Official Tesla Model S thread

[evnow]

And FYI, the 85kWh pack is now stated to rated at only 265miles by EPA, e.g. see

LOL.

 

[surfingslovak]

So it begins, ahead of schedule. This video only had 301 views at the time of this posting. I suspect that it will be a few more tomorrow...

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SH1LPS4iKzU[/youtube]

 

[TonyWilliams]

Very inspiring. I hope they make it.

 

[redLEAF]

That still is one beautiful looking car ... regardless if it was an EV or not.

We should all wish them the best including the new owner ... of course the guy is a Tesla board member as well but good to see how much they believe in the company; first delivery to a 'regular' customer reported to occur on June 22nd.

http://www.greencarreports.com/news...livered-to-earliest-depositor-steve-jurvetson

 

[ztanos]

That still is one beautiful looking car ... regardless if it was an EV or not.

We should all wish them the best including the new owner ... of course the guy is a Tesla board member as well but good to see how much they believe in the company; first delivery to a 'regular' customer reported to occur on June 22nd.

http://www.greencarreports.com/news...livered-to-earliest-depositor-steve-jurvetson

I would love this car, but man do I wish it's price tag was a bit cheaper.

 

[palmermd]

I would love this car, but man do I wish it's price tag was a bit cheaper.

I can't tell you how many times I've heard that comment regarding the Leaf. And that is the real reason for the slow launch, and why it will take several years before we see big sales numbers. It is not a ugly car problem, or a DCQC problem, or a range problem as some have been ranting in other threads. It is all about the value proposition. Right now the cost of the battery is too high and it makes the car too expensive to be adopted by the masses. Same problem as cell phones in the 80's and early 90's, but as the cost comes down, you bring in more and more buyers. Right now you only get the truly committed and the rich tinkerers. We basically have a $15k adder to a car in order to make it electric. Take a $20k car and add batteries and it sells for $35k. Tesla has it right. Take a $50k car and sell it for $65. A $15k jump in price at $20k and you've entered another target market (simply different buyers). A $15k jump in price at $50k and you still have the same buyer looking at the $65k car. Same is true for the long range car at $70k jumping to $85k. I think Tesla will sell as many cars as the Leaf for the next few years. As the technology evolves and battery prices come down and the consumers become comfortable with the product (ev's), you'll then see cars like the Leaf start to have sales take off. It is all about VALUE. People don't like to waste their money.

I know I'll get some folks who will then run some numbers to show that the Leaf is cheaper than a Versa if you calculate all the costs over the lifetime of ownership and I've read all those before. That is just not an exercise that most consumers are willing to do. There is a difference between calculated value and perceived value, and perception is the reality, unfortunately. Value in a car is all about the "seat of the pants" feel of the car. Sit in a $15k car versus a $35k car versus a $65k car, and you can feel a difference. That is where the value is. Interestingly the Leaf is not as overvalued as most people think it is prior to driving one.

Back on topic, Way to go Tesla! Great to watch the video of the first delivery. Loved the plate Tesla S1.

 

[GRA]

I would love this car, but man do I wish it's price tag was a bit cheaper.

I can't tell you how many times I've heard that comment regarding the Leaf. And that is the real reason for the slow launch, and why it will take several years before we see big sales numbers. It is not a ugly car problem, or a DCQC problem, or a range problem as some have been ranting in other threads. It is all about the value proposition. Right now the cost of the battery is too high and it makes the car too expensive to be adopted by the masses. Same problem as cell phones in the 80's and early 90's, but as the cost comes down, you bring in more and more buyers. Right now you only get the truly committed and the rich tinkerers. We basically have a $15k adder to a car in order to make it electric. Take a $20k car and add batteries and it sells for $35k. Tesla has it right. Take a $50k car and sell it for $65. A $15k jump in price at $20k and you've entered another target market (simply different buyers). A $15k jump in price at $50k and you still have the same buyer looking at the $65k car. Same is true for the long range car at $70k jumping to $85k. I think Tesla will sell as many cars as the Leaf for the next few years. As the technology evolves and battery prices come down and the consumers become comfortable with the product (ev's), you'll then see cars like the Leaf start to have sales take off. It is all about VALUE. People don't like to waste their money.

I know I'll get some folks who will then run some numbers to show that the Leaf is cheaper than a Versa if you calculate all the costs over the lifetime of ownership and I've read all those before. That is just not an exercise that most consumers are willing to do. There is a difference between calculated value and perceived value, and perception is the reality, unfortunately. Value in a car is all about the "seat of the pants" feel of the car. Sit in a $15k car versus a $35k car versus a $65k car, and you can feel a difference. That is where the value is. Interestingly the Leaf is not as overvalued as most people think it is prior to driving one.

Back on topic, Way to go Tesla! Great to watch the video of the first delivery. Loved the plate Tesla S1.

OT, FWIW, I saw an article in either the WSJ or Financial Times about Tata Group preparing to offer an EV, presumably this one

http://www.tatavistaev.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

for $20k MSRP. They'd have to boost the motor power and top speed for the US market, but a $20k (before subsidies) basic econobox BEV with 26.5kWh might go a considerable distance towards the goal, assuming they can manage it and it meets safety specs.

 

[TomT]

Agreed. I just wish it was smaller since we don't need a car nearly that large... But it IS gorgeous and I might still consider it (or it's smaller brethren) in the future...

That still is one beautiful looking car ... regardless if it was an EV or not.

