DaveinOlyWA
Well-known member
danrjones said:
That would quadruple the number of EVs sitting on the side of the road! :lol: :lol:
Real World EV Range Listings
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That would quadruple the number of EVs sitting on the side of the road! :lol: :lol:
salyavin
Well-known member
Just remember a regular gasoline fuel gauge empty does not mean empty it means some mysterious reserve left. Manufacturers did that for the lowest common denominator to stop them being stranded on the side of a road. I had a discussion with a tow truck driver at an EV related thing and he said he has been called many times over the years for people just running out of gas more than I would believe. He personally has never had to tow an EV due to being out of power yet, I am sure that is just due to the lower percentage of electric vehicles in the area and a higher percentage of early adopters watching power so closely. Anyway there is a reason 0% charge display is not 0%, it is to scare you into charging. I personally want the lowest common denominator to drive EVs.
For a LEAF if you want to real numbers there is a wonderful app called LEAF spy.
For a LEAF if you want to real numbers there is a wonderful app called LEAF spy.
frontrangeleaf
Well-known member
salyavin said:
True enough. But one of the bigger differences is an EV with a flat battery on the side of the road cannot be easily recharged far enough to make it to the next charger, whereas a gerry can with a gallon of gas is sufficient to get an ICE back on the road with enough range to make the next gas station.
The consequences of running to really empty are a lot bigger for EV drivers.
goldbrick
Well-known member
On my wife's 1988 GMC pickup, when the gas gauge hits the E line, it is empty, as in time to walk to a gas station. Every car is different in my experience.
Unfortunately some of the newer vehicles, at least a couple I've driven lack the nice analog gauge and have a 10 LED vertical bar for the gas gauge. The last one does start to flash when it gets really low but the DTE miles will go from 30'ish miles to ---, just when you need it most!
danrjones
Well-known member
DaveinOlyWA said:
I'm do not buy that.
Maybe we should do a poll but I just don't see people going to 0% unless they are doing a range test.
Who here takes their EV here to 0% on normal driving? Anyone?
I'm fine with a few mile buffer. But Edmunds found useable buffers of almost 10% on some vehicles. You are paying for that range but not getting it, unless you are crazy and go past zero. That doesn't make sense to me.
It also doesn't seem real world, which was the point of the original range test. In the real world I'm not going below 10%. But likely 15 or even 20%.
From watching videos even the YouTube folks who push their vehicles pull in at 2 maybe 3%. And I think they are nuts. Fun to watch but nuts.
user 24513
Well-known member
I seldom go below ten percent...... but this is the big advantage of the 62 KW battery, hardly ever need to find out the actual max range.... charge to 60 or 80, run to 20 or 30, charge back up....
knightmb
Well-known member
With LeafSpy, at least on my 2020 SL Plus, the charge gauge is correct past 50% and up but once the charge level gets below 50%, then the two start to diverge by over 10% until it reaches the "bottom" which at 0%, LeafSpy still shows enough power to drive another 30 miles. For technical people, yeah it would be nice if the gauge would add that extra +30 miles but I think as the battery sizes get bigger, all of us EV drivers are playing a game of dick waving (sorry ladies, don't know what term to combo that with) about who's number is bigger for remaining range. When I fully charge my EV, it shows 252 miles of range. Maybe it would be cool if it said 282 miles? Well I know it won't do 282 miles on the interstate doing 70 MPH but also it will do that range if I am driving slow enough to average 5 miles / kWH, so as has been repeated many times here, a real world test is just a set of variables tested and the results. My real world driving is much different than everyone else. I run tires inflated over 36 PSI recommended, I know how to minimize AC/Heat use, etc. We all learn the tricks to maximize range well past what the EPA test with.
Triggerhappy007
Well-known member
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10% on the gauge or with Leafspy?danrjones said:
When I found out about Leafspy and saw I still had 20% when the gauge says 10% I didn't worry anymore.
