Deceptively fast?

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Boomer23

Well-known member
Joined
May 23, 2010
Messages
3,561
Location
Orange County, CA
Most of us who have our LEAFs seem to think that the LEAF is pretty quick off the line. Back last summer, Nissan claimed that the LEAF was as fast as a V6 Infiinti M35 up to 30 or 40 mph (I forget). I've seen comments that some of us think that we can beat almost anything off the line (we know that they'll catch up to us pretty quickly). I myself enjoy zooming off the line and realizing how small the rest of the cars become in the rear view mirror after just a few seconds.

So I was looking for evidence that this is true. I figured that this seat-of-the pants impression should show up as a fairly fast time up to 30 mph or so, and then tail off to the 9.4 seconds to 60 mph that we're aware of.

I wanted to get some comparisons of acceleration for "average" cars in these speed ranges. It turned out to be difficult to find acceleration results for "average" cars in recent magazines. Seems like they mostly want to test super cars these days. So I dipped back to a 1999 R&T issue and found a Volkswagen New Beetle 1.8 T with a 0-60 time of 7.1 seconds and a comparo test of an Acura Integra GS-R, a Mitsu Eclipse GT, and a Toyota Celica GTS with similar 7 second 0-60 times.

The bottom line is that I can't demonstrate that the LEAF is faster, or even as fast as these cars at lower speed ranges.

So I'm going to conclude that it's the feel of instant torque and the quietness of the drivetrain that convince us that we're accelerating faster than we really are. Either that, or we need some measurements of time to distance rather than time to speed (would that show any different results?)

I'd love to see some video of timed drag races of a LEAF against some average commutermobiles. Anyone want to film some?

LEAF: R&T Feb 2011
0-20 mph 1.8 sec
0-30 mph 3.0 sec
0-40 mph 4.6 sec

R&T Nov 1999
VW New Beetle 1.8T
0-30 mph 2.3 sec
0-40 mph 3.8 sec

Acura Integra GS-R
0-20 mph 1.6 sec
0-40 mph 4.0 sec

Mitsubishi Eclipse GT
0-20 mph 1.4 sec
0-40 mph 3.9 sec

Toyota Celica GT-S
0-20 mph 1.3 sec
0-40 mph 3.8 sec
 
Sorry, I don't have exact data, but compared to other 0-60 in 7ish cars I have owned the Leaf feels quicker in the 15mph-40mph range, but then starts to drop off noticeably. I think your perception is right that the Leaf is better than average at lower speeds, but then as you start to get closer to freeway speeds it falls behind. So the idea of you pulling ahead of someone only to have them soon pass you up again is probably true. But if you are just driving around town at < 40MPH then it is ahead of the pack.
 
The Acura GSR (owned one) is a high RPM motor that really needs to rev to get any torque, the fact that it beats the LEAF to 40 shows your idea of perception of speed is more of the reality here. Nissan over hyped the 0-60 of the car and the low speed numbers. My 4200 lb V6 truck will crush the LEAF off the line and from there on. The LEAF motor has high torque but low HP, like running in 4WD low but it is still not very quick off the line. I think the NIssan Execs finally realized their comments were based on perception rather then reality, I think the LEAF would have been a much better EV had a few Nissan Execs drove the early models and had more EV experience, saying it was faster then a GTR was dumb.
 
I guess that we should continue to drag race against other drivers who don't know we're racing, huh? That turns out to be fairly impressive every time. Plus, there's no way to rev a LEAF to get their attention. :)
 
Boomer23 said:
So I dipped back to a 1999 R&T issue and found a Volkswagen New Beetle 1.8 T with a 0-60 time of 7.1 seconds and a comparo test of an Acura Integra GS-R, a Mitsu Eclipse GT, and a Toyota Celica GTS with similar 7 second 0-60 times.
Keep in mind that the results for these cars are all most likely manual transmissions which require a decent amount of skill and a certain amount of abuse to produce those types of performance figures.

Your average Joe isn't going to be able to get close to those numbers.

Even when testing automatics the magazines will use left-foot braking to load up the torque converter when launching - who does that in real life?

In contrast - all you have to do w/the LEAF is floor it.
 
I was in the left lane at a stop light when a guy in a red mid 2000 something Mustang pulls up next to me in the right lane. His lane is blocked by parked cars ahead about mid block so I know what he wants to do. I couldn't resist the Leaf launch and shut the door on him.
Mustang guy was very pissed off, and when he got around the parked car and i slowed for the red light ahead, he swerved at me, and pulled in front of me. After the finger, he backed into my Leaf! Fortunately it only damaged the license plate. What a sore loser you are Washington plate number 333 NII. :D :D :D
 
JohnnySebring said:
I was in the left lane at a stop light when a guy in a red mid 2000 something Mustang pulls up next to me in the right lane. His lane is blocked by parked cars ahead about mid block so I know what he wants to do. I couldn't resist the Leaf launch and shut the door on him.
Mustang guy was very pissed off, and when he got around the parked car and i slowed for the red light ahead, he swerved at me, and pulled in front of me. After the finger, he backed into my Leaf! Fortunately it only damaged the license plate. What a sore loser you are Washington plate number 333 NII. :D :D :D

you have big a-holes in WA?
 
Perhaps he wasn't planning on racing you and just assumed that you would be courteous and let him in, which you weren't and didn't... I pretty much think if racing had been his original intent, he could have blown the doors off of you. Even a V6 automatic late model Mustang is faster to 20 and 30 than the Leaf according to R/T and C/D...


JohnnySebring said:
I was in the left lane at a stop light when a guy in a red mid 2000 something Mustang pulls up next to me in the right lane. His lane is blocked by parked cars ahead about mid block so I know what he wants to do. I couldn't resist the Leaf launch and shut the door on him.
Mustang guy was very pissed off, and when he got around the parked car and i slowed for the red light ahead, he swerved at me, and pulled in front of me. After the finger, he backed into my Leaf! Fortunately it only damaged the license plate. What a sore loser you are Washington plate number 333 NII. :D :D :D
 
I had an Integra Type R for 11 yrs. I would say, 0-35 or so the LEAF will blow it away easily. However, in a quarter mile, the Type R will be faster that the LEAF, by a wide margin. The Type R needs to be launched at around 3K rpm or so, then switch gear at the redline around 8500 rpm from then on. Launching it at that rpm is tricky, since the front wheels tend to skid and hop, need to have good tires. Too bad I sold it already, I would like to drag race a LEAF( in the track of course).
 
Except for the wheel spin, I like that is QUIET from take off. No waiting for the revs to build or loud air sucking manifold and exhaust. Easy to go quickly without drawing undue attention (police) when accelerating. Queued up waiting to turn left into high school to drop daughter off yesterday and beat the opposing driver across intersection without waking the neighborhood or the cemetery.
 
Bud said:
Queued up waiting to turn left into high school to drop daughter off yesterday and beat the opposing driver across intersection without waking the neighborhood or the cemetery.

Yes it's always good to speed around schools....
 
It might also have something to do with the fact that so many of us are coming from Priuses or 4-cylinder economy cars. The LEAF feels like a race car after driving the Prius around.
 
Feels fast off the line, no deception there. For me the deception is midrange acceleration. No downshift clunk, no exhaust noise, no real motor noise so it seems like nothing is happening. But then the speedo is showing 75+ before I think it should. Everything is so smooth it seems deceptively fast to me. Not a muscle car but still seems to easily get out of its own way.
 
drees said:
Keep in mind that the results for these cars are all most likely manual transmissions which require a decent amount of skill and a certain amount of abuse to produce those types of performance figures.

Your average Joe isn't going to be able to get close to those numbers.

Even when testing automatics the magazines will use left-foot braking to load up the torque converter when launching - who does that in real life?

In contrast - all you have to do w/the LEAF is floor it.


Great point, and one that I didn't consider, drees. R&T even documents their launch procedures, and they are very much as you say.
 
I would agree that the LEAF is a very easy car to drive quickly around town. It is wonderfully torquey between 15-40. Your average daily driver ICE has to be driven much harder (and louder) to be as brisk. Most people don't enjoy the fatigue of driving their random gas cars like this so it's advantage LEAF.

I for one am eagerly awaiting Nissan's EV sports car announcement. That's when there will be alot more to talk about on this subject.
 
mogur said:
I pretty much think if racing had been his original intent, he could have blown the doors off of you. Even a V6 automatic late model Mustang is faster to 20 and 30 than the Leaf according to R/T and C/D...

I doubt it. He isn't going to hold the brake with his left foot to increase his torque which he would have to do to beat the LEAF off the line. Also, it depends on his reaction time to the green light. Some drivers have much faster reaction times than others.
 
TRONZ said:
I for one am eagerly awaiting Nissan's EV sports car announcement. That's when there will be a lot more to talk about on this subject.
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+1

This is exactly why I leased my Leaf. We are only a family of 2, so a 2 seater sports car EV is what I really want to buy. However, in the meantime, I'm enjoying the Leaf with out lining the oil baron's pockets :mrgreen:
 
davewill said:
It might also have something to do with the fact that so many of us are coming from Priuses or 4-cylinder economy cars. The LEAF feels like a race car after driving the Prius around.

Very true. I also own a 2007 Prius, and it feels outright "clunky" compared to the Leaf. Significant other refuses to drive the Prius now. Leaf or nothing is her motto ! :)
 
Good point. I come from primarily high performance 6s in light vehicles so maybe that is why it is not as impressive to me...

davewill said:
It might also have something to do with the fact that so many of us are coming from Priuses or 4-cylinder economy cars. The LEAF feels like a race car after driving the Prius around.
 
JohnnySebring said:
I was in the left lane at a stop light when a guy in a red mid 2000 something Mustang pulls up next to me in the right lane. His lane is blocked by parked cars ahead about mid block so I know what he wants to do. I couldn't resist the Leaf launch and shut the door on him.
Mustang guy was very pissed off, and when he got around the parked car and i slowed for the red light ahead, he swerved at me, and pulled in front of me. After the finger, he backed into my Leaf! Fortunately it only damaged the license plate. What a sore loser you are Washington plate number 333 NII. :D :D :D

Finger is one thing, but backing up... wouldn't this be grounds for reporting the driver to authorities? He could've pulled out a gun just as easily as he backed up into a car. For that reason I have DVR in my car that records all the A-holes in Mustangs or BMWs or whatever their car choice might be.
 
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