 

[surfingslovak]

I would love this car, but man do I wish it's price tag was a bit cheaper.

I can't tell you how many times I've heard that comment regarding the Leaf. And that is the real reason for the slow launch, and why it will take several years before we see big sales numbers. Back on topic, Way to go Tesla! Great to watch the video of the first delivery. Loved the plate Tesla S1.

Michael, would it help if the battery was leased? That would come close to the current model, where folks anticipate and budget for a monthly fuel bill. It would also alleviate concerns about battery longevity and warranty. Another idea was an de-contented Leaf S model (no pun intended). The lower price, say $20K after subsidies, would make the Leaf a great commuter vehicle. Especially if Nissan offered an attractive lease. Besides, who really needs a nav system in a commuter car?

That said, the in-official YouTube video has now over 30K views. That was quick. It was picked up by several popular blogs and news sites. That's why I was surprised to see an interesting visitor this morning. Wish they had said something.

 

[garsh]

Another idea was an de-contented Leaf S model (no pun intended). The lower price, say $20K after subsidies, would make the Leaf a great commuter vehicle. Especially if Nissan offered an attractive lease. Besides, who really needs a nav system in a commuter car?

The problem is that all of the cost of producing the leaf is in the batteries. Removing the Nav system isn't going to save Nissan that much money. Nissan included that stuff so that owners feel like they received some amount of luxury for the high price they paid.

 

[surfingslovak]

Removing the Nav system isn't going to save Nissan that much money. Nissan included that stuff so that owners feel like they received some amount of luxury for the high price they paid.

Understood, but didn't GM do the same thing with the Volt? Not everyone wants leather and chrome wheels. You are probably right, and not all that much money can be saved, but if it brought the MSRP down by $2K, perhaps it's worth doing. I could be wrong, but I believe that for a commuter vehicle, you want a sub $20K sticker. I talked to a Toyota dealer last weekend, and he said that the base Prius c trim was sold out in California. MSRP starts at $18.5K.

 

[TomT]

Yep, you could pull out the nav, keyless entry, backup camera, and a few other things and barely save 2,000 dollars at retail... It's not worth it. When you are in the 30K+ range, people expect those kinds of things...

Another idea was an de-contented Leaf S model (no pun intended). The lower price, say $20K after subsidies, would make the Leaf a great commuter vehicle. Especially if Nissan offered an attractive lease. Besides, who really needs a nav system in a commuter car?

The problem is that all of the cost of producing the leaf is in the batteries. Removing the Nav system isn't going to save Nissan that much money. Nissan included that stuff so that owners feel like they received some amount of luxury for the high price they paid.

 

[GRA]

Yep, you could pull out the nav, keyless entry, backup camera, and a few other things and barely save 2,000 dollars at retail... It's not worth it. When you are in the 30K+ range, people expect those kinds of things...

Another idea was an de-contented Leaf S model (no pun intended). The lower price, say $20K after subsidies, would make the Leaf a great commuter vehicle. Especially if Nissan offered an attractive lease. Besides, who really needs a nav system in a commuter car?

The problem is that all of the cost of producing the leaf is in the batteries. Removing the Nav system isn't going to save Nissan that much money. Nissan included that stuff so that owners feel like they received some amount of luxury for the high price they paid.

I think the point is to get it down below the $30k+ range. I'm not sure if that will do it, but that's certainly what they need to do if BEVs are going to make it into the mainstream (along with more range, obviously).

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

Yep, you could pull out the nav, keyless entry, backup camera, and a few other things and barely save 2,000 dollars at retail... It's not worth it. When you are in the 30K+ range, people expect those kinds of things...

If you can't take cost out to bring the price down, how about adding value to get it even more line with what people expect at that price? One word: Leather.

 

[surfingslovak]

One word: Leather.

Oh, leather is coming in the next model year. Nissan team saw some of the custom installation owners have done, and this apparently made sense for them to do. It's coming!

 

[palmermd]

One word: Leather.

Oh, leather is coming in the next model year. Nissan team saw some of the custom installation owners have done, and this apparently made sense for them to do. It's coming!

but it won't come without an additional cost.

I cant wait to get my hands on a Model S. I hope I win the lotto soon. http://www.calottery.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Fridays Jackpot is $22 million.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

After reading these would you buy the stock?
http://seekingalpha.com/article/652881-tesla-model-s-the-mother-of-all-product-launches" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2012/06/08/its-time-to-buy-tesla-motors-.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[evnow]

After reading these would you buy the stock?
http://seekingalpha.com/article/652881-tesla-model-s-the-mother-of-all-product-launches" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2012/06/08/its-time-to-buy-tesla-motors-.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Already have !

But, I wouldn't buy any stock based on fools/seekingalpha articles.

 

[palmermd]

After reading these would you buy the stock?
http://seekingalpha.com/article/652881-tesla-model-s-the-mother-of-all-product-launches" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2012/06/08/its-time-to-buy-tesla-motors-.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Already have !

But, I wouldn't buy any stock based on fools/seekingalpha articles.

me too. bought and then increased position twice more. I also agree that seekingalpha is not a good source for information. fool is better, but certainly not a sole source for investment information.

 

[jkirkebo]

One word: Leather.

Oh, leather is coming in the next model year. Nissan team saw some of the custom installation owners have done, and this apparently made sense for them to do. It's coming!

but it won't come without an additional cost.

No, that would be stupid. Many people don't want leather. Personally I would not like having to pay extra for a cloth interior. Even the Model S has cloth as standard.