DaveinOlyWA
Well-known member
frontrangeleaf said:
LOL!! OMG...Have you looked at the calendar lately? Your scenario was copied from the pages of Oil Digest :lol:
You say that like sitting on the side of the road waiting for emergency gas is a minor inconvenience. You are HILARIOUS
frontrangeleaf
Well-known member
DaveinOlyWA said:
Happy to provide some levity. You're welcome.
My point was simply that it's an easier thing for anyone - tow truck driver, owner, neighbor, wife, whomever, to go fetch a can of gas, even 1 gallon will do. No tow necessary. No special equipment necessary. Everyone is familiar with how to get out of that situation.
What options exist to rapidly add enough charge to get you 10 miles or whatever to the nearest charger? AAA is now offering limited mobile service with generators capable of 240v @ 30 amps. That's a ~7kw generator, well beyond what your average Joe has in his garage or on his RV.
Sure, Home Depot has them - they run about $800 and weight 200#. Piece of cake. Yeah I got a spare one of those laying around. How about you? You can hook up a 1kw 120v Honda if you like. Have fun with that. Call me when you're all set up. I'll bring you a cup of coffee while you wait.
***
Running out of gas is damn inconvenient. Running out of charge is even more inconvenient - still, today. You really care to argue this? Mr. Hilarious?
Of course the smart thing to do is to not run out of range, and yes it's gotten way easier - there are way more charge points, and EVs go farther today. Duh. But people are still doing it every day. Same as they run out of gas every day.
I never intended to imply this was some kind of show stopper. Of course it isn't. It just raises the stakes in the minds of people who haven't actually driven an EV. Pretending these aren't real concerns doesn't make them any less real.
I think that at some point we'll see a "Reserve" option offered in some EVs, where you have to actually do a little fiddling with a menu to make the last 5% of range available - maybe even have to stop the car for a minute. That would both help prevent being stranded, and help protect the battery from frequent abuse.
DougWantsALeaf
Well-known member
The new Delta charger offers something like 1.2kWh at an amperage high enough to charge the car. That would get you 5-7 very careful miles. Still, it's nearly 1k USD, so not the same as a $3 gallon of gas.
The problem with charging once the EV has gone dead is it's not just a matter of charging it a little to get it to the nearest QC or even higher-powered L2, with 120v I'd guess you have to charge it at least a couple of hours just to let the car get into gear. I discovered this the hard way when trying to run my '12 down as low as I could. It stopped 50' short of my 30a L2 and it was uphill so no chance of pushing it. I just figured charge it with the L1 and a 50' extension cord but I had to charge it for quite some time, I believe 2hrs just to be able to get it in gear the last 50' to my L2 EVSE.DougWantsALeaf said:
Totally agree with the person who said running out of charge on a EV is a MAJOR no-no, something to be avoided at all costs, unlike an ICE vehicle where a simple gallon of gas will get you to the nearest gas station 5 minutes later.
Heck when I was driving an ICE vehicle regularly in the boonies I used to carry a nice flatter metal 1g gas can for just such emergencies, can't remember if I ever used it but it was peace of mind, no way to easily do something similar with an EV.
goldbrick
Well-known member
I like the idea of a reserve also. And yes, that is how motocycles used to work. Or still work - I haven't owned a motorcycle in decades but everyone I ever had used that system.
And for those who are curious: the reserve supply wasn't a separate tank or anything elaborate. The main fuel supply was drawn from a little snorkel that rose a couple of inches into the tank. When the fuel level dropped to at or below the level of the snorkel, you turned the fuel valve to Reserve and the intake at the base of the fuel valve was then used instead, providing a few more pints of available fuel. I don't see why this wouldn't still be done, as the production cost is minimal, but I don't know either.
frontrangeleaf
Well-known member
SageBrush said:
Back in the day, VW Bugs did. My mom was always flipping the switch, driving to empty and leaving it for my dad the next day, who was then unexpectedly genuinely out of gas. Not to mention very frustrated...
goldbrick
Well-known member
It could be done on ICE cars but I'd guess the original reason was just simplicity. As Leftie said, the mechanism is trivial and 'back in the day' motorcycles didn't have a lot of instrumentation - like a gas gauge. A friend recently needed a new fuel cock for a 1970's Honda he just bought. The part was still available and cost $8.