Why would anyone buy a nissan leaf right now???

My Nissan Leaf Forum

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Reliability
Tesla Model 3 is a beautiful car, and I'm sure I would have been happy to get it, but overall reliability was one of the main reasons I chose to get a Leaf instead. Here are the Consumer Reports and JD Powers articles that influenced my decision:

"Consumer Reports Still Ranks Tesla Reliability 27th Out Of 28" (19.Nov.2021)
https://insideevs.com/news/549130/consumerreports-tesla-reliability-poor-2021/

"Unlike other manufacturers, Tesla doesn’t grant J.D. Power permission to survey its owners..." (18.Feb.2021)
Tesla was fourth in the bottom for dependability; only Jaguar, Alpha and Land Rover were worse.
https://www.jdpower.com/business/press-releases/2021-us-vehicle-dependability-study-vds

"Nissan LEAF Awarded In 2020 J.D. Power Vehicle Dependability Study" in the compact car category (15.Feb.2020)
https://insideevs.com/news/398848/nissan-leaf-award-vehicle-dependability-study/

Distance to Dealership
While the Tesla is more sporty and stylish, those considerations kind of fade after a year, especially when you have to drive to a distant Tesla Service Center to fix a quality problem and wait in the lobby or at a hotel. My Nissan dealership is only 6 miles away if I need a repair, so I could take a Lyft/Uber back home if necessary. As an example, there are 49 Nissan dealerships in Pennsylvania, but only 3 for Tesla. Here is where you can check in your state to compare:
https://www.nissanusa.com/nissandealers/location/
https://www.tesla.com/findus/list/services/United%20States

Road Noise
Another big issue for me was road noise (I have tinnitus) and there are too many negative YouTube videos by the Tesla owners themselves about Model 3 road noise:
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=tesla+road+wind+noise

Immediate Availability and Zero Interest Financing
I don't know what kind of financing Tesla offers, but I got zero percent interest from Nissan for 6 years and drove the Leaf off the lot that afternoon, no waiting 4-9 months. Taking into account the $7500 tax rebate, rising inflation (versus my fixed payments), the lower sticker price of the Leaf, the lower expected maintenance costs/hassles versus the Tesla, and my plan to invest the $10,000+ I'm not paying extra for the Tesla, then the Leaf was just too good overall. (I'm a fanboy of financial independence.)

Obsolete CHAdeMO
It's best to avoid any kind of rapid charging, so the CHAdeMO port is not a big deal. My utility company has a "Free Nights and Weekends" plan, which means that my electricity bill won't go up at all (the free weekends offset the higher weekday rates, leaving the nights for Leaf charging for free). Check with your utility company to see what plans are available to you. You don't need to buy a third-party EVSE for scheduling your at-night charging, that's built into the Leaf's dashboard already.

This forum helped me make a decision regarding Leaf vs. Tesla (thank you!) so that's why I'm posting the above, to help others like me who visit here who want to make an informed decision, whatever that decision might be. I can only relate my own thought processes. If you get a Tesla, great, enjoy it! I'm very happy with my Leaf.
 
I'd like to make the above into a sticky, if it were combined into one post, but I suspect that there would be loud objections from the gallery if I did that... The next best thing would be for you to put it into a separate topic, with - and this is very important! - a title that is both descriptive and unique, to the extent possible, so that it is easily found with a site search.
 
SageBrush said:
gcrouse said:
The last two times i can recall being told that I wouldn't "get it" with a car was with someone and BMW and someone with a Jeep. In the past that phrase has generally been indicative of "brand as part of a lifestyle" thinking.
Before Tesla we owned a Subaru Impreza, Mitsubishi Mirage, Honda Civic, Toyota hybrids and plug-in and LEAF. Do I match your stereotype ? :lol:

I have ZERO interest in LUCID, and even less in BMW

In short, yes lol. You fit among the fanboy clubs - which is fine since you aren't toxic about it like some in the Tesla community.

BMW fanboys don't like when I point out that the Mercedes-Benz Taxi i rode in overseas seemed just as nice as their BMW and even more miffed i could find a Lincoln Town Car to be a fairly good experience. Jeep fanboys don't like that fact that an '00 Explorer for $2k can work just as well as some of the Wranglers people have.

You believe it's impossible for someone to understand Tesla's appeal if they don't personally drive it on a long trip. That's indicative of fanboy status or in some cases, "brand as a lifestyle." Your earlier comparison to the Mac and Windows computers is quite apt in the fact that often the Mac users would talk constantly about how great their computer was or iPhone. That's the same with a Tesla car. They get a lot more hype than the metrics really deserve, even though as a whole they are decent cars and I could consider one if they came down on price rather than constantly raising it.

You might have zero interest in Lucid and BMW - but those are the big competitors for the price point that Tesla has slid their cars into. The $35,990 Model 3 is not available so we are looking less at the Leaf and Bolt as competition there but Lucid and BMW for what Tesla wants to push off the lines.
 
LeftieBiker said:
The next best thing would be for you to put it into a separate topic, with - and this is very important! - a title that is both descriptive and unique, to the extent possible, so that it is easily found with a site search.

Just posted, thanks.
 
SageBrush said:
gcrouse said:
In short, yes
I see there is no confusing you with facts

I go off of the preponderance of evidence.

It's great you love your Tesla, as life is too short to drive awful cars. (I'm looking at you '92 Geo Prizm).

Even better, despite your Tesla fanboy status - you aren't one of the toxic ones. You certainly have a right to dispute the characterization, and given we only know each other through text - there's a possibility I'm wrong, however the sum of your posts i read tend to evangelize Tesla and when you then start to condescend to people about what they do and don't get citing an intangible experience - well, that points to people who are turning their brand into part of their identity. As i said before there's nothing wrong with it - there's plenty of die hard Ford and Chevy folks who will never buy the other trucks.
 
“…I go off of the preponderance of evidence….

… your Tesla fanboy status …

…there's nothing wrong with it - there's plenty of die hard Ford and Chevy folks who will never buy the other trucks.”

Hard to understand this argument. It reinforces his position. He lists the many vehicles from various manufacturers he has owned and makes no claim he will buy from no other manufacturer in the future.
 
iPlug said:
He lists the many vehicles from various manufacturers he has owned and makes no claim he will buy from no other manufacturer in the future.
True enough, although because my two top priorities are buying an outstanding EV with good value, and buying from an EV centric company, Tesla does not have competition for my dollars for now. Hyundai and some of the Chinese companies like BYD or Nio may be worthy competitors in the future.
 
25 minutes after midnight, and just saw a new Nissan commercial featuring the Ariya and many segments with the Leaf.

I get the feeling they think Leaf still some legs. I do think the Ariya will oddly sell Leafs, just because it's cheaper and good enough for many needs.
 
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0IMgNbIZI4[/youtube]

I'm afraid I only got a third of the way through it. Whenever people talk about floating roofs, I'm out like a light.
 
719 Leafs in Sweden. Combined, Norway (711) and Sweden outsold the US in Leafs in Dec I believe.

https://cleantechnica.com/2022/01/06/swedens-plugin-ev-share-breaks-new-records/

I find it humorous how often now articles will step around talking about the Leaf, even when it continues to sell pretty well. I feel like ev reporters kind of want it to go away.

Over 1100 Leaf sales in Germany in December.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/cleantechnica.com/2022/01/08/germanys-plugin-ev-share-at-record-36-in-december/amp/
 
DougWantsALeaf said:
I get the feeling they think Leaf still some legs. I do think the Ariya will oddly sell Leafs, just because it's cheaper and good enough for many needs.

I think you're on to something there.

Lots of very exciting new EVs coming to market in the coming 24 months, including the Ariya, the BMW iX, the Lucid Air, and the EV trucks from Ford, Hummer, Bollinger, Rivian, etc, The recurring social media buzz I'm seeing though is "cool, but $100k. I wish automakers would make cheap EVs." which, of course, is the exact niche the Leaf exists in, but the Leaf gets no buzz because it's not sexy. Still, if the sexy new EVs get people to see EVs as practical options for ownership, then even a modicum of research will lead people to the Leaf, especially the 62kw models.
 
Got 17k on our 2020 SV. No issues at all.

The winter range is despicable, as expected. 40 miles in cold weather highway driving can take 50% out of the pack. Meanwhile, the stupid range estimate still reports that 50% is good for 70 miles, as if it’s a cool summer evening.

Lease up in the fall and unless car market changes by then we will buy this out.
 
Lots of very exciting new EVs coming to market in the coming 24 months, including the Ariya, the BMW iX, the Lucid Air, and the EV trucks from Ford, Hummer, Bollinger, Rivian, etc, The recurring social media buzz I'm seeing though is "cool, but $100k. I wish automakers would make cheap EVs." which, of course, is the exact niche the Leaf exists in, but the Leaf gets no buzz because it's not sexy. Still, if the sexy new EVs get people to see EVs as practical options for ownership, then even a modicum of research will lead people to the Leaf, especially the 62kw models.

2 good friends of mine just bought new Leafs, not on my say-so, just wanted a decent EV for not too much $$ and looked around at what was available on the lots. I did warn them about chademo but they are plenty smart and plan to charge at home most of the time and they each have other travel vehicles if needed.
 
They could sexy up the Leaf a little - without going over the top - and put a lot of the whining and grumbling to rest.

More weight to the steering, a tweak to the optics, more control over torque steer, it wouldn't take much. It's already a fun car to drive compared to the typical ICE commuter. CCS would help too, of course, but this first and foremost a commuter car. Always has been.

I really think they're missing the boat on that. Easy peasy, and not that expensive either. Fun to drive, all electric, sporty little commuter car. Just goose the sporty part.

Edit: I forgot the affordable part. Absolutely need to hit the price target. Not too pricey, or it turns into something else entirely.
 
I think a lot of it is just that the Leaf has been around for so long it's lost the novelty factor. At the end of the day it's still the most affordable family EV on the market with a reasonable range as long as you aren't driving more than 75-100 miles on a fairly regular basis.

I think what's more interesting is that Mazda's late to the market California only EV with 100 miles of range is even getting some takers.
 
gcrouse said:
At the end of the day it's still the most affordable family EV on the market with a reasonable range as long as you aren't driving more than 75-100 miles on a fairly regular basis.

Agreed but with the caveat that Leaf + easily can do 200 miles on a daily basis with L2 charge at home at night. I think many are writing it off as a town car with limited range.
 
OldManCan said:
gcrouse said:
At the end of the day it's still the most affordable family EV on the market with a reasonable range as long as you aren't driving more than 75-100 miles on a fairly regular basis.

Agreed but with the caveat that Leaf + easily can do 200 miles on a daily basis with L2 charge at home at night. I think many are writing it off as a town car with limited range.

With the base level (not plus), I'd be a bit iffy on trying to plan a 4 hour road trip with it - i know for the folks most hesitant to consider electric vehicles the range anxiety becomes a huge concern. One of my buddies won't consider anything with less than 400 miles of range that's no more than $30k. I think that's a bit extreme given what people actually drive but with where be lives and the distance to stores and all - I'd probably want 280 miles in order to consider one to account for the range drop in winter since my 2016 SL only makes it to and from his house (approx 30 - 35 miles away) with a QC on the way there and back and L1 at his place due to 55mph up and downhill stretches.

I think 280 miles of range is probably the magic number for those on the fence to consider an EV more than a town car.
 
gcrouse said:
I think 280 miles of range is probably the magic number for those on the fence to consider an EV more than a town car.
The magic number is always shifting. Years ago, 100 miles was the magic number (which the early Leaf could do in theory if driving around town at speeds under 50 mph and no climate control) but then it jumped to 200 miles once it was seen that an EV could just be a "car" and not require anything weird to function. Once the lack of oil changes, filter changes, belts, blah blah, became apparent, then people wanted more and more EV transportation and thus wanted to do more with it, so the magic number of mileage continued to go up. Now that EV are all coming with either +200 miles of range or some options to get you +200 miles (Plus for Leaf for example), now people want it to do more, so the magic number is moving up again to +300 miles. Hence why the Ariya will be coming out in options for +300 miles of range. I'm sure, given enough time and advancement in battery technology, 300 miles will seem like nothing because everyone will be driving a +500 mile range EV as the base. Just like everything else that gets better over time, EVs have a long way road of improvements that can be had for years to come.
 
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