new leaf owner with a charging question

[LauraA]

Hi all - I've had my leaf for a couple of weeks. A drive to the airport near me is abut 18 miles. I charged my leaf 100% because I had to take relatives to the airport today, and thought that we might have some other errands. The car said that I had 100 miles available. I drove part of the time on the freeway, but kept my speed at or below 65 MPH. I kept the AC off, except for a short time when my grandson said that his socks were sweaty. Anyway, I got home, and my car had just 45 miles left available. That means that I somehow used up 55 miles going just 36 miles. Does that seem right? I know that more power is used on freeways. My car was a demo, and is a 2011. It has nearly 1000 miles on it. Thanks for any help. My problem is that it seems hard to judge how far I can go. For example, with a full charge, I'd be worried about trying to go even 80 miles. Take care, LauraA

 

[copdoc]

Yes, unfortunately the "miles-left" is most often referred to here as the Guess-o-Meter (GOM.) Some have even covered it up because it is so unreliable. The meter tries to see how many miles you will be able to go if you are driving just like you have been with no change in speed or accelerations or altitudes or climate control or altitude or .....

There's a range chart by Tony Williams which you should print & study based on how fast you're driving. There's also a chart available from surfingslovak based on the "time to charge" shown on the dash which might help, too. Pretty soon you'll have a good feel.

Also, the miles at the top of the charge always disappear faster than the ones in the middle of the state-of-charge, but I have no idea why.

 

[adric22]

Hi all - I've had my leaf for a couple of weeks. A drive to the airport near me is abut 18 miles. I charged my leaf 100% because I had to take relatives to the airport today, and thought that we might have some other errands. The car said that I had 100 miles available. I drove part of the time on the freeway, but kept my speed at or below 65 MPH. I kept the AC off, except for a short time when my grandson said that his socks were sweaty. Anyway, I got home, and my car had just 45 miles left available. That means that I somehow used up 55 miles going just 36 miles. Does that seem right? I know that more power is used on freeways. My car was a demo, and is a 2011. It has nearly 1000 miles on it. Thanks for any help. My problem is that it seems hard to judge how far I can go. For example, with a full charge, I'd be worried about trying to go even 80 miles. Take care, LauraA

The answer is simple.. The 100 mile estimate is based on much slower driving conditions. When you are driving 65 mph in a Leaf, there is no way on earth to get 100 miles range.

The Nissan Dealer was supposed to make you sign a paper which shows realistic driving ranges under different conditions. Did you not see that?

 

[LauraA]

Thanks, I did see and sign the paper at the dealers, and I do understand that highway miles will be less. I just didn't understand how to predict or plan. Most of my driving is around a very small town, and it would take me at least a week to go a hundred miles. On occasion, though, I do have to go to the airport or into Savannah. I'm about 20 miles south of Savannah. Thanks, LauraA

 

[waitingforaleaf]

Well, the EPA range indicates that the Leaf has a 73 mile range. If the majority of your driving is on the freeway at 60-65 mph, then that estimated range is pretty darn spot on in temperate weather. Reduce the range based upon ambient temperature (colder generally lower range), climate control usage (heater actually draws more than A/C on current model Leafs), elevation changes (hills or mountains), and driving habits (both overall speed and how you accelerate/decelerate matter).

As previously mentioned, Tony's range chart works fairly well:
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=4295" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Personally, my general estimate is to calculate each of the twelve battery bars as representative of 6 or 7 miles of range (my mi/kwh average is generally around 4.5, so you can adjust as needed).

 

[Boomer23]

Put a little differently, the 100 miles first shown on the display was never accurate, so you didn't use up 55 miles in 36 miles of driving. Just expect to get 75 miles or so in normal driving that includes a bit of freeway. Expect as few as 60 miles if it's all freeway at more than 65 mph.

 

[smkettner]

Keep in mind there are a few more miles than the GOM actually says. Nothing at all wrong with running it down to near zero as long as the destination has a place to charge. With so few miles driven I think you may just need to get used to it on the longer travels. Nothing is better than arriving with "---" on the indicator

 

[adric22]

Thanks, I did see and sign the paper at the dealers, and I do understand that highway miles will be less. I just didn't understand how to predict or plan. Most of my driving is around a very small town, and it would take me at least a week to go a hundred miles. On occasion, though, I do have to go to the airport or into Savannah. I'm about 20 miles south of Savannah. Thanks, LauraA

You'll get used to it. After you drive it for a few months you'll know where you can and where you can't go and won't have to even think about it.

