EVSE relay

[westom]

Does a hand pulled disconnect device provide any protection from the "20,000 joules" as previously reported as the average lghtning strike?

Most unreliable protection is a human. He is not there most of the time (asleep, gone, unaware, too busy disconnecting everything else, etc). He only knows of a surge usually after it has happened. And lightning is only a 'more commonly understood' surge. Other destructive sources also exist. Disconnecting is a least reliable solution.

Humans must predict that a surge will happen in the future. It almost never happens. If an EVSE needs protection, then so does everything in the house. How often are the air conditioner, all clocks, dishwasher, light bulbs, smoke detector, etc disconnected to protect them?

A superior solution costs about $1 per protected appliance. Why consider other lesser solutions - especially one dependent on a human predicting what will happen in the future? One reason is discussed often. Those most easily scammed let their eyes glaze over with each number ... as demonstrated by 20,000 joules.

 

[Linza]

I think Rexki means when (s)he leaves the house. Not sure the numbers on how much it would take to arc a specific distance, but disconnected is always safer than connected. There's really no reason to leave the equipment connected when you're not actively charging, anyway.


I have always wondered why rebar isn't built to come out of the foundation and then driven directly into the earth. I did not know about concrete's conductivity. That's new. It may be why, after lightning strikes near the Alley Theatre in Houston, the sound system always buzzes. I bet the audio ground wires and the building itself are earthed too close together.

 

[westom]

There's really no reason to leave the equipment connected when you're not actively charging, anyway.

So everyone should disconnect the refrigerator, air conditioner, all clocks, a fire alarm system, all kitchen and bathroom GFCIs, all TVs (including disconnecting all cable boxes), and all telephone equipment?

Or one properly earths a 'whole house' protector for equivalent protection.

How does (s)he disconnect the dishwasher? Never recharge any phones, electronics, of the Leaf when asleep? If anything needs that protection, then everything needs that protection. What protects dimmer switches and in-wall wires?

 

[rexki]

There's really no reason to leave the equipment connected when you're not actively charging, anyway.

So everyone should disconnect the refrigerator, air conditioner, all clocks, a fire alarm system, all kitchen and bathroom GFCIs, all TVs (including disconnecting all cable boxes), and all telephone equipment?

Or one properly earths a 'whole house' protector for equivalent protection.

How does (s)he disconnect the dishwasher? Never recharge any phones, electronics, of the Leaf when asleep? If anything needs that protection, then everything needs that protection. What protects dimmer switches and in-wall wires?

You are not alone in "America's Energy Awareness Level". I too was in your shoes, totally oblivious to what I was spending on electricity a month, really did not care, pre 2001 America was flying like a bullet proof kite with strong winds forecast forever supplied by our fortitude, will, technology, and military strength.

Answer(s):
1. Dishwasher (standby is 30 watts), a hard wired wall 3 position switch that shuts the power to the dishwasher, microwave (standby is 25 watts), and garage (standby 80 watts). Annual savings (135 watts) about $153.
2. small electronics like charges are shut down with a smart power strip - annual savings maybe $15-20
3. Leaf does charge at night from 2-4:30am with a Real time price cost that gets at lows as $0 and peaks at 0.10 kwh - Distribution and transmission and taxes comes to .07 per kwh before energy supply charges. Turned off in the morning on departure with Leaf - standby load on charger is approx 5 watts. Annual savings $4.56

Annual savings from 1 switch and a shutoff are: 153+15+4.56 = $173 This was just one area of focus i learned after going to real time price. Yes electricity changes in price every minute and it can change dramatically in 1 hour from 10 cents to 1.20 per kwh.

Not everything needs protection, protection from what I am not sure, direct lightning hits - good luck with that, previous poster has a $1 per device cost for that?? Per day, per week, per month, per year, per lifetime - single dollar not sure.

 

[westom]

Not everything needs protection, protection from what I am not sure, direct lightning hits - good luck with that, ...

A direct strike to wires far down the street is a direct strike incoming to every appliance. Everything needs protection or nothing needs protection. Numbers were provided. Risk is typically one event every seven years. A number that can vary significantly even in the same town. A number better defined by decades of neighborhood history. That number determines if everything needs protection.

Direct lightning strikes without damage is routine. So routine that damage is considered a human mistake (such as using power strips as protectors). Other surges include linemen erorrs, stray cars, squirrels and other rodents, switching transients, and falling wires. That is $1 per protected appliance - obviously a one time expense for everything including an EVSE.

