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End of Lease Strategies?
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I have enjoyed reading this topic for inspiration over the past several months and thought others might be interested in my end-of-lease story. Apologies in advance if it's a bit long...
The 3-year lease on my 2013 LEAF SV reached maturity in August. I liked the car and had kept it in good condition (always garaged, usually trickle-charged, only 12,000 miles). With so many interesting EV's on the horizon (Tesla Model 3, Chevy Bolt, LEAF 2, and the German crowd), I would have liked to keep the LEAF for another year or two. In May, there was a $7500 incentive from NMAC, which brought the buyout price down to approximately market value. I decided to buy the car but didn't move fast enough; the June offer was only $3000 -- couldn't justify paying $4500 above market value to buy my car off lease. July's offer wasn't good either, and I was out of time.
What about a lease extension? Well, when I leased the LEAF 3 years ago, I was on the fence about how much to put down. Depending on the money down, my lease payments could have been $150, $250, or $350. All three were calculated to deliver the same amount of my money to NMAC over 36 months, just a tradeoff between initial and monthly payments. For no strong reason, I took the no-money-down $350 option, not realizing the implication it would have for a possible lease extension. Because the extension offer maintains the same monthly payment, it's a much better deal to make a large down payment if you think you might want to extend. While my no-money-down choice was a wash over the initial lease term, it would have cost me an extra $200 per month during any extension. No, thanks.
I went looking for other options and ended up assuming the second half of a 3-year lease on a Mercedes-Benz B-Class Electric Drive, which I found on Swapalease. For a lower payment than I had on my LEAF, I get to try out a different Electric Vehicle. I've been driving it for over a month, and there are some interesting advantages:
The B-Class maintains its 75-80 mile range at highway speed. In my LEAF, in order to make even a 60-mile trip on the highway, I had to either drive below the speed limit, stop at a charging station enroute, or charge to 100% (versus the normal 80%).
The B-Class has a Tesla powertrain, with lots more torque than the LEAF. Below 25 mph, that can be a pain because you burn rubber if you floor it. But accelerating from 40 to 60 mph is smooth and easy, much quicker than the LEAF.
The B-Class is a luxury platform, not an econobox. My wife likes to ride in it and often asks to borrow it, which was rare with the LEAF.
The audio system is much nicer, as is the nav system. The XID headlights are great. (My LEAF had the powerful LED low beam headlights, but its cheap halogen high beams were disappointing.) The seats are more comfortable, with power adjustments and 3 memories even for the passenger. The wipers have auto-rain-sensing modes, and the blind spot monitors add a measure of safety when changing lanes.
The LEAF has two forward operating modes: D (Drive) and B (Braking). The B-Class has four: D Auto, D+, D, and D-. I particularly like D+, which means it doesn't do regenerative braking when you take your foot off the accelerator but simply coasts, and D Auto, where it senses the distance and closure rate to the vehicle in front of you and adjusts the amount of regenerative braking accordingly.
There are also a couple of disadvantages: The B-Class has no DC Quick Charge port, and its overall efficiency is slightly lower. Since it has more battery capacity and a bigger on-board inverter which can charge at 40A (vs 30A for the LEAF), the lower efficiency is no inconvenience, although some EV buyers are laser-focused on M/kWh. I don't mind that but will probably miss the LEAF's heated steering wheel and the heated rear seat when winter arrives.
In the final analysis, I'm glad NMAC was jerking me around so much with the buyout offers of the month and trying to over-charge me for the lease extension. That prompted me to give up the LEAF, which I liked, and try something else -- which turns out to also be great. The ability to affordably experience a variety of vehicles is one advantage of leasing.
- Mark
The 3-year lease on my 2013 LEAF SV reached maturity in August. I liked the car and had kept it in good condition (always garaged, usually trickle-charged, only 12,000 miles). With so many interesting EV's on the horizon (Tesla Model 3, Chevy Bolt, LEAF 2, and the German crowd), I would have liked to keep the LEAF for another year or two. In May, there was a $7500 incentive from NMAC, which brought the buyout price down to approximately market value. I decided to buy the car but didn't move fast enough; the June offer was only $3000 -- couldn't justify paying $4500 above market value to buy my car off lease. July's offer wasn't good either, and I was out of time.
What about a lease extension? Well, when I leased the LEAF 3 years ago, I was on the fence about how much to put down. Depending on the money down, my lease payments could have been $150, $250, or $350. All three were calculated to deliver the same amount of my money to NMAC over 36 months, just a tradeoff between initial and monthly payments. For no strong reason, I took the no-money-down $350 option, not realizing the implication it would have for a possible lease extension. Because the extension offer maintains the same monthly payment, it's a much better deal to make a large down payment if you think you might want to extend. While my no-money-down choice was a wash over the initial lease term, it would have cost me an extra $200 per month during any extension. No, thanks.
I went looking for other options and ended up assuming the second half of a 3-year lease on a Mercedes-Benz B-Class Electric Drive, which I found on Swapalease. For a lower payment than I had on my LEAF, I get to try out a different Electric Vehicle. I've been driving it for over a month, and there are some interesting advantages:
The B-Class maintains its 75-80 mile range at highway speed. In my LEAF, in order to make even a 60-mile trip on the highway, I had to either drive below the speed limit, stop at a charging station enroute, or charge to 100% (versus the normal 80%).
The B-Class has a Tesla powertrain, with lots more torque than the LEAF. Below 25 mph, that can be a pain because you burn rubber if you floor it. But accelerating from 40 to 60 mph is smooth and easy, much quicker than the LEAF.
The B-Class is a luxury platform, not an econobox. My wife likes to ride in it and often asks to borrow it, which was rare with the LEAF.
The audio system is much nicer, as is the nav system. The XID headlights are great. (My LEAF had the powerful LED low beam headlights, but its cheap halogen high beams were disappointing.) The seats are more comfortable, with power adjustments and 3 memories even for the passenger. The wipers have auto-rain-sensing modes, and the blind spot monitors add a measure of safety when changing lanes.
The LEAF has two forward operating modes: D (Drive) and B (Braking). The B-Class has four: D Auto, D+, D, and D-. I particularly like D+, which means it doesn't do regenerative braking when you take your foot off the accelerator but simply coasts, and D Auto, where it senses the distance and closure rate to the vehicle in front of you and adjusts the amount of regenerative braking accordingly.
There are also a couple of disadvantages: The B-Class has no DC Quick Charge port, and its overall efficiency is slightly lower. Since it has more battery capacity and a bigger on-board inverter which can charge at 40A (vs 30A for the LEAF), the lower efficiency is no inconvenience, although some EV buyers are laser-focused on M/kWh. I don't mind that but will probably miss the LEAF's heated steering wheel and the heated rear seat when winter arrives.
In the final analysis, I'm glad NMAC was jerking me around so much with the buyout offers of the month and trying to over-charge me for the lease extension. That prompted me to give up the LEAF, which I liked, and try something else -- which turns out to also be great. The ability to affordably experience a variety of vehicles is one advantage of leasing.
- Mark
this is a great story. thx for sharing w/ us. i did take similar route with a different ev instead (only 2 wk old)... and my leaf#2 lease is up in a month so i am still pondering/exploring options.
myth said:I have enjoyed reading this topic for inspiration over the past several months and thought others might be interested in my end-of-lease story. Apologies in advance if it's a bit long...
The 3-year lease on my 2013 LEAF SV reached maturity in August. I liked the car and had kept it in good condition (always garaged, usually trickle-charged, only 12,000 miles). With so many interesting EV's on the horizon (Tesla Model 3, Chevy Bolt, LEAF 2, and the German crowd), I would have liked to keep the LEAF for another year or two. In May, there was a $7500 incentive from NMAC, which brought the buyout price down to approximately market value. I decided to buy the car but didn't move fast enough; the June offer was only $3000 -- couldn't justify paying $4500 above market value to buy my car off lease. July's offer wasn't good either, and I was out of time.
What about a lease extension? Well, when I leased the LEAF 3 years ago, I was on the fence about how much to put down. Depending on the money down, my lease payments could have been $150, $250, or $350. All three were calculated to deliver the same amount of my money to NMAC over 36 months, just a tradeoff between initial and monthly payments. For no strong reason, I took the no-money-down $350 option, not realizing the implication it would have for a possible lease extension. Because the extension offer maintains the same monthly payment, it's a much better deal to make a large down payment if you think you might want to extend. While my no-money-down choice was a wash over the initial lease term, it would have cost me an extra $200 per month during any extension. No, thanks.
I went looking for other options and ended up assuming the second half of a 3-year lease on a Mercedes-Benz B-Class Electric Drive, which I found on Swapalease. For a lower payment than I had on my LEAF, I get to try out a different Electric Vehicle. I've been driving it for over a month, and there are some interesting advantages:
The B-Class maintains its 75-80 mile range at highway speed. In my LEAF, in order to make even a 60-mile trip on the highway, I had to either drive below the speed limit, stop at a charging station enroute, or charge to 100% (versus the normal 80%).
The B-Class has a Tesla powertrain, with lots more torque than the LEAF. Below 25 mph, that can be a pain because you burn rubber if you floor it. But accelerating from 40 to 60 mph is smooth and easy, much quicker than the LEAF.
.
.
.
In the final analysis, I'm glad NMAC was jerking me around so much with the buyout offers of the month and trying to over-charge me for the lease extension. That prompted me to give up the LEAF, which I liked, and try something else -- which turns out to also be great. The ability to affordably experience a variety of vehicles is one advantage of leasing.
- Mark
For 2013 3yr lease term:
1) $4500 off good till Oct. 3rd, 2016
2) No option for lease extension
1) $4500 off good till Oct. 3rd, 2016
2) No option for lease extension
ehwang114 said:Anyone have an update on the deals for September? I know the lease buybacks change month to month and 9/6 is the date it would change. I plan to call after work but wanted to check on this forum first.
GoingForLeaf
Member
Cubanx said:Called today
Meh.. brings the payoff slightly under market value. Lease ends 2/2017 so i'll wait for a better offer
Could someone add pointers where to find used leaf market value?
I am trying to see whether buying my car with 4500$ off, is a good option or not?
---------------
Pay off quote in my account : $16101.35
Maturity date: 10/01/2016
Leased from premier Nissan San jose.
3 year lease with 12k miles/year.
Year: 2013 Make: Nissan
Model: LEAF Trim Level: SL
Made In: UNITED STATES Style: HATCHBACK 4-DR
Has Bose audio package, 360 surround view camera.
Mileage is < 23000
---------------
I like my car and can use it for another 4/5 years comfortably. Wondering whether I should purchase it or go for other car like Chevy Volt?
I had only couple of days to decide during March'16 to get 7500$ and didn't take it.
TimLee
Well-known member
OrientExpress posts the auction prices periodically.
See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=19362&start=170#p462637 for June prices.
He may update if you send PM.
You can probably find a dealer to get one at auction for around $1,000 above auction price.
Retail is often $2,000 to $3,000 above auction price.
See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=19362&start=170#p462637 for June prices.
He may update if you send PM.
You can probably find a dealer to get one at auction for around $1,000 above auction price.
Retail is often $2,000 to $3,000 above auction price.
GoingForLeaf
Member
TimLee said:OrientExpress posts the auction prices periodically.
See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=19362&start=170#p462637 for June prices.
He may update if you send PM.
You can probably find a dealer to get one at auction for around $1,000 anove auction price.
Retail is often $2,000 to $3,000 above auction price.
Thanks for the response.
From that link, looks like average average price is around $10,700, which is near my buyback price ($11,500). And from March to June, difference of $1000.
I assume these are all pre-tax prices. With this my buyback price is not that bad. Am I interpreting the numbers correctly?
TimLee
Well-known member
I think so.GoingForLeaf said:... I assume these are all pre-tax prices. With this my buyback price is not that bad. Am I interpreting the numbers correctly?
But I am NOT an expert on the auctions or the price information.
I'm not sure how taxation works on an auction purchase.
Typically most USA sales taxes are levied on the end purchaser.
The licensed auction buyer may not pay much tax.
But it may vary widely in different states.
I am in a similar boat (lease ends Dec 1). I considered the Volt - but I believe there are no carpool stickers left for plugin hybrids so I am not going there. Is my info correct ? (All the Volts I see on the road have the green stickers but the CA website says they are all gone so...)
Current plan is to hope for 7500 offer in October or November and keep my 2013.
Or look for a Bolt if it comes out soon.
Current plan is to hope for 7500 offer in October or November and keep my 2013.
Or look for a Bolt if it comes out soon.
cwerdna
Well-known member
Correct, green HOV stickers are still at the limit and the cap hasn't been raised: https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm.sunil said:I considered the Volt - but I believe there are no carpool stickers left for plugin hybrids so I am not going there. Is my info correct ? (All the Volts I see on the road have the green stickers but the CA website says they are all gone so...)
If you want a green stickered car now, you'll need to buy a used one.
Hunter1969
New member
- Joined
- Sep 13, 2016
- Messages
- 4
I just called about a 2015 Leaf SV with a two year lease at 18K miles per year that is up late in October.. The offer was $3K off of my $17K residual with no option to extend the lease. When I called last month is was $2K off residual, and they said that the lease extension for 12 months with two months free ($3500 total cost) would be a standing offer.
So now I have to reconsider what to do, I had resigned myself to the extension. I just do not know if a mint condition SV with 36300 miles is worth $14K. So frustrating.
Does anyone have an educated guess based on the past if the lease extension might come back?
Also, thanks everyone that has contributed to this thread. It has be a great help.
So now I have to reconsider what to do, I had resigned myself to the extension. I just do not know if a mint condition SV with 36300 miles is worth $14K. So frustrating.
Does anyone have an educated guess based on the past if the lease extension might come back?
Also, thanks everyone that has contributed to this thread. It has be a great help.
Lease extensions are in effect more often than they are cancelled. Nissan gives no warning of the changes. I'd say that a 2015 SV that isn't losing capacity fast is worth around $14k, especially if it has Premium.
GoingForLeaf
Member
cwerdna said:Correct, green HOV stickers are still at the limit and the cap hasn't been raised: https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm.sunil said:I considered the Volt - but I believe there are no carpool stickers left for plugin hybrids so I am not going there. Is my info correct ? (All the Volts I see on the road have the green stickers but the CA website says they are all gone so...)
If you want a green stickered car now, you'll need to buy a used one.
I was at the BMW dealership and they told me that CA restarted green sticker. Checking https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm , it does seem, CA has removed the cap.
The initial quote for bmw i3 with range extender is around 11500$ total cost for 30 month lease (after 2500$ CA rebate), this is with leather option.
With green sticker availability, we are wondering whether to keep my leaf SL or go for Chevy volt/bmw-i3..
---------------
Pay off quote in my account : $16101.35
Maturity date: 10/01/2016
Leased from premier Nissan San jose.
3 year lease with 12k miles/year.
Year: 2013 Make: Nissan
Model: LEAF Trim Level: SL
Made In: UNITED STATES Style: HATCHBACK 4-DR
Has Bose audio package, 360 surround view camera.
Mileage is < 22k
With $4500 off, payoff price would be $11601.
---------
At this point we are leaning towards keeping our Leaf SL.
If we go for buy back of our car, what would be approximate cost we need to pay?
Any comments? Anything we are missing? Thanks.
cwerdna
Well-known member
Yes, it sure seems like it, as of Sept 13, 2016. Discussion at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=22583.GoingForLeaf said:cwerdna said:Correct, green HOV stickers are still at the limit and the cap hasn't been raised: https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm.sunil said:I considered the Volt - but I believe there are no carpool stickers left for plugin hybrids so I am not going there. Is my info correct ? (All the Volts I see on the road have the green stickers but the CA website says they are all gone so...)
If you want a green stickered car now, you'll need to buy a used one.
I was at the BMW dealership and they told me that CA restarted green sticker. Checking https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm , it does seem, CA has removed the cap.
I would still NOT recommend anyone get a BMW i3 REx unless you like having a decent chance of having a new "hobby". See my post and later replies at http://www.myrav4ev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=22118#p22118. I'm not the only one who's observed this (http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=446091#p446091 is an example of someone else who has).
And, I know someone (who isn't that active here on MNL anymore) who had their first i3 REx bought back. Last time I talked to him about his 2nd one, it was close to the CA lemon law threshold for being able ask for buyback due to amount of time in the "spa".
Join https://www.facebook.com/groups/BMWi3/ and hang out on it for a few weeks. You'll see what I mean vs. frequency of significant problem reports (e.g. drivetrain malfunction, breakdown that requires a tow, failed J1772 handle locking mechanism, restraint system error, failed AC, failed heater (in colder months), check engine light (CEL), battery discharging error, etc.) vs. here on MNL. You'll also probably notice a few BMW fanboys and apologists making excuses/dismissing the issues as minor or user error :roll: ...
GoingForLeaf
Member
cwerdna said:Yes, it sure seems like it, as of Sept 13, 2016. Discussion at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=22583.GoingForLeaf said:cwerdna said:Correct, green HOV stickers are still at the limit and the cap hasn't been raised: https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm.
If you want a green stickered car now, you'll need to buy a used one.
I was at the BMW dealership and they told me that CA restarted green sticker. Checking https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm , it does seem, CA has removed the cap.
I would still NOT recommend anyone get a BMW i3 REx unless you like having a decent chance of having a new "hobby". See my post and later replies at http://www.myrav4ev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=22118#p22118. I'm not the only one who's observed this (http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=446091#p446091 is an example of someone else who has).
And, I know someone (who isn't that active here on MNL anymore) who had their first i3 REx bought back. Last time I talked to him about his 2nd one, it was close to the CA lemon law threshold for being able ask for buyback due to amount of time in the "spa".
Join https://www.facebook.com/groups/BMWi3/ and hang out on it for a few weeks. You'll see what I mean vs. frequency of significant problem reports (e.g. drivetrain malfunction, breakdown that requires a tow, failed J1772 handle locking mechanism, restraint system error, failed AC, failed heater (in colder months), check engine light (CEL), battery discharging error, etc.) vs. here on MNL. You'll also probably notice a few BMW fanboys and apologists making excuses/dismissing the issues as minor or user error :roll: ...
Thanks for the response. Actually after the i3 test drive, we felt our current Leaf SL is still better. With above listed issues, i3 is out of our list.
This chevy volt lease deal seems to be good?
http://ev-vin.blogspot.com/2016/07/current-lease-offers-for-selected-evs.html?m=1
http://www.capitolchevysj.com/specials/lease.htm
*********
2017 Chevrolet Volt Premier
36 MONTH LEASE
$189/mo plus tax
On approved credit. Lease for $189 per month plus tax for 36 months. $4,999 due at signing plus $0 security deposit. 10,000 miles per year, $0.25 per mile thereafter.
*************
TimLee
Well-known member
^^^^^ An awfully high $ amount to put down on a lease.
If it ends up totaled those $ are gone.
If it ends up totaled those $ are gone.
cwerdna
Well-known member
Yes. On leases, put $0 down. It is not worth the risk.TimLee said:^^^^^ An awfully high $ amount to put down on a lease.
If it ends up totaled those $ are gone.
I will say the i3 is quite fast in terms of acceleration and it's at least RWD. I do give credit to BMW w/taking the risk to go with CFRP and creating a light car. But, for me, I frankly do not have the time nor patience of a new hobby. It's already inconvenient to take cars in for regular maintenance, let alone constant repairs. If I wanted to buy junk, I'd save my $ and pick a random American car, since many have not so good reliability records.
Cwerdna and I agree on most things, but here we diverge a *little*. It appears that dealers give better lease deals with a down payment, so I suggest that people put down only as much as they wish to risk losing, in return for a better deal. That may be $0, it may be $1k or even $2k. I put down $2k (plus tax!) and it's really payed off for me. I do agree that $5k is too much, unless GM reimburses you that if the car is totaled and you lease another Volt...
DaveinOlyWA
Well-known member
Hunter1969 said:I just called about a 2015 Leaf SV with a two year lease at 18K miles per year that is up late in October.. The offer was $3K off of my $17K residual with no option to extend the lease. When I called last month is was $2K off residual, and they said that the lease extension for 12 months with two months free ($3500 total cost) would be a standing offer.
So now I have to reconsider what to do, I had resigned myself to the extension. I just do not know if a mint condition SV with 36300 miles is worth $14K. So frustrating.
Does anyone have an educated guess based on the past if the lease extension might come back?
Also, thanks everyone that has contributed to this thread. It has be a great help.
your car is too new. never going to see a good purchase deal off a 2 year lease. I would extend a year then entertain offers. Betting the discount will be MUCH bigger
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