How Green Are Electric Cars? Depends on Where You Plug In

[surfingslovak]

Now where is that press release regarding lithium-air batteries?

OK, here we go. It it's been slightly delayed

IBM's planning an end to range anxiety with an EV power pack that runs on air and travels 500 miles on a single charge. "Lithium Air" batteries draw oxygen into a nano-structured carbon cathode, where it is stored and reacts with lithium ions and electrons to generate electricity. When you plug the vehicle in, the unmolested oxygen is released back into the air as if it was breathing.

http://engt.co/HWxkfX" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[TomT]

That what I want powering my 2030 model! :lol:

Now where is that press release regarding lithium-air batteries?

OK, here we go. It it's been slightly delayed

IBM's planning an end to range anxiety with an EV power pack that runs on air and travels 500 miles on a single charge. "Lithium Air" batteries draw oxygen into a nano-structured carbon cathode, where it is stored and reacts with lithium ions and electrons to generate electricity. When you plug the vehicle in, the unmolested oxygen is released back into the air as if it was breathing.

http://engt.co/HWxkfX" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[DaveEV]

Now where is that press release regarding lithium-air batteries?

OK, here we go. It it's been slightly delayed

IBM's planning an end to range anxiety with an EV power pack that runs on air and travels 500 miles on a single charge. "Lithium Air" batteries draw oxygen into a nano-structured carbon cathode, where it is stored and reacts with lithium ions and electrons to generate electricity. When you plug the vehicle in, the unmolested oxygen is released back into the air as if it was breathing.

http://engt.co/HWxkfX" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Should be ready ~20 years from now...

IBM has enlisted the help of chemical giants Asahi Kasei and Central Glass to turn it from successful experiment to fully-fledged product by 2030.

Good that they're working on it, but we need solutions much quicker than that.

 

[surfingslovak]

Good that they're working on it, but we need solutions much quicker than that.

Dr. Wilcke, one of the managers of the project, attended our local EV meetup last Saturday. Although what their lab is doing is reminiscent of basic research, they are reportedly seeing very encouraging results. Obviously, we are still a long way from seeing this in the showrooms, but with little luck some significant improvement (Envia would come to mind) will be commercialized within the next decade. Doubling, and possibly tripling, the range through better battery tech, and improved vehicle efficiency should be a fairly realistic short-term target for the EV community.

http://ibm.co/liairibm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Recognizing this, IBM started the Battery 500 project in 2009 to develop a new type of lithium-air battery technology that is expected to improve energy density tenfold, dramatically increasing the amount of energy these batteries can generate and store. Today, IBM researchers have successfully demonstrated the fundamental chemistry of the charge-and-recharge process for lithium-air batteries. In 2012, industry leaders Central Glass and Asahi Kasei joined the project. Each brings a history of electric vehicle materials innovation to help IBM put research on the road.

 

[DavidThi808]

I think they missed several points in favor of EVs. First is that Colorado is converting from coal to natural gas and when it does, every EV will then have its CO2 footprint drop in half. Plus we stop funding terrorism via oil purchases, reduce what we spend on transportation today, and more. I wrote this up on my blog at http://blogs.windward.net/davidt/2012/04/21/electric-vehicles-are-the-equivalent-of-a-34mpg-gas-powered-car-do-they-have-a-future/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

thanks - dave

 

[thankyouOB]

greenhouse gas emissions are not the only concern.
there are also all the pollutants produced by autos and refineries.
it is far easier to control pollution at stationary sources such as power plants and refineries than with vehicles, including the ships, trucks and trains that deliver the coal or crude that makes the power and the trucks that deliver the gasoline to the gas station.

GHG is very important, but smog and other AQ pollutants are also a key reason we must promote cleaner cars and EVs.

 

[cwerdna]

Not sure if this has been posted yet, but I stumbled across http://www1.eere.energy.gov/vehiclesandfuels/facts/2012_fotw737.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (titled Upstream Emissions for Nissan Leaf) today.

 

[RegGuheert]

Not sure if this has been posted yet, but I stumbled across http://www1.eere.energy.gov/vehiclesandfuels/facts/2012_fotw737.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (titled Upstream Emissions for Nissan Leaf) today.

Good find! Thanks!

Does anyone know how where a Toyota Prius would fit on that graph?

 

[cwerdna]

Not sure if this has been posted yet, but I stumbled across http://www1.eere.energy.gov/vehiclesandfuels/facts/2012_fotw737.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (titled Upstream Emissions for Nissan Leaf) today.

Good find! Thanks!

Does anyone know how where a Toyota Prius would fit on that graph?

From http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?action=sbs&id=31767&#tab2" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;, for a '12 Prius under Energy and Environment, it says 178 grams from tailipe and 44 from upstream = 222 grams/mile.

The page does say:

For model years 2012 and earlier, tailpipe CO2 is estimated using an EPA emissions factor and does not reflect direct test results.

 

[copdoc]

My son came home from high school last week and said that they had had a Green advocate come to the school to tell them how to help. My son asked the advocate whether driving an EV would help and she said No! Apparently the school system let someone in who honestly told the class that EVs were worse than ICE cars. I could not believe it. This is the attitude we're going to have to surmount. And unfortunately she's in the school system with the next generation and we're not.

 

[RegGuheert]

My son asked the advocate whether driving an EV would help and she said No!

I've just added that to our long list of reasons to homeschool!

 

[KJD]

My son came home from high school last week and said that they had had a Green advocate come to the school to tell them how to help. My son asked the advocate whether driving an EV would help and she said No! Apparently the school system let someone in who honestly told the class that EVs were worse than ICE cars. I could not believe it. This is the attitude we're going to have to surmount. And unfortunately she's in the school system with the next generation and we're not.

You could always contact the teacher and volunteer to talk to the class about your EV experience.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

had a 9.8 kW solar array installed last week, meter was running backwards, plugged the car in and it still ran backwards... you just can't plug a gas car in to solar, period, end of debate, IMHO.

 

[cwerdna]

^^^
Yep, and as another friend put it, you can't power a a gasoline car via moving/falling water either.