Any recharging vehicle without a proven 'whole house' solution is a completely unnecessary gamble.

 

[QueenBee]

I've had to do it in the past at facilities. And one must way the cost against the possible damage and subsequent consequences, and the likelihood of strikes based on the area of concern... It also depends on what level of protection you are willing to accept...

A potentially destructive surge may occur maybe once every seven years. One can earth a 'whole house' protector for about $1 per protected appliance. Second, one can spend tens or 100 times more money for a plug-in protector that does not claim to protect from that type (destructive) surge. Can sometimes can make damage easier. And in rare cases, causes a house fire. Or, third, one can do what is found in most homes to have protection from all but that destructive surge - do nothing.

Link to this $1 per protected appliance protector that you keep mentioning?

 

[westom]

Link to this $1 per protected appliance protector that you keep mentioning?

The solution is a comodity; a proven solution understood and proven over 100 years ago. This commodity was defined by:

Or one properly earths a 'whole house' protector for equivalent protection.

Of course, no protector does protection. For example, best protection on incoming cable is a hardwire connect low impedaance (ie 'less than 3 meters') to single point earth ground. Earth ground harmlessly absorbs hundreds of thousands of joules. That hardwire is only a connecting device.

Other incoming wires (ie telephone, AC electric) cannot be hardwired to earth. So a 'whole house' protector does what a hardwire would do better: make a low impedance (ie no sharp bends) connection to what does protection - earth ground.

Companies of integirty provide this proven solution including Siemens, Polyphaser (an industry benchmark), General Electric, Syscom, Intermatic, Leviton, Ditek, Square D, and ABB. A Cutler-Hammer solution sells in both Lowes and Home Depot.

But again, promoting a protector as protection means knowledge from advertising; not from science. Protectors are only connecting devices to what does protection. Plug-in protectors have no low impedance earth connection. Are recommended by the many who never learned science, who believe advertising, and who do not demand numbers.

More numbers. A direct lightning strike can be 20,000 amps. So a minimal 'whole house' protector is 50,000 amps. A protector that fails does no effective protection. This proven solution typically costs about $1 per protected appliance. Is an only soution for protecting a recharging Leaf.

Your atttention should not focus on a protector. Your attentin should focus on what actually protects a recharging Leaf; where hundreds of thousands of joules are harmlessly absorbed. A protector is only as effective as its single point earth ground.

 

[KillaWhat]

While we in Pennsylvania don't have earthquakes; don't have tornadoes or flooding or mudslides or typhoons, where I live, we sure do have lightning.

LOTS and lots of lightning, and it comes up fast.

I had owned my LEAF for about 9 months when it "released the blue smoke".

I had just plugged it in to my AV EVSE, and walked about 30' away, when Flash! Bang! And I was flat on my back.

The EVSE contactor was closed since it was charging, and surprisingly to me, the EVSE survived unscathed.

The LEAF did not.
The onboard charger showed a fault, and needed to be replaced.

I had a DELTA whole house Surge arrestor physically connected across the breaker for the EVSE, which is 2' from the sub-panel, with an 8' copper ground rod 4' away run on #4 solid copper.
The DELTA arrestor literally blew apart.

When I put SOLAR on the roof of the garage where the LEAF charges, I upgraded the Surge protection to the Best "Consumer" product I was able to find.

We have had many nasty lightning strikes since the upgrade without damage, although I'm not sure that we have had a hit like "The Big One".

As with many other things, you get what you pay for in lightning protection.
The DELTA cost about $30, this EATON cost about $130.

Cut your losses, get an L2 EVSE.
If you need an L1, eBay is your friend.

If you are "electrical", take that wonderful Yazaki Plug set from the Stock EVSE, buy an Open EVSE kit, and build something nice.

I built an Open EVSE into a Plastic Fencepost, where the contactor is back inside the house, so no high voltage is present unless the Car is charging.

Good Luck.

 

[Linza]

I did take KillaWhat's advice (before it was given ) and bought an OpenEVSE Standard kit. It was a bit of a pain to put together (the screw lengths are too exact, no room for error and not enough 22 gauge wire for mistakes), but after two days and a lot of facepalms, it is assembled! It works wonderfully, and the extra features like sleep mode, current detection, and debugging possibilities made it worth buying something that doesn't have a warranty.

I am very impressed so far. Highly recommend.

 

[KillaWhat]

Very Cool!