Europe parliament prepares draft for CHAdeMO phase-out 2018

[GRA]

From insideevs.com:

http://insideevs.com/european-parliament-prepares-draft-calling-for-terminatation-of-chademo-in-europe/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

We'll see if this goes anywhere.

 

[walterbays]

If you can't win at the engineering drawing board, nor on the factory production line, nor in the showroom, then try to get gullible politicians, regulators, or courts to ban your successful competitors' products.

 

[mwalsh]

Well, if this passes, then you can take them to the European Court on Human Rights, for violating your right to quick charge using CHAdeMO.

 

[TonyWilliams]

Bravo to the Frankenplug bloc for this. I wonder when they start sending out arm banded youth with baseball bats to "take care of the problem".

 

[mwalsh]

Bravo to the Frankenplug bloc for this. I wonder when they start sending out arm banded youth with baseball bats to "take care of the problem".

In brown shirts?

 

[jhm614]

Wow -- four posts until Godwin's law is in play. Not bad, MNL, not bad.

 

[mwalsh]

I doubt that Godwin's Law will apply here.

But to quote an old British adage fron the mid-20th century: "Just don't mention the war".

 

[TomT]

Like Thomas Edison did...

Bravo to the Frankenplug bloc for this. I wonder when they start sending out arm banded youth with baseball bats to "take care of the problem".

 

[scottf200]

Wow -- four posts until Godwin's law is in play. Not bad, MNL, not bad.

I did not follow. Googled it tho: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=godwin's law

 

[SanDust]

I doubt that Godwin's Law will apply here.

But to quote an old British adage fron the mid-20th century: "Just don't mention the war".

Perfect example actually. As for the war, it was over when the Chinese indicated they'd accept Combo2 but never Chademo. FWIW Combo2 is far better unless you think more complexity and cost are better than less.

The costs for adding support for Chademo to a DC charger are fairly small, so hopefully both standards will be supported. Over time Chademo will disappear because supporting one DC plug with local AC variations is much cheaper than supporting a multitude of AC and DC plugs.

 

[GregH]

Wonder how they feel about this in Estonia..

 

[edatoakrun]

... Over time Chademo will disappear because supporting one DC plug with local AC variations is much cheaper than supporting a multitude of AC and DC plugs.

Wrong.

Over time, all AC charge sites will disappear, because having on-board chargers is far more costly and less efficient than putting all the BEV chargers in fixed locations. DC high kW ones will be grouped in public charge stations along the highways, and most of us will have a low kW DC charger in our garage.

Meaning a future with no chargers in BEV's at all, just a single DC standard, and a single DC port on every BEV, supporting all kW charge rates.

So the not-ready-for-prime-time SAE DC/AC combo standard, as well as the J1772 AC we all use today, is already obsolescent.

The embryonic SAE combo, due to the very few BEVs likely to ever be built that use it, is unlikely to ever survive a short and sickly childhood.

That being said, CHAdeMO's life may not be very much longer, since as soon as in a decade or so, the idea of plugging in your BEV yourself will start to recede into memory, as inductive or self-plugging chargers, the public ones being at higher kW levels than either CHAdeMO or SAE combo can support, replace the plug-it-in-yourself ritual that began the BEV age.

Imagine how much less time we'd all have spend on this BS argument if Thomas Edison had just beat out AC with a DC standard ~120 years ago...?

 

[TonyWilliams]

Wonder how they feel about this in Estonia..

And everywhere that has the other 900 CHAdeMO stations in Europe.

Of course, Norway isn't EU with their 60 CHAdeMO stations, but Estonia is.

 

[fastcharge]

So the not-ready-for-prime-time SAE DC/AC combo standard, as well as the J1772 AC we all use today, is already obsolescent.

The embryonic SAE combo, due to the very few BEVs likely to ever be built that use it, is unlikely to ever survive a short and sickly childhood.

The SAE combo supports four types of charging:
AC Level 1
AC Level 2
DC Level 1
DC Level 2

Even if you were right and charging in the future was all DC, this plug would still work for that.

 

[ydnas7]

At first, I thought this was further resistence to Chademo from the EU block,
but now I think this is their olive branch to Chademo
I looked at the docs and added the amendment in


ANNEX III
Technical specifications

1. Technical specifications for electric recharging points

1.1. Slow electric recharging points for motor vehicles
Alternate Current (AC) slow recharging points for electric vehicles shall be equipped, for
interoperability purposes, with connectors ofType 2 as described in standard EN62196-2:2012.

1.2. Fast electric recharging points for motor vehicles Alternate Current (AC) fast recharging points for electric vehicles shall be equipped, for interoperability purposes, with connectors of
Type 2 as described in standard EN62196-2:2012. Direct Current (DC) fast recharging points for electric vehicles shall be equipped, for interoperability purposes, with connectors of Type "Combo 2" as described in the relevant EN standard, to be adopted by 2014.

Direct Current (DC) fast recharging points for electric vehicles may be alternatively equipped with connectors of Type "CHAdeMO" for a transitional period ending on 31 December 2018.

1.3. Shore-side electricity for waterborne vessels.....

so its an additional paragraph, that seems to permit the (DC) fast recharging points for electric vehicles may be alternatively equipped with connectors of Type "CHAdeMO" for a transitional period ending on 31 December 2018.

interesting, while I'm not a lawyer nor am I European
a) It seems that having Chademo no longer disqualifies a fast charging point from being a fast charging point.
b) Renault/Nissan can continue their fast charger rollout across Europe.
c) Unless the EU decides that Tesla's superchargers are not permitted, then Chademo is going to stay.

with the exception of Germany, I now expect the triple bowser (AC, Chademo, SAE DC) to become the norm for Euro installations.

The intense enthusiasm for petrol free/diesel free, battery electric vehicles from the EU SAE DC pretty much guarantees that come 2018, Chameleon and Chademo will remain the dominant vehicles for fast charging.

 

[edatoakrun]

Doesn't seem that Euro LEAF sales are suffering due to "Euro-combo-charger-standard anxiety", even in what is probably Das Vaterland of the anti-CHAdeMO campaign...

...July seems to be a very strong month for EV sales in Germany. It might even be record-breaking and is definitely at a comparable level to that in France (at least for passenger cars).

The big news is that the number of LEAF registrations hit 230, which is the highest to date in a single month. Moreover, Nissan had only 289 registrations under its belt after the first half of the year, so July’s result is a huge jump...

http://insideevs.com/nissan-leaf-and-renault-zoe-log-almost-400-sales-combined-in-germany-in-july/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[evnow]

Looks like EU guys are trying a similar tactic like the dealers in the US.

Shame !

BTW, if you see UK guys posting about their i3 order, looks like no one is ordering the Frankenplug.

 

[donald]

.. errr ... colour me stupid, but ....

If that is the draft/amendment, then where does it say that a charging station cannot have a CHAdeMO after 2018?

All it is saying is that if you install a fast DC charger after 2018 it must, at least, contain the Type 2 combo, as yet undefined.

Nothing there calls for a 'termination' of the CHAdeMO.

If an installer wants to provide combo AND CHAdeMO after 2018, let him make merry!! But at least include the combo ....

Until 2018, an installer can fit CHAdeMO only, if he so wishes.

Seems sensible enough to me at this point in time/understanding/development. The market will decide what is demanded, and one might then fantasize that this demand will define what plugs are made available!

 

[TonyWilliams]

If that is the draft/amendment, then where does it say that a charging station cannot have a CHAdeMO after 2018?...
Until 2018, an installer can fit CHAdeMO only, if he so wishes.

Exactly. It's not even saying that the German-Frankenplug must be installed; instead, it's saying that they will decide on that "single standard" by 2019. The standard could be CHAdeMO, or Tesla-Mennekes!!

 

[kubel]

If you can't win at the engineering drawing board, nor on the factory production line, nor in the showroom, then try to get gullible politicians, regulators, or courts to ban your successful competitors' products.

+1

Though I am in favor of a single plug, it annoys the hell out of me when corporatism steps in and uses the force of the state to get what the free market is not accepting.