Are we crazy? No EVSE, nor even...

[tggibson]

...a 240V outlet. In our two weeks of ownership, doesn't seem to be an issue.
Perhaps you with more experience are nodding sagely and thinking, "Wait, till..."
Wait till what is what I'm wondering. My wife uses the Leaf for her 16-mi. RT,
non-freeway commute. In our very brief experience, we charge twice a week.

We test drove the Tesla (extended range, but not performance model) and the
BMW i3. The Tesla's great and the BMW is very good (20% lighter than the
Leaf, but less roomy). Ultimately, we chose a 3-yr. lease on a Leaf S because
it is the cheapest among three good alternatives. (My wife remains stuck on
the Tesla and, I confess, it tugs on my heart a bit.)

The 240V vs. 110V charging is interesting to me. The Leaf owner's manual
posits 240V as "normal" charging and 110V as a sort of lame 2d choice. With
the Tesla and BMW, 110V is barely mentioned (though I haven't seen their
owner's manuals). Is the slant toward 240V merely because manufacturers
assume customers are impatient? That raises the question: Are the batteries,
among the three manufacturers, chemically different? As the Norwegian paper
on this web site notes, there are multiple flavors of "lithium ion".

I love the quiet of an EV. Why didn't I do this sooner?

Terry
2014 Leaf S with fast charger
SF Bay Area

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

120v charging tends to lead to poor customer perception along with a few too many melted plugs and worse yet the occasional house fire.

For your atypical limited usage though it should be fine. Just make sure the plug isn't getting too warm.

 

[cgaydos]

...a 240V outlet. In our two weeks of ownership, doesn't seem to be an issue.
Perhaps you with more experience are nodding sagely and thinking, "Wait, till..."
Wait till what is what I'm wondering. My wife uses the Leaf for her 16-mi. RT,
non-freeway commute. In our very brief experience, we charge twice a week.

We test drove the Tesla (extended range, but not performance model) and the
BMW i3. The Tesla's great and the BMW is very good (20% lighter than the
Leaf, but less roomy). Ultimately, we chose a 3-yr. lease on a Leaf S because
it is the cheapest among three good alternatives. (My wife remains stuck on
the Tesla and, I confess, it tugs on my heart a bit.)

The 240V vs. 110V charging is interesting to me. The Leaf owner's manual
posits 240V as "normal" charging and 110V as a sort of lame 2d choice. With
the Tesla and BMW, 110V is barely mentioned (though I haven't seen their
owner's manuals). Is the slant toward 240V merely because manufacturers
assume customers are impatient? That raises the question: Are the batteries,
among the three manufacturers, chemically different? As the Norwegian paper
on this web site notes, there are multiple flavors of "lithium ion".

I love the quiet of an EV. Why didn't I do this sooner?

Terry
2014 Leaf S with fast charger
SF Bay Area

A lot of people get by with just the trickle charger at home. It's a minority of LEAF owners, but a significant minority (a couple of surveys I saw said around 30%). So, if it works for you, great!

Nissan doesn't consider level 1 "normal" partly for marketing purposes - when people ask "how long does it take to charge" they want the answer to be something like "3 hours" (6.6 kw/h for 2013/2014 level 2 with that option) or "30 minutes" (to 80% with QC), not "14 hours". If they called trickle charging "normal charging" then that would be what the press would cite as the standard time to charge. The other factor is that Nissan knows that the LEAF has a limited market already due to the short range - if they accepted 14 hours to fully recharge the market would be much smaller. That's why during the initial roll-out they required people on the LEAF pre-order list to have their homes evaluated for a level 2 charger.

For Tesla, first consider that it has a much bigger battery (at least 60 kwh in the least expensive version, more than double the LEAF's 24 kwh) so trickle charging would take over a day for the full battery. Second, consider that with cars at that price they figure all of their buyers will want a level 2 charger at home.

Now, as happy as you are with level 1 charging you may decide to go with level 2 at some point. We used level 1 for a couple weeks and it was fine, but we realized that we were missing a number of potential LEAF trips because once the battery was used up we had to wait until the next morning for it to be ready again. After I installed our level 2 our LEAF mileage rate nearly doubled.

 

[kubel]

I think the slant toward 240V is that it more energy efficient and ultimately results in a better user experience being able to charge in a few hours rather than all night long. But for the first few months of ownership, I too relied exclusively on 120V. I went to 240V then moved closer to work, so now 120V is working fine for my short commute of about 3 miles. I'll eventually install an outdoor 240V EVSE, but it's not a super high priority.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

Neal Cavuto uses L1 exclusively. You can't ask for a better endorsement than that.

 

[pkulak]

Eh, just wait. I did the 120 thing for a month or so. Totally doable, but the car has a lot more utility if you can actually get some miles back during the day. With 120 only, you might as well not even plug it in unless it's over night.

 

[gbarry42]

The battery chemistry is different among the various manufacturers. But that doesn't affect your charging experience. All you need to know is how many kW-hours the battery holds (or, more accurately, uses, since some is kept in reserve). Efficiency would be the other difference. The i3 holds less, but it also uses less, since it's lighter.

A friend of mine had the BMW Active E for two years, and never was able to get 240V at his house, so the protocol was--like a cell phone--plug it in whenever it's home. And it worked out OK. It didn't have to be fully charged, it just had to have enough to get there. And they did melt a plug once, so it's real, and a good thing to check.

Tesla owners often do that, too. There's so much range in a Tesla, that if you're only half charged, it doesn't matter unless you have a trip ahead of you.

There have been a few times when my own LEAF couldn't be charged back up during the day--too many activities--and so we had to take the other car. And I do charge at 3.3 kW. Dave from Olympia (a member here) also started his LEAF career with a level 1 charger, and made it work for him. Since you have the 6 kW charger, you do have a little bit of an advantage. You still have the option of visiting a public charging station and you can "catch up" rather quickly.

 

[LeftieBiker]

I've been using 120 volt charging (not "trickle charging") at home exclusively for a year now, with no problems. My commute, before I retired last week, as 47 miles round trip, three days a row every week, with zero charging at work. I did a couple of commutes with the temps below zero both ways, and the heat on, but didn't not use the Leaf for a single one. The only reason I'm installing an L-2 station now is I expect to be more active this Summer, and want to be able to use the car as much as I want.

 

[2k1Toaster]

After 7 or so months, I find the L1 charging adequate for me. I plug in at home and work and it just sits there "trickle charging" all day. There have only been a couple instances of using L2 at a public charger during dinner or lunch out but I don't need it.

If you have at least some L2 chargers around you could use, then I see no problem.

 

[Nubo]

The 240V vs. 110V charging is interesting to me. The Leaf owner's manual
posits 240V as "normal" charging and 110V as a sort of lame 2d choice. With
the Tesla and BMW, 110V is barely mentioned (though I haven't seen their
owner's manuals). Is the slant toward 240V merely because manufacturers
assume customers are impatient? That raises the question: Are the batteries,
among the three manufacturers, chemically different? As the Norwegian paper
on this web site notes, there are multiple flavors of "lithium ion".

There's nothing inherently wrong with charging at Level 1.

As others mention, a couple of reasons why Nissan might tend to encourage Level 2 charging:

faster charge times
This plays into public perception and customer satisfaction.

safety concerns
It's more likely that a 240V installation will involve an electrician and proper wiring, and by code 240V devices must be on dedicated circuits. With 120V many people are tempted to plug into any old socket, which could end up having marginal wiring for the task, be overloaded, have worn receptacles, etc… 120V receptacles are more likely to have been improperly DIY'd. If you're familiar with wiring, make sure the circuit is not overloaded, the wiring is of the proper gauge, the outlet is good quality and properly wired. If not familiar, it's well worth having an electrician look things over. Treat Level 1 charging as you would a space heater -- heavy load for hours at a time - over and over. Check the outlet and plug after 30 minutes of charging to make sure things aren't getting too warm.

energy efficiency
The coolant pump runs during charging and consumes the same power regardless of Level 1 or Level 2. And since it's going to run several times longer for Level 1, the "wall-to-wheels" electrical efficiency drops somewhat.

 

[cwerdna]

You do have an EVSE, the L1 "trickle charge" cable/EVSE that came w/the car.

Not so crazy... as long the car's range and how quickly you can replenish charge @ 120 volts is adequate for your usage, it's fine.

I only can do L1 charging @ home. Most of my charging is from free L2 charging at work and sometimes I use L1 instead, like today. I sometimes L1 charge @ home on weekends along w/a combination of free public L2 and CHAdeMO DC FCs.

 

[kieranmullen]

Why would the coolant pump run when the leaf has no active battery management? Is it for the charger? What models is that on?

energy efficiency
The coolant pump runs during charging and consumes the same power regardless of Level 1 or Level 2. And since it's going to run several times longer for Level 1, the "wall-to-wheels" electrical efficiency drops somewhat.

 

[cwerdna]

Why would the coolant pump run when the leaf has no active battery management? Is it for the charger? What models is that on?

Yes and for the motor. All.

You have a '12 Leaf, right? Can you please put whatever year you have in your sig? Many may incorrectly assume you have a '13+.

See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=3896" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=69224" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

On the '13+ Leafs, since the OBC was moved to under the hood (http://articles.sae.org/11993/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false as part of the PDM stack, you can feel the whole stack get warm when charging and you can feel warm coolant running through the hoses. I'd imagine you should be able to feel coolant running thru the hoses under the hood while charging on yours...

 

[CMYK4Life]

I do not have a L2 at my house. I have been charging at L1 since day one. It works for me.

My RT commute is 40 miles or less so I have plenty for running around after work.

I typically roll in at 30-50% then charge back to 80% so it does not even take all night.

 

[EVDRIVER]

Your thread title is confusing and should be edited. Nissan recommends 240V because:

Safer, 120V outlets fail often and are the weak spot in EV charging
more efficient
allows for longer battery life due to less cycling of the pack if you pre-heat as 120 can't handle the load fully
off peak charging if you can't do it with 120V
quick opportunity charging

 

[LeftieBiker]

allows for longer battery life due to less cycling of the pack if you pre-heat as 120 can't handle the load fully

We'll see, in time. L-1 may allow for less heat buildup while charging in mild weather, due to heating at a lower rate. It may even be better in hot weather.

 

[Pipcecil]

Level 1 works for many people, especially if you don't drive much, but for many people, its just not fast enough. A FULL charge from dead (turtle really) takes 21 hours in a leaf. That's hard marketing to swallow. The i3 would take less (maybe ~20 hours). Level 1 only supplies 1.1 kW per hour. For a Telsa its not a "day" but DAYS! You are looking at 77 hoursish from a dead battery. That is over 3 days (I think its less - Tesla has a charging scale on their site). Level 2's are just so much faster (especially with faster on board chargers), slightly more efficient, and run the ability that, when installed correctly, you won't have any plug overheating/overloading issues (yes anything else on that circuit will trip the breaker).

So its all around usually better. But for those that don't commute more than a few miles a day, Level 1 works fine.

Also, the reason why you probably never heard about level 1 on the BMW i3 drives - look at the clientele - BMW type shoppers (in general) and usually a little more well off than those that purchase other car brands (BMW is upscale). So that type of clientele is probably not going to even blink at the additional level 2 installation cost.

 

[adric22]

I'll echo what other people have said. We also used the 120V for several weeks. It "works" but there were several occasions where it became frustrating waiting so long to charge. So we caved in and installed a 240V station. However, that was when my wife was driving the Leaf on a longer commute. Now we have two EVs. I'm driving the Volt almost exclusively now and I charge every day on 120V and it is no problem. But my commute is MUCH shorter at around 12 miles round-trip.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

I'll chime in too. L1 is plenty fast for me. I broke down and bought an L2 EVSE for convenience sake - it is mounted on the wall of my garage. Although I no longer bring the L1 cable with me when I travel, so I just leave it in the garage too. I could have saved $500, but what's done is done.

I have been driving my Leaf for 27 months now and MAYBE twice did L1 or L2 make a difference in how far I could or could not drive. For me, the speed of L1 is enough. It would be even less important if I had a Tesla since, as was already mentioned, you don't need to have a full charge before you leave, you only need enough of a charge to make your trip.

As for Nissan's reasons, I can't think of any reason not already mentioned. The big ones are safety (dedicated, typically hard-wired, circuit), efficiency (less charge time = less overhead) and marketing (when the Ford Focus Electric was released, they pushed hard on the fact that they could charge at 6.6kW while the Leaf was limited to 3.3kW even though Nissan supported Quick Charging and Ford still doesn't...but I digress...).

I do suspect that L1 charging will actually be better for the longevity of the battery since it should generate less heat while charging. Keep in mind that the power into the battery is I*V while the power lost to internal heat is I^2*R. This means that if L1 is about 1/3 the power of L2, it will generate 1/9 the heat within the battery.

 

[TomT]

L2 charging is at such a low C rate as to make no practical difference over L1. There is even anecdotal evidence that the higher C rate is better for the battery (look back for some older threads on the subject here)...

We'll see, in time. L-1 may allow for less heat buildup while charging in mild weather, due to heating at a lower rate. It may even be better in hot weather.