RNeil
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Was I wrong to buy a car with CHAdeMO?

I recently bought a 2021 Leaf. Now I learn that the CHAdeMO interface is being phased out.

I am looking at a trip from Richmond to Shenandoah National Park. This is long enough for me to get range anxiety. I would charge at home and at SNP using J1772, but there are limited opportunities in rural areas. The only intermediate stop that is not significantly out of the way is at Zion Crossroads. Electrify America has 7 CCS/SAE plugs and one CHAdeMO. And EA is phasing out CHAdeMO.

Was I wrong to buy a Leaf?
Is there an adapter that lets me use a CCA charger?
Is or will there be a way to convert my car to CCS/SAE?
LeftieBiker
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Re: Was I wrong to buy a car with CHAdeMO?

There is no way to convert, and at present no adapter. Don't get too upset, though: Chademo will be around for about another 10 years, and will likely be reasonably well maintained (if you define that a bit loosely) for another 5. Even when you lose that functionality, you should be able to sell the car to someone who wants it for local use.
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cwerdna
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Re: Was I wrong to buy a car with CHAdeMO?

There's no adapter.

You can blame VW-owned Electrify America for their shenanigans. They weren't forced to be standards neutral in their deployments so they only have 1 CHAdeMO at each site w/current deployments vs. usually 5 to 7 CCS plugs. Sometimes, the ratio is as bad as 1 vs. 19. Obviously, they cared much about their VW AG's business interests (e.g. VW, Audi and Porsche). Oh well.

I don't know which Richmond you're coming from. There are numerous cities w/that name in North America. All I can suggest is checking Plugshare and make sure to have plenty of backups, where possible. Be well-prepared (e.g. logged into apps, RFID cards registered w/network where available (EA doesn't have any), etc.) to charge wherever.

https://www.chademo.com/ is likely alive and well in Japan with over 7700 chargers in a country about 89% (IIRC) the size of California.

You may also run into rapidgate probs on hot days esp. if you plan to DC FC multiple times/day.

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SageBrush
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Re: Was I wrong to buy a car with CHAdeMO?

Between low-ish speed DC charging, rapid/cold gating and the state of CHAdeMO, I think if fair to say that the LEAF is not a general purpose car for most people.

Oddly enough though, I'm pretty pleased with CHAdeMO as a backup plan 'B' or 'C' for my Tesla. Southeast NM, Colorado, and Western Canada have or are slated to get CHAdeMO plugs that will nicely supplement the Tesla charging networks. With some luck, Tesla will release a CCS adapter before CHAdeMO is completely useless.
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RNeil
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Re: Was I wrong to buy a car with CHAdeMO?

I was referring to Richmond, Virginia. Richmond and Charlottesville have many places to charge. Charlottesville is a detour if you are going to Shenandoah National Park. The closer you get to the mountains, the harder it is to find chargers.
WetEV
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Re: Was I wrong to buy a car with CHAdeMO?

SageBrush wrote: Tue Sep 28, 2021 8:33 pm Between low-ish speed DC charging, rapid/cold gating and the state of CHAdeMO, I think if fair to say that the LEAF is not a general purpose car for most people.

Oddly enough though, I'm pretty pleased with CHAdeMO as a backup plan 'B' or 'C' for my Tesla. Southeast NM, Colorado, and Western Canada have or are slated to get CHAdeMO plugs that will nicely supplement the Tesla charging networks. With some luck, Tesla will release a CCS adapter before CHAdeMO is completely useless.
Sage is a bit biased against Nissan and the LEAF, as you might notice.

Chademo network in the Pacific NW is fairly good as well. Was better than CCS until a year or two ago. Still a few routes with better Chademo coverage.
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WetEV
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Re: Was I wrong to buy a car with CHAdeMO?

cwerdna wrote: Tue Sep 28, 2021 3:32 pm There's no adapter.

You can blame VW-owned Electrify America for their shenanigans. They weren't forced to be standards neutral in their deployments so they only have 1 CHAdeMO at each site w/current deployments vs. usually 5 to 7 CCS plugs. Sometimes, the ratio is as bad as 1 vs. 19. Obviously, they cared much about their VW AG's business interests (e.g. VW, Audi and Porsche). Oh well.
CCS is BMW, Daimler, FCA, Ford, Jaguar, General Motors, Groupe PSA, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Mazda, MG, Polestar, Renault, Tesla, Tata Motors and Volkswagen Group

vs

Chademo is Nissan


Europe, China and Japan are different. And I'd expect them to remain different for a long time.

Exactly one open and public standard is what is needed.

Cost, confusion, reliability, availability are all worse with more than one standard.

Chademo was dying before EA started. No point blaming EA.

Oh, and XKCD

https://xkcd.com/927/

Image
WetEV
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Most everything around here is wet during the rainy season. And the rainy season is long.
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oxothuk
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Re: Was I wrong to buy a car with CHAdeMO?

SageBrush wrote: Tue Sep 28, 2021 8:33 pm Between low-ish speed DC charging, rapid/cold gating and the state of CHAdeMO, I think if fair to say that the LEAF is not a general purpose car for most people.
If you mean it’s not suited to be an ONLY car for most people, then I agree. If you mean it’s not suited to be a MAIN car for most people, then I disagree.
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WetEV
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Re: Was I wrong to buy a car with CHAdeMO?

RNeil wrote: Wed Sep 29, 2021 5:45 am I was referring to Richmond, Virginia. Richmond and Charlottesville have many places to charge. Charlottesville is a detour if you are going to Shenandoah National Park. The closer you get to the mountains, the harder it is to find chargers.
Look for places to stay/eat with charging. Examples

https://www.plugshare.com/location/61580

https://www.plugshare.com/location/79979

Any RV park with "50 Amp" power. Like https://www.plugshare.com/location/17153

Some hotels have RV "50 Amp" available in the parking lot.

A nice dinner can take a couple of hours.

https://www.plugshare.com/location/187554

"Tesla Destination" chargers are controlled by the location's management. Ask before you book, some locations have adapters and most will let you charge with an adapter.
WetEV
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jlv
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Re: Was I wrong to buy a car with CHAdeMO?

RNeil wrote: Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:24 pm And EA is phasing out CHAdeMO.
That EA is phasing out CHAdeMO only means they are no longer installing additional CHAdeMO plugs (outside of Calif). Existing ones should still be around for a long time (probably until the stations break).
RNeil wrote: Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:24 pm Was I wrong to buy a Leaf?
The LEAF is a great regional car, and a bargain for the price you can get it for. You probably weren't wrong to buy it. It will probably easily handle all your driving, with the exception of long car trips (those requiring multiple DCFC sessions).

It *is* possible to do a longer trip like you are asking about in the LEAF. It's not ideal, because of the slow DC charging speed. It's worse because DC charging is even slower when the LEAF's battery gets hot ("rapidgate"); this is especially a problem when doing more than 1 DCFC on the same day.

The particular round trip you mention (to Shenandoah N.P. and back) looks like this:

https://abetterrouteplanner.com/?plan_u ... 70b971b636 <<< OPEN THIS LINK
.
va 62.JPG
This plan is for a Plus (62kWh battery). With two DCFC sessions, you are pushing the limits of the LEAF because of rapidgate. If you don't have a Plus, the trip requires 3 DCFC sessions, and ABRP lengths the trip by almost another hour, from 5:57 to 6:49. But I'd worry it would be far longer with the effects of rapidgate. If you don't have a Plus, I would think twice about this trip in your LEAF.

FWIW, same trip takes over 90 minutes less in a Model 3 LR, with just one 7 minute charging session on the return. But you would only buy into the cost of a Tesla if you regularly needed the flexibility to do longer trips in that car.
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