Question from a non leaf owner

[thom71gt]

I live in a suburb of North Atlanta, so we have a LOT of commuters and I see a LOT of Leafs. For example, in a 2 mile stretch on a main commuting road, my daughter and I counted 17 leafs in just a few minutes. I took her to physical therapy and we counted 51 leafs there and back. The one thing that I've noticed is that many of the Leaf drivers don't have their lights on at dusk or when it rains. I went to Lowes earlier today and counted 12 Leafs, of which only 1 had it's lights on. (It was raining today) All of the other cars had their lights on.

So my question is this. Does the battery perform so badly that Leaf drivers don't want to turn their lights on in order to conserve battery power? It would seem that Nissan would address this if it is an issue. It's a matter of safety.

Just curious and thanks for your response.

 

[kikngas]

No, headlights don't make a measurable impact on range, esp. with newer models that have LED headlamps. So that's not likely the reason. LEAF drivers are just as likely to not think about turning on their lights as other drivers. Some cars run the lights all the time, regardless of weather, LEAFs (at least US made LEAFs) do not.

 

[mwalsh]

Now it's finally gotten dark at evening commute time, I see this a lot across ALL brands of recently produced vehicles. My personal theory is that it's folks with LCD and LED insturment panels not knowing that their lights are not on. Back in the day your instrument panel wouldn't be backlit if your lights weren't on, so you'd know immediately if you needed to turn them on. Nowadays not so much, and if you don't have auto-on or permanently on (daytime running) lights you have to count on noticing the small "headlamps on" warning lamp.

 

[TomT]

Except for the elcheapo stripper models, most all cars now have automatic headlights so if you just leave them in auto, you can forget about forgetting about it...

Now it's finally gotten dark at evening commute time, I see this a lot across ALL brands of recently produced vehicles. My personal theory is that it's folks with LCD and LED insturment panels not knowing that their lights are not on. Back in the day your instrument panel wouldn't be backlit if your lights weren't on, so you'd know immediately if you needed to turn them on. Nowadays not so much, and if you don't have auto-on or permanently on (daytime running) lights you have to count on noticing the small "headlamps on" warning lamp.

 

[Bob]

We've read a few good answers to this question. But each owner is different and may have a different reason for using or not using headlights at dusk.

Some Leaf owners may think that the headlights waste battery, so they tend to leave them off. In practice, they consume roughly 1% of the energy of the motor, so don't have a noticeable impact on range, but psychologically, it is power so perhaps some drivers don't use them thinking that it helps range.

The Leaf does not have daytime running lights. Other cars do. That will also appear to be a difference.

Bob

 

[apvbguy]

Except for the elcheapo stripper models, most all cars now have automatic headlights so if you just leave them in auto, you can forget about forgetting about it...

my leaf does NOT have auto on headlights, does that qualify it as an elcheapo stripper model?

 

[LeftieBiker]

I see a disturbing number of vehicles after sunset with no lights on, and they are usually models with no LED dash, either. It's one way I judge sentience in other drivers: if you can't see the dash but are driving anyway, you aren't sentient.

 

[Turnover]

Unless I forget for some odd reason, I always drive with my lights on for safety.

The energy usage indicator shows about a 1/4 kW (per hour?) drain between headlights off and high beams. With 1 kWh = about 4 miles, this would amount to about 1 mile loss of range in a hour's worth of running time.

I have standard 2012 lights. Not LEDs.

 

[thom71gt]

Interesting answers. I think the answer of the dash board being lit, regardless of if the lights are on or not is the most logical. I drive the complete opposite of a Leaf. I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee with a HO V-8. 15 MPG. But, I also work from home, so my commute consists of walking into the kitchen, grabbing a cup of coffee and then walking down to the basement to my office. I drive less than 8,000 miles per year and my Jeep is paid for, so I don't really have any reason to get something like a Leaf.

Thanks for the answers.

 

[flyonpa]

I went to Lowes earlier today and counted 12 Leafs, of which only 1 had it's lights on


That was me... I actually Remember to turn them on that time..... Our ICE (Gas) car has running lights, so they are always on so don't have to worry about it.

 

[thom71gt]

I went to Lowes earlier today and counted 12 Leafs, of which only 1 had it's lights on


That was me... I actually Remember to turn them on that time..... Our ICE (Gas) car has running lights, so they are always on so don't have to worry about it.

HA HA. Are you in Cumming?

 

[donald]

It's not the ones you can see with their lights off that are the problem.... if you get my drift....

 

[adric22]

Lots of good answers here. I've never specifically noticed this trend. I do wonder how most Leaf drivers feel about the energy usage of their headlights. I'm pretty knowledgable about the car and so I understand that 12V accessories like headlights, radio, etc. don't use enough power to even really worry about. But I'm not sure if all EV drivers understand that or not. I've certainly had plenty of friends and family mention stuff in conversation that suggests they believe EV drivers have to be conservative on their use of those things - even windshield wipers. So I have to explain to them that it is not the case.

What I usually do, even though it is not 100% accurate, is explain to people that those items run off of a conventional 12V battery just like a regular car and the big battery only powers the wheels and A/C. I just leave it at that without going into the whole DC-DC converter thing.

