The 62kWh Battery Topic

DaveinOlyWA said:

Have to agree at least partially. To move from the familiar to the unfamiliar, the standards have to be near perfect; which isn't possible. But that is how we roll. We'd rather suffer the pain we know than learn a new way. It is by word of mouth from friends and family that eventually "talk us off the ledge" which brings our requirements to reasonable levels.

A more telling poll is how many try EVs and then go back to gassers. Remove the ones relocating and ones changing jobs and the rate drops to near zero.

So no, the polls won't ever be as effective as your neighbor or your sibling.

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Agreed, word of mouth will be more effective barring compulsion, but WoM tends to be very slow.

Re who goes back to gassers,

Remove the ones relocating and ones changing jobs and the rate drops to near zero

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is a problem that no one driving an ICE has to worry about. And we're one of the most mobile societies on the planet, moving an average of 11.7 times in our lives per 2007 data.

Just to put this all into perspective, if it were possible to produce net-zero carbon drop-in liquid syn- or bio-fuels for use in existing ICEs, in the necessary volumes and at prices comparable to fossil fuels, would anyone other than a few cranks be discussing BEVs? Of course not.

BEVs and their infrastructure will continue to improve in both price and capability, and as they do so more and more people will adopt them, until a tipping point is reached. I think it is unrealistic to expect that point until BEVs have eliminated most of the operational disadvantages they currently face vis-a-vis ICEs, claims of overwhelming advantages by enthusiasts notwithstanding, unless they're simply banned from some areas, as is largely responsible for their rapid growth in China, or entirely.

GRA said:

Just to put this all into perspective, if it were possible to produce net-zero carbon drop-in liquid syn- or bio-fuels for use in existing ICEs, in the necessary volumes and at prices comparