2016 LEAF Specifications

[GoldenDragon]

Is the Kia Soul EV available in Ireland? It has almost an identical range at 62mph (100km/h), about 107 miles (171km).

Soul EV is available in Ireland according to a google search. I know they've had trouble meeting demand for the car with many people complaining about paying a reservation fee and then waiting 6-11 months. Hopefully that time is over... US EPA rates Soul EV at 93 miles while the 2016 Leaf gets 107 miles from EPA. Even if the Soul has slightly more usable battery, it must be heavier and/or less aerodynamic.

 

[DaveEV]

I estimate 26.5kWh usable:

107 miles range / 4 miles per kWh (@65mph) = 26.5kWh

The Kia Soul EV is 27kWh usable.

One can look at it from the other end using EPA ratings:

24 kWh LEAF rated 84 mi @ 30 kWh / 100 mi = 25.2 kWh (from the wall)
30 kWh LEAF rated 107 mi @ 30 kWh / 100 mi = 32.1 kWh (from the wall)

The LEAF's OBC efficiency on L2 is 85-90% which gives us:

24 kWh LEAF: 21.4 - 22.7 kWh usable
30 kWh LEAF: 27.3 - 28.9 kWh usable

The Soul EV is rated at 32 kWh / 100 mi = 29.8 kWh (from the wall). Assuming similar OBC efficiency as the LEAF that's 25.3 - 26.8 kWh usable. Of course, the Soul's EPA rating is probably an average of 80/100% charging, so add 10% to those numbers:
102 mi @ 32 kWh / 100 mi = 32.6 kWh (from the wall), 27.7 - 29.4 kWh usable - basically the same amount of usable energy as the 30 kWh LEAF.

 

[RegGuheert]

Nissan has now released the Leaf they promised us in 2011 (100 mile range, battery lasting at least 8 years).

Certainly true.

Another way to look at this is that they have increased the battery capacity by 25% in five years while simultaneously improving the durability of the battery. That's a capacity improvement of 4.6% per year on top of the improvement of durability (which competes directly against capacity improvements). So we're not quite getting the 8% per year that Carlos Ghosn once suggested, but still this is a nice incremental improvement.

Also note that range increased slightly more than capacity: 107 mi/84 mi = 127%. This is true even though the new battery is 7% heavier than the old one. This is likely mainly due to Peukert's Law, which is related to the disharge of a battery at different rates relative to its capacity. In addition, I suspect the new module design may provide lower overall pack resistance.

It also seems my prediction that Nissan would not use different module designs in a given model year was incorrect. That makes sense, since maintaining system voltages is critically important.

Just like we have seen steady range improvements of the Boeing 737 for five full decades, we should expect the same kind of steady improvements with the Nissan LEAF (or its equivalent in the marketplace) for many decades to come.

The next big bump in capacity for the LEAF should come by adding more batteries, perhaps in the upcoming platform refresh. I expect 30 kWh to become the new base capacity, but I'm not sure if they can really fit 60 kWh worth of batteries, as that would add at least 700 lbs. to the vehicle. What I don't see right now is how they can add a fractional amount, say 50% more (45 kWh), and maintain the system voltage. One way this COULD be accomplished is by building another new module type with six cells instead of eight and including twice as many six-cell modules as the eight-cell versions used in the 2016s. Since they are currently fielding two different modules today which have different cell sizes, I guess it would be easier to field two different modules with the same size cells included. (24 X 8-cell modules for 30 kWh and 48 X 6-cell modules for 45 kWh, each battery giving the same system voltage just below 400V. The 45-kWh option would weigh about 350 pounds more and provide an EPA range of around 160 miles.)

 

[JPWhite]

[

Another way to look at this is that they have increased the battery capacity by 25% in five years while simultaneously improving the durability of the battery. That's a capacity improvement of 4.6% per year on top of the improvement of durability (which competes directly against capacity improvements). So we're not quite getting the 8% per year that Carlos Ghosn once suggested, but still this is a nice incremental improvement.

Nice summary.

I find it interesting to compare the capacity increases at Tesla. They've increased their base model from 60kWh to 70kWh in approximately 3 years, or about 5.5% increase per year. Musk said recently he expects to see 5% increase per year, I suppose his 5% estimate is more accurate than Ghosn's 8% thanks to the benefit of hindsight.

So it maybe that 5% per year improvement is what we can expect as a rule of thumb for EV's in general?

You took the time in your summary to explain why the increase in capacity and module redesign makes it incompatible with the older LEAF's. Thanks for the insight. I have to wonder however how Tesla was/is able to make cars with multiple pack sizes, and increase those multiple capacities over time with apparent ease. Is their design inherently more extensible and the Nissan design inflexible? If that's the case I hope the LEAF 2.0 is designed with an eye to multiple pack sizes and growing pack sizes to provide more retrofit options and minimize the number of different replacement packs they have to keep in stock for the older models as they age.

 

[RegGuheert]

You took the time in your summary to explain why the increase in capacity and module redesign makes it incompatible with the older LEAF's. Thanks for the insight.

Actually, I'm not convinced that it is. I think both mechanical and electrical characteristics are the same. However, I'm wondering about something someone mentioned up-thread: Does the 2016 LEAF somehow blow cabin air across the new battery? I don't know.

I have to wonder however how Tesla was/is able to make cars with multiple pack sizes, and increase those multiple capacities over time with apparent ease. Is their design inherently more extensible and the Nissan design inflexible? If that's the case I hope the LEAF 2.0 is designed with an eye to multiple pack sizes and growing pack sizes to provide more retrofit options and minimize the number of different replacement packs they have to keep in stock for the older models as they age.

Tesla's design is based on very small cells and there are many cells in parallel, which provides lots of granularity in the capacities which are achievable at the same battery voltage. The Nissan LEAF has very large cells and they currently have two cells in parallel, even in both 2016 versions of the battery. (I believe the new 8-cell modules must have twice the voltage of the previous 4-cell modules.) I think the next step is three cells in parallel (which is achievable in 6-cell modules like the Chevy Volt uses), which means a 50% bump in capacity.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

The 2016 Nissan LEAF has a starting price of $33,700 for the SV model and $36,790 for LEAF SL.

LEAF S models continue to be equipped with a 24 kWh battery with an EPA-estimated range of 84* miles. Starting price for 2016 Nissan LEAF S grade remains $29,010. All models qualify for federal tax incentives of $7500.

your pricing makes no sense. Why is the SV essentially the same when the SL is going up $1600?

 

[OrientExpress]

SV should be $34200. Thanks for catching the typo.

 

[edatoakrun]

I estimate 26.5kWh usable:

107 miles range / 4 miles per kWh (@65mph) = 26.5kWh

The Kia Soul EV is 27kWh usable.

One can look at it from the other end using EPA ratings:

24 kWh LEAF rated 84 mi @ 30 kWh / 100 mi = 25.2 kWh (from the wall)
30 kWh LEAF rated 107 mi @ 30 kWh / 100 mi = 32.1 kWh (from the wall)

The LEAF's OBC efficiency on L2 is 85-90% which gives us:

24 kWh LEAF: 21.4 - 22.7 kWh usable
30 kWh LEAF: 27.3 - 28.9 kWh usable

The Soul EV is rated at 32 kWh / 100 mi = 29.8 kWh (from the wall). Assuming similar OBC efficiency as the LEAF that's 25.3 - 26.8 kWh usable. Of course, the Soul's EPA rating is probably an average of 80/100% charging, so add 10% to those numbers:
102 mi @ 32 kWh / 100 mi = 32.6 kWh (from the wall), 27.7 - 29.4 kWh usable - basically the same amount of usable energy as the 30 kWh LEAF.

Actual average baseline capacities and %s accessible from test results on the AVTA fleets:

http://avt.inel.gov/fsev.shtml

2012 Nissan LEAF: 23.4 kWh static, ~90% accessible from a "100%" L2 charge, ~21.0 kWh available.

2013 Nissan LEAF: 24.2 kWh static, ~90% accessible from a "100%" L2 charge, ~21.8 kWh available.

2011, 2014, and 2015 LEAFs not tested.

2014 Kia Soul: ~30.5 kWh static, % available kWh from a "100%" charge not yet posted by AVTA.

http://avt.inel.gov/fsev.shtml

So, if the "30 kWh" battery in your 2016 LEAF actually meets spec, and if the same ~90% of the battery is available to you, as was the case for 2012-13 LEAFs, you should get to use ~27 kWh.

The 2016 "30 kWh" LEAFs should be expected to have quite a bit more range than the 2014-16 Kias, especially at higher speeds, even though the Kia may have a slightly larger battery capacity.

The LEAF's ~15% increased efficiency on the highway (92/108) MPGe rating should mean the range advantage for the LEAF over the Soul will be well over 15% at typical freeway speeds

 

[EVforRobert]

SV should be $34200. Thanks for catching the typo.

Not having LED low beam headlights optional on the SV is an effective price increase for me. I would have to get the 2016 SL at $2,030 more than my 2015 SV + LED.

 

[kubel]

Does the 2016 have CarPlay or the Android equivalent? Very tired of the useless 2013 radio/gps.

No. It's got Nissan Connect EV, which has smartphone app integration and Google online search with send-to-car, along with some EV specific features. It's one of the better systems on the market and is far superior to the 2011-2015 Hitachi-Clarion / Windows Embedded Auto 7 unit, but it's not Apple CarPlay or Android Auto, which set the standard now.

 

[pkulak]

Does the 2016 have CarPlay or the Android equivalent? Very tired of the useless 2013 radio/gps.

No. It's got Nissan Connect EV, which has smartphone app integration and Google online search with send-to-car, along with some EV specific features. It's one of the better systems on the market and is far superior to the 2011-2015 Hitachi-Clarion / Windows Embedded Auto 7 unit, but it's not Apple CarPlay or Android Auto, which set the standard now.

How do you know it's good? Is it on other Nissans already? What is it based on? Is it 100% home grown?

 

[TomT]

PC Mag was not that impressed by Nissan Connect... Other reviews that I have seen have given it 2-3 out of 5 stars on average...

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2488968,00.asp

How do you know it's good? Is it on other Nissans already? What is it based on? Is it 100% home grown?

 

[OrientExpress]

The base version on Nissan Connect started trickling out on other Nissan cars in 2014. It will eventually be on all Nissans, and will eventually support Android Auto and Apple CarPlay.

 

[o00scorpion00o]

One really good feature they could also have added would be active cruise control.

A power upgrade would be nice too, I'm sure the leaf is limited by a good margin. They certainly have it limited on take off too much.

Is the Kia Soul EV available in Ireland? It has almost an identical range at 62mph (100km/h), about 107 miles (171km).

The Kia Soul EV is not available in the Republic of Ireland, perhaps in Northern Ireland.

Kia Ireland decided they wouldn't import the Soul Ev because they needed xx amount of orders to make it worth their while. I asked them why then don't ye advertise it on the website or have it in the brochure ? They said because most people here want diesel and that's all they advertise and I asked why don't ye advertise it then and give people the choice ? they had no answer to that. Complete and utter nonsense, they don't want to sell the EV in Ireland because they don't want to have to spend money kitting out the workshop or retraining staff for what they feel will give them little in return.

 

[JPWhite]

PC Mag was not that impressed by it... Other reviews that I have seen have given it 2-3 out of 5 stars on average...

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2488968,00.asp

How do you know it's good? Is it on other Nissans already? What is it based on? Is it 100% home grown?

Their summary paragraph sums it up well

"Nissan isn't alone in the struggle to replicate the interfaces and features we've become accustomed to on our mobile device. But NissanConnect's implementation in the 2015 Murano's is an example of just how difficult this process can be, and how it translates into a poorly executed system that an owner will have to live with for years to come."

 

[pkulak]

PC Mag was not that impressed by it... Other reviews that I have seen have given it 2-3 out of 5 stars on average...

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2488968,00.asp

How do you know it's good? Is it on other Nissans already? What is it based on? Is it 100% home grown?

That's odd that people hate on it. I admit, Android Auto would be 100x better, but of the other systems I've used, my current Leaf one is, I'd say, the best. I've tried Mercedes and BMW's, and while I see the point about keeping the screen up high and not actually touching it, in practice it's a giant pain in the ass to do that. I haven't tried Kia's new setup, but that one seems legitimately better. Of course, with GM putting Android Auto and Apple Car Play in all their new cars, they are the winners in this contest.

So, if the new system is better than the current one, I'll be happy with it.

EDIT: Looks pretty nice to me:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPE75tGHyoA

Not sure what everyone complains about.

 

[o00scorpion00o]

It looks good in the Pic above, but it's how it performs and how easy it is to operate is what matters.

People are used to Android and android is cheap and easy to use so why not just use it ? simple google maps integration.

I don't use the Leaf Nav because after using Google maps it's a disaster to operate. I use LG Urbane for Nav now, I just say "ok Google, Navigate me to Dublin Airport " etc and it just works and it's very simple and very fast to operate, and the directions come up on the watch, the Nissan nav is a disaster in comparison as is even the Nav in my Brothers 2014 Audi A4.

You could easily do this in the Leaf with Android head unit, really simple and extremely fast and effective.

 

[DanCar]

It looks good in the Pic above, but it's how it performs and how easy it is to operate is what matters.

People are used to Android and android is cheap and easy to use so why not just use it ? simple google maps integration.

I don't use the Leaf Nav because after using Google maps it's a disaster to operate. I use LG Urbane for Nav now, I just say "ok Google, Navigate me to Dublin Airport " etc and it just works and it's very simple and very fast to operate, and the directions come up on the watch, the Nissan nav is a disaster in comparison as is even the Nav in my Brothers 2014 Audi A4.

You could easily do this in the Leaf with Android head unit, really simple and extremely fast and effective.

Well said. My experiences are the same. I'm amazed of people desiring a good car navigation system for thousands when a $200 phone will do a much better job.

 

[JPWhite]

You could easily do this in the Leaf with Android head unit, really simple and extremely fast and effective.

Well said. My experiences are the same. I'm amazed of people desiring a good car navigation system for thousands when a $200 phone will do a much better job.[/quote]

Agreed an Android head unit with the ability to load apps like Waze would totally awesome!!

The one feature on my 2011 LEAF head unit that is really good is the ability to perform touch screen operations with gloves on. Real handy in the winter when you don't have a heated steering wheel Can't do that on a smart phone.

Here's a question. If Nissan did provide an Android head unit, who would be the first upgrade their device to Marshmallow, Verizon or Nissan? Neither is a valid response :-(

 

[TomT]

Wow, maybe we look at it differently but the system in my Leaf is the worst I have had in any car in ten years...

of the other systems I've used, my current Leaf one is, I'd say, the best.