 

[TomT]

Yep.

my leaf does NOT have auto on headlights, does that qualify it as an elcheapo stripper model?

 

[TomT]

I'll only speak about the LED headlights since that is what my car has... At 10 watts a piece, plus another 10 watts or so for all the other LED lights such as tail, parking, etc. (I changed out all my incandescents for LEDs), I could drive around with them on all the time and measure the difference in range in hundreds of feet... The radio pulls more. So, completely inconsequential.

I do wonder how most Leaf drivers feel about the energy usage of their headlights.

 

[dgpcolorado]

Unless I forget for some odd reason, I always drive with my lights on for safety.

The energy usage indicator shows about a 1/4 kW (per hour?) drain between headlights off and high beams. With 1 kWh = about 4 miles, this would amount to about 1 mile loss of range in a hour's worth of running time.

I have standard 2012 lights. Not LEDs.

2012 LEAFs have LED lights for low beams (and halogen for high beams). I believe that the only LEAFs that don't have LED low beams are the S models (2013 and later).

Regardless, as others have suggested, the electricity usage of the headlights is small. The S model H9 Halogens are 65 watts each. So, one hour of usage would be 130 watt•hours. If you get 4 miles/kWh then that would be a half mile of range for the headlights (plus a bit more for the other lights on the car).

For those of us with LED low beams, it would be substantially less.


So far as the energy display is concerned, the one at the lower right — for such things as lights and accessories — has been reported by Ingineer to be fake: it is not an actual measurement but a canned estimate of usage depending on the devices that are on. (The main driving pie chart and the climate control pie chart are actual measurements of power use.) FWIW.

 

[LeftieBiker]

2012 LEAFs have LED lights for low beams (and halogen for high beams). I believe that the only LEAFs that don't have LED low beams are the S models (2013 and later).

I didn't realize that, and it's welcome news. I use my low beams 90% of the time, and am quite satisfied with them. It's the high beams that suck.

 

[Nubo]

Lots of good answers here. I've never specifically noticed this trend. I do wonder how most Leaf drivers feel about the energy usage of their headlights. I'm pretty knowledgable about the car and so I understand that 12V accessories like headlights, radio, etc. don't use enough power to even really worry about. But I'm not sure if all EV drivers understand that or not…

There are lots of folks who don't understand the magnitudes involved, and express worries that they don't want to be forced into a choice between using the windshield wipers or not making their destination, for example. It's just going to take some time before people get as used to EV concepts as they are to ICE concepts. Then again there are plenty of people with whacky ideas about how ICE vehicles work…

...2012 LEAFs have LED lights for low beams (and halogen for high beams). I believe that the only LEAFs that don't have LED low beams are the S models (2013 and later)….

The LED low-beams are part of an option package on the 2015 SV.

LED Headlights and Quick Charge Port Package [*]
Aerodynamic LED low-beam Headlights
Automatic on/off headlights
Quick Charge Port
Fog Lights
MSRP: $1,630

 

[redLEAF]

Just to add a few points mentioned and not mentioned ... I had some work done on my '12 SL that has the 'auto' lights picked it up well after dark and the lights had been turned manually by the service tech (for probably very valid reasons as he was working on the car) to the off position but of course the dash lights, etc. were on when I 'started' it up -- went through an unlit section of highway and realized they were indeed off and turned them back to 'auto' so that might be an owner issue as well if they turn them manually 'on' and then just turn to 'off' and not 'auto' afterwards. The 'auto' on at dusk seems sensitive enough in most cases at least to me.

Second, at least on my '12 SL, the headlights will automatically turn on after a certain period if the wipers are also on; nice feature BUT, they will also turn them back off once you shut off the wipers (say for very intermittent rain); this complies with many state rules that require headlights on when wipers are being used.

At the very least (again on my '12 SL, would assume it would be the same for all LEAF's); you do get a dash indicator when the lights are on as the mfg. realizes that the instrument cluster is 'always on' when the car is running so you need another way to 'see' that the lights (and also the fogs get there own indicator as well) are indeed turned on.

We're not seeing the volume of LEAF's up this way as in GA but I have seen a few w/o lights on when they probably should --- not just LEAF's though, other makes and models. 3 out of the 4 cars we own have 'auto' lights and the one that doesn't, does not illuminate the dashboard lights when the lights are off so that makes an easy transition to it when driving so you don't forget.

Love the headlights our LEAF came with but only drawback has been that they run so cool that they will not melt snow and ice; a coating of RainX seems to help as well as brushing off any snow -- not an issue most of the time for GA as well but something that's been mentioned here a few times to watch out for ...

 

[JPWhite]

Except for the elcheapo stripper models, most all cars now have automatic headlights so if you just leave them in auto, you can forget about forgetting about it...

That's what I thought too.

Until after getting the Altima serviced my wife drove home from work after dark. Drove off a well lit street into a poorly lit side street. By the time she found the light switch the service personnel had so kindly moved from auto to off she had already run off the road.

New radiator, wheel and tire and it was just fine

I've noticed that the dealer turns all cars from auto to off during the service process, Altima, LEAF, doesn't matter. Not sure why they do it, but they do. First thing I check when picking up a car from the dealer is the light switch.