getting permission to use parking lot 120 volt sockets

[jlsoaz]

Has anyone had luck in identifying some compromises for being allowed to plug in at conventional sockets at public parking lots?

Examples:

1) I am working in a downtown and paying for parking at a city lot. I have access to a Blink station there, but it costs a lot per hour and so requires me to take a break or two to make sure the car is only plugged in and parked at the Blink spot as long as it needs to be. However, the lot managers gave a definite "no" to charging at a conventional socket. Over time I may identify a private lot with somewhat different terms, but am just mentioning this as an example. Maybe there is a compromise I could recommend to them, whether it is hardware or practices or signage, that has worked in other cities without undue liabilities or that sort of thing?

2) At Tucson airport, they have spent I think 6 or 7 figures on solar, but $0 on charge stations. I had 0 success in getting them to make a 120 Volt plug available. Finally I found a couple of private lots quite willing to do this and already at least one of the lots was doing it for a Volt and perhaps other cars that park there regularly. They were open-minded and willing to talk and by supplying even a couple of more sockets, and listening to EV drivers and being willing to work with us, they have won my business for the foreseeable future. So, it may count as a small victory to some, but at least that problem got partially solved, for long term parking (a Tesla with a larger battery would require several days to charge, and so it's still not adequate for a short trip for them, but it's a start I guess).

Anyway, wondering what others might have run into on this score.

 

[LeftieBiker]

There are two issues, one of which is real and one not. The real one is that you need a circuit with 15 amps available to safely charge for long periods (and 12+ amps for short ones), and if the outlet is worn there can be a fire from the loose contacts. The issue that usually arises, though - the false one - is that the owners of the outlet think they will lose a fortune to you in free electricity. You can offer to pay them 120% of actual cost and show them the math, but that rarely works.

 

[desiv]

I would think that any parking area that provides a Blink charger feels they've already provided you something and it's metered and handled by someone else.
They are done, no hassle for them...
Well, until the Blink keeps failing, but even then they just say "Call Blink."

desiv

 

[Sondy132001]

Instead of you trying to sell a product, why don't you have them sell it for you:

http://www.nrgevgo.com/request-charging-station/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Also my only complaint is my parking structure doesn't have a charging station, they said in January 2016 we can "expect" one. The parking structure behind ours does, EV Connect, so I go there, first time it cost me $3.95 to charge, but $15.00 to get out of the bloody structure, well I said I won't do that again, well I had to and this last time last week it cost me $5.95 to charge and $28.00 to get out of the structure, F%^& them I will never go back, I'll limp to South Coast Plaza and use there's and not pay a parking structure company.

 

[LeftieBiker]

Off-topic, but has anyone thought about coming up with a portable L-1 solar charging station? Not so much for individual EV drivers, although that could maybe work, but to set up in parking lots that either have no infrastructure or unwilling management. They could come in sizes to charge up to a few EVs at 120 volts and at least 6 amps...

 

[Randy]

Off-topic, but has anyone thought about coming up with a portable L-1 solar charging station? Not so much for individual EV drivers, although that could maybe work, but to set up in parking lots that either have no infrastructure or unwilling management. They could come in sizes to charge up to a few EVs at 120 volts and at least 6 amps...

Yeah, it's called the EV-ARC...

http://envisionsolar.com/ev-arc/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[ishiyakazuo]

Off-topic, but has anyone thought about coming up with a portable L-1 solar charging station? Not so much for individual EV drivers, although that could maybe work, but to set up in parking lots that either have no infrastructure or unwilling management. They could come in sizes to charge up to a few EVs at 120 volts and at least 6 amps...

Yeah, it's called the EV-ARC...

http://envisionsolar.com/ev-arc/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That thing is sweet! Any idea what it costs?

 

[Slow1]

Off-topic, but has anyone thought about coming up with a portable L-1 solar charging station? Not so much for individual EV drivers, although that could maybe work, but to set up in parking lots that either have no infrastructure or unwilling management. They could come in sizes to charge up to a few EVs at 120 volts and at least 6 amps...

Yeah, it's called the EV-ARC...

http://envisionsolar.com/ev-arc/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That thing is sweet! Any idea what it costs?

My question too - just doing some mental calculations I expect it is WAY over my budget and would have to be VERY well utilized to have any reasonable payback time. It has a 20kWh battery in it (big cost, how long until it requires replacement?) as well as panels with active tracking (maintenance risk).

The appeal of a self-contained turn-key system is very strong though. Just drive it to the site, unload it and instant charging station. I wonder if a business model (eventually) could be made to provide these to different locations (share between sporting event venues and whatnot?)... All comes down to cost to provide and how much the drivers would be willing to pay for the use. Perhaps it could be a solution for those who live in apartments and can't get infrastructure installed - if they have a reserved parking space in the sun they could 'park' this there and have charging when they get home (off the batteries).

Too bad we don't have transformer technology shown in the comic books (think Iron Man's suit) as then one could have this in a trailer and 'fold out' when needed... then again we are rather constrained by the laws of physics, heh.

 

[LeftieBiker]

Nice, but I was picturing a unit that came folded up, could be transported in a small van or something like a Soul EV, or pulled in a small cargo trailer. That would limit output, but L-1 should be possible with at least 6 amps. This would be for use in all-day-charging situations, obviously.

 

[Slow1]

So being the ever curious one that I am I contacted the company - reply on the cost:

The average price for an ARC is $47,000, which does not include the 30% federal tax credit. To lease an ARC depending on the order number costs around $650-$700 a month which can be financed through Wells Fargo.

A bit expensive - Assuming full 16kWh/day and $700/mo lease it would come to about $1.46/kWh.

Given that it is off grid and includes all the hardware that isn't terrible. Certainly not (IMO) going to be a cost savings everywhere, but cost of infrastructure improvements required to install L2 in some areas might offset the cost quite a bit and I'm sure the case can be made for other benefits too. Still, I don't expect to see these pop up in my neighborhood anytime soon

 

[EVDRIVER]

So being the ever curious one that I am I contacted the company - reply on the cost:

The average price for an ARC is $47,000, which does not include the 30% federal tax credit. To lease an ARC depending on the order number costs around $650-$700 a month which can be financed through Wells Fargo.

A bit expensive - Assuming full 16kWh/day and $700/mo lease it would come to about $1.46/kWh.

Given that it is off grid and includes all the hardware that isn't terrible. Certainly not (IMO) going to be a cost savings everywhere, but cost of infrastructure improvements required to install L2 in some areas might offset the cost quite a bit and I'm sure the case can be made for other benefits too. Still, I don't expect to see these pop up in my neighborhood anytime soon

I used one the other day, it charged for 5 min and died and would not come back on. I'm not sure how these can keep up with partial charging more than a couple PHEV cars a day based on their small production.

 

[Slow1]

I used one the other day, it charged for 5 min and died and would not come back on. I'm not sure how these can keep up with partial charging more than a couple PHEV cars a day based on their small production.

Yes, I agree. With a nominal 16kWh/day production and 22kWh battery, it is about right for a single Leaf to use and the full day's production would be gone in less than 4 hours. So a 'shared' site would be out of service the majority of the time and thus offer very little real value to the public. Nice to have covered parking I suppose. Seems that IF I were a facilities manager desiring to make this a real solution, I'd want to triple or quadruple the PV capacity.

 

[desiv]

With a nominal 16kWh/day production and 22kWh battery, it is about right for a single Leaf to use and the full day's production would be gone in less than 4 hours. So a 'shared' site would be out of service the majority of the time and thus offer very little real value to the public..

Of course, that's assuming that most Leafs would show up mostly empty.
If we think that most often people just need a few kWh, then it should handle several of those...

I'd be a terrible user if they put one where I work, because I roll into work around LBW every day.
But I don't think I'm the standard here..

desiv

 

[Slow1]

With a nominal 16kWh/day production and 22kWh battery, it is about right for a single Leaf to use and the full day's production would be gone in less than 4 hours. So a 'shared' site would be out of service the majority of the time and thus offer very little real value to the public..

Of course, that's assuming that most Leafs would show up mostly empty.
If we think that most often people just need a few kWh, then it should handle several of those...

True enough - but keep in mind that in any case you get less than 4 hours of charge time. So, assume a site has 10 hours of 'potential' use (yeah, could say 24, but in a work site most will be less). So, that means you can be actively charging for up to 4 of those 10 hours (40% of the time) whether one vehicle for 4 hrs, or 4 for 1 hour or... slice how you like. Bottom line is it will be non-useful for the remaining 60% of the time.

My point of view is that a shared/public charging station should have higher availability than that - I certainly wouldn't want to rely on being one of the first 4 hrs of charge time at my work charging station if I needed it to get home again.

Now, drop this nifty station in my driveway and I could see it fully meeting my needs 99+% of the time, especially with the battery in it is a reserve (meaning a 'peak' day if sunny could provide 16kWh solar + 22kWh battery for a total of 38kWh which is two full charges for me). That is the basis of my "single Leaf use" statement.

I'd be a terrible user if they put one where I work, because I roll into work around LBW every day.
But I don't think I'm the standard here..

I commend you on fully utilizing your vehicle No point in carrying around the battery power if you don't use it IMO. Now if you are just doing that for "free" power... then I commend your frugal nature.