evme said:
Thanks everyone for chiming in.
I should give a little more info on my driving habits and what I need for the car I'm looking to purchase.
I average about 4,000 miles driven per year, or about 11 miles a day. I very rarely travel more than 25 miles in a single day, so it seems even with significant capacity loss (6+ bars) my needs would still be met. I do need to have the A/C on a lot in the summer so please keep that in mind.
Also, for that reason I have been focusing on MY 2012 as I read that in MY 2013 Nissan changed the heat pump which resulted in more efficient heating but less efficient A/C. Is this correct? Since I live in Southern Arizona, the A/C efficiency is much more important than heating efficiency.
One more thing: I own a carport that is covered but does have exposure to the sun for maybe 3 hours a day in the summer months (4-7 p.m.). I understand that leaving batteries in the sun/heat is very bad for them. I could potentially enclose the carport and make it into a garage (or put up solar shades -- very common around here) to protect the batteries.
Hi - a few other thoughts from my side:
- good point about your parking spots, Yes, I would try to add that shading capability to account for the 3 hours in the summer. A point was made about ambient heat (regardless of sun) and this point was also valid. Typically I found that my Tucson-area Leaf would gain a bar or two in the battery temperature gauge during the summer, as a baseline, and then during particularly hot days go higher than that, but even when parked at night and cooling down in a garage, it would spend most of the summer (I think it was about 7 bars during the summer, maybe 5 during the winter?). Anyway, yes, a good idea to keep the sun off the car during those hours. Also, if you're doing that little driving per day, then it is plausible that you could simply charge at 120 Volts every day without having to worry about installing an L2. I was never sure if charging at L2 really affected battery life that much. I did some of both.
- Your scoping seems sound to make yourself aware generally speaking that buying an older 2011-2012 Leaf in the hotter climates is something that should be done with caution (although I'm told sometimes the used cars can be shifted to different parts of the country)
- I wasn't aware that the heat pump was less efficient for the A/C in 2013 and beyond, but in my 2012 SL, I found in driving in Tucson area that definitely the inefficiency of the heater was a problem (the A/C indeed was relatively efficient and generally I did not hesitate to use it on shorter trips). Later in driving the car, it was pointed out to me that the heated seats (I don't know if they are on all models) turned out to be quite a good compromise ... up to that point, the inefficiency of the heater and the coldness of some of the winter nights did add up to some unpleasant unheated rides.
- I sort of like the suggestion of getting a 2012 instead of a 2011 to have a better shot at a new battery under warranty. However, there's no guarantee. You may well end up stuck with a car in a few years that is worth only $1k-$2k and is at 7 or 8 bars. You should just be aware of that.
- I went out of my way to get an SL largely because of the CHAdeMO port, and I personally liked that.
- be aware that you want to leave a buffer when you drive so you don't h ave to white-knuckle it to and from the next charge. I was always very careful about this (never stranded due to battery, once needed a tow due to a flat tire), but it's something to take into account. Be aware that the # of miles when the battery is full at 100% is an estimate that takes into account how the car was recently driven as well as reflecting the capacity of the battery.
- with all that said, although I do think you are right to do this scoping work and get various information points and advice, including different points of view, at the end of the day I got some advice cumulatively over time that helped me a bit to enjoy my Leaf a bit more, when I had it, and it was roughly that it isn't really a fragile thing, they put a lot of thought into designing it to stand up to a certain amount of consumer handling, and that it's ok to just go ahead and drive it and enjoy it and not fret over-much about all of the little things, and occasionally to fracture some of the advice that they originally came out with (although I tended to follow it for all 39 months of the lease, such as charging only to 80 as much as possible).
On price, it appears they can be had used under $7k at this point in some areas:
https://www.cars.com/for-sale/searchresults.action/?mkId=20077&mdId=35968&stkTypId=28881&sf1Nm=price&sf1Dir=ASC&sf2Nm=miles&sf2Dir=ASC&prMn=0&prMx=20000&kwm=ANY&page=1&perPage=50&zc=85648&rd=100000&searchSource=GN_BREADCRUMB
I personally would be careful to take this particular geographic area into account in trying to understand whether you are being offered a good deal for the money. (i.e.: a used Leaf for sale in Tucson or Phoenix is something that, to me, is something I would be a bit more wary of than a used Leaf in a colder or more temperate environment). I wouldn't know how to verify where a used Leaf actually spent its prior years. Perhaps Carfax and run the VIN.
I did find the Tucson dealer I worked with to be professional, but generally I think perhaps a bit typical in terms of dealer pricing on used vehicles. That is, I would not be likely to buy a used vehicle from them, only because of the pricing.
If you do a bit of networking and are willing to have a bit of an adventure, you can perhaps get a line on a well-priced used Leaf either through private channels or perhaps in Phoenix. However, Phoenix is a temptation that maybe should be avoided since, if the vehicle really spent all its time there, then there is an increased risk the battery really will be in even rougher shape. Of course, if you decide you want to take the risk of gaming the battery warranty calculation, or if you don't care that much, then it's ok, I'm just saying. I have personally told people over the years, as it became apparent that Arizona climate was harsh on pre-Lizard Leaf batteries, that I would avoid or be careful about buying a used early Leaf that I knew or suspected was used in Arizona unless there was some angle, such as the price being very (very) low or the driving distance needs being very low (mine are the opposite of yours, the Leaf was always inadequate for my needs, and my next PEV will possibly be a low-priced used PHEV).
To the side I'd say that I'm working on a hypothesis that a low-priced used Arizona Leaf or other BEV with severly limited range might be a good compromise for a teenager situation where they need to be encouraged to drive very moderately and carefully for short distance trips.
In the end, please just be careful to know what you are getting into if you buy a 2011-2012 Leaf that has spent its formative years in Arizona. Particularly if you do get one that is verified to have spent the time in Phoenix (which is indeed a bit hotter than some other areas) you run the risk of getting one that really has a battery that is in rough shape. I would be careful and think through the different battery warranty what-if scenarios. Indeed, your driving habits do sound perfect for a used Leaf, even one that has spent its early years in Arizona, so it's just a matter of taking the calculated risk once you've found one that seems about the right price.
PS:
If you want, it's possible the Tucson EV association could lend you their OBDII gauge (one of Greg Hansen's, I donated it to TEVA.... it has the advantage of being hard-wired so there is no cell phone or wifi setup necessary) and this would allow you to take some quick readings on aH and such if you're going to see a nearby Leaf and want to know more about the battery than the number of bars).
PPS: as mentioned, I've always found this link generally helpful, in terms of overall perspective on number of bars, year of car, miles, aH expectations and location:
http://www.pluginamerica.org/surveys/batteries/leaf/vehicles.php?order=bars