 

[DesertDenizen]

Keep in mind there are a few more miles than the GOM actually says. Nothing at all wrong with running it down to near zero as long as the destination has a place to charge. With so few miles driven I think you may just need to get used to it on the longer travels. Nothing is better than arriving with "---" on the indicator

Nothing better than arriving with "---"? Hell, I would be doing my yoga breathing and then head to a bar.

 

[copdoc]

Keep in mind there are a few more miles than the GOM actually says. Nothing at all wrong with running it down to near zero as long as the destination has a place to charge. With so few miles driven I think you may just need to get used to it on the longer travels. Nothing is better than arriving with "---" on the indicator

Nothing better than arriving with "---"? Hell, I would be doing my yoga breathing and then head to a bar.

nice!!!!!

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

sounds like everything is working just fine. I've seen 101 at 80%, LOL!

if you ever really need to squeeze out maximum range, you need to learn how to drive very consistently. This usually involved staying out of the left lane and tending more to be in the right. there are several tools that, while are not perfect, can be of use if you spend the time to master them. a few tips I've found useful:

-moisture management: EV's have a tendency to accumulate moisture from our breath and condensation, causing the windows to fog and increasing reliance on the energy hungry climate control. to avoid constant fogging, occasionally you may need to dry it out. to dry out the car, if you are in a whet, cold climate, start with an 80% charge, start the prewarming, after about a half hour open all the doors, let the moisture out. do this several times until no moisture forms on the inside of the windows.
-learn to use the breaks minimally and maximize regen.
-use the tools the car comes with:
1. power meter: stick to 2-3 bubbles of acceleration, allowing you to speed up going down hill and requiring slow up hill (I drive between 50 and 70 miles an hour this way, averaging around 55-60 on the straight aways.)
2. toggle the screen on the dash to show MPkW's and shoot for the mid 4's (best I can do in winter is 4.1, summer 4.5 with some hills)
3. use the trip odometer. clear it at the beginning of a long trip.
4. use nav or mapquest or a map to determine the actual distance you need to drive and keep that in your mind, plus a little wiggle room, as your target.
5. use the GOM/remaining miles as an indicator of how your most recent driving has effected your projected range and adjust your driving technique as needed. Know that in the beginning the number on the dash will fluctuate wildly and become more accurate toward the bottom of the charge (where it is projecting recent driving habits over a shorter distance). try to keep your trip odometer miles plus the GOM adding up to your final destination target. remember, you can trust the GOM number more as you approach zero and that there is some cushion, but not much, below zero.
-Check out Tony's driving chart for a general idea of what is doable at a given temp/speed.
-As for climate control, cooling isn't so much of a drain, but if you need to conserve in colder whether you need to minimize the use of the heater while driving. using the prewarming function is very important in cold whether. to conserve the heat generated from prewarming you need to set the mode to foot/defog and have climate control off. if you have the heated seats and steering wheel then rely as much as possible on them, they make a big difference in comfort for how little range they eat up.

 

[mkjayakumar]

Judging from Laura's driving needs of mostly within town and occasional driving longer distance, this would be a great car

 

[SierraQ]

I'm repeating some of what has been said already but with some numbers based on my driving of mixed freeway and city.

Here is a condensed summary:
Max: 80 miles (100% charge)
A/C: 75 (-5 miles)
Heat: 65 (-15 miles; 40 degree day)
Low Battery Warning (LBW): 10
Very Low Battery Warning (VLBW): 5
(Tip: Reset trip at LBW and start counting.)

The Guessometer tends to be about 15-20 miles inflated initially; more accurate as the battery drains.

I find the MPK meter on your dash to be the best tool. This helps you gauge your driving and hence your range. See Tony's chart for the rough conversion factor at the top (e.g. 3.2 = 82 miles). As adric22 said you will eventually just know. Took me about two months to stop thinking about it.

 

[LauraA]

Thanks everyone for all of the helpful advice! I have printed out the range chart, and that, and the other comments, are a great help. As I said, I've just had the Leaf for a couple of weeks, and most of my driving is around my small town. So far, I've driven on the freeway twice. This is my only car, and I plan to rent a car from the Nissan dealer for any trips that I may take by car. I think that I'm the perfect person for this car! I'm retired, so no commute to work. I'm a "grandma driver" so I'm usually in the right lane going slower than many other drivers. I live south of Savannah, so we have no hills, very little cold weather, and nobody seems to be in much of a rush. I would predict that my only freeway driving will be occasional airport trips, and very occasional trips to downtown Savannah (Historic District), I'm very close to what is called Southside Savannah where malls and stores are located, and I don't use freeway to get to that area.
On typical days, I probably will be driving only 5 or 10 miles. This brings up another question. If I've only driven a few miles, should I not plug in at all, and just keep using the car until the power is low? I usually charge to 80%, unless I know that I'm going to the airport or downtown, and on those rare occasions I'll charge to 100%. Take care, LauraA

 

[TonyWilliams]

If I've only driven a few miles, should I not plug in at all, and just keep using the car until the power is low? I usually charge to 80%, unless I know that I'm going to the airport or downtown, and on those rare occasions I'll charge to 100%. Take care, LauraA

I don't really see any reason not to plug in. The first time you really want to take a surprise longer trip, it just won't be ready. If you need that extra charge from 80% to 100%, you already know that just takes a bit over an hour. But, if the battery is at 40%, that would be a real pain in the posterior waiting for a charge to 80% or 100%.

Hope you liked the range chart.

Tony

 

[LauraA]

Thanks, Tony, and your chart is so helpful. I never would have understood without it! My nephew, also a Leaf owner, had suggested that it may be good for the battery to let it get pretty low. I think that I could sometimes go for weeks and keep it at around 60 to 70% charged in my small town. Is this ok? Thanks, LauraA

 

[abasile]

Thanks, Tony, and your chart is so helpful. I never would have understood without it! My nephew, also a Leaf owner, had suggested that it may be good for the battery to let it get pretty low. I think that I could sometimes go for weeks and keep it at around 60 to 70% charged in my small town. Is this ok? Thanks, LauraA

Yes, that is definitely okay. Because I live on a high mountain, I usually try to manually stop charging at about 65% everyday. Doing so improves regenerative braking on long descents and is slightly better for the battery. When you are not using the car, the optimal state of charge for battery longevity is probably around 40% or 50% (four or five bars of charge). That said, you will almost certainly be more than fine even if you don't baby the battery like some of us EV geeks. Just charge to 80% whenever it's convenient, enjoy using the car, and don't worry about it too much.

 

[mkjayakumar]

It is my experience that AC does not have a lot of impact on the range. Maybe around 7 to 8 miles over 100% charge.

 

[LauraA]

I don't use too much AC, except maybe in August. When I have passengers, though, especially in the back seat, then they will want it on. This car is so wonderful! Take care, LauraA

 

[garygid]

The Heating can use a lot of energy, but the Cooling (A/C) uses fairly little.

In your situation, with plenty of charge to spare, use the A/C to be comfortable in the car. I have it on (fairly low fan) almost all the time, just for the extra "creature" comfort.

This battery is NOT the type that needs to be (almost) fully discharged occasionally, so do not try to do that. However, the LEAF does a pretty good job of protecting the battery Pack. Your job is just to not "run out of gas" (well, not gas, but e-fuel).

On a typical new LEAF, the Low Battery Warning (LBW) occurs near the bottom of the last Fuel-Gauge Bar, and a Very LBW (the VLBW) occurs later, after all the "fuel" Bars are gone. See these "features" on Tony's chart, and you will gradually feel confident just charging to 80%, and driving further. Now, I will "easily" go 74 miles Round Trip (RT, 37 each way), but have not yet had the courage to attempt 45 miles each way (90 RT). However, I have been from 100% down to VLBW once, and LBW a couple of times. Basically, at my current body comfort/discomfort levels, I want to PLAN to be home by LBW, and BE home before VLBW.

Usually, I drive less than 50 miles, so I can start at 80% and still have "no worries". Often, heading "out", I will drive more conservatively (a bit slower), but heading "back to the barn", I might drive noticably faster when I realize that I will have e-fuel to spare.

Others use away-from-home charging (usually L2) frequently, and often manage much longer trips.