode would just increase that... The downside of B mode is that the higher regen levels may heat the battery and that may add to battery degradation, especially in places with hot ambient temperatures. It would be something like Quick Charging the car repeatedly. If the LEAF had a bigger battery over which to distribute the regen charge it would be less of an issue. But with a 24 kWh battery it is something to consider.

We don't know if the LEAF will have any more or less regen in B over ECO. The Rav4 has a 50kWh battery, and the B mode isn't that strong. Certainly not stronger than ECO in a LEAF.

Rav4 does not have ECO mode.

 

[evnow]

I wonder whether B mode gives all the regen without affected acceleration. Then, it will accelerate like we are in D, but with regen as in Eco.

 

[Ingineer]

We'll probably only need to wait a few more weeks to get a definitive answer.

I plan on releasing an upgrade for the '11-'12 Leaf which will allow you to tailor your pedal off regen. (After LEAFSCAN™, of course)

-Phil

 

[TonyWilliams]

I wonder whether B mode gives all the regen without affected acceleration. Then, it will accelerate like we are in D, but with regen as in Eco.

That's exactly the concept. B is "Brake assist", not screw with you gas pedal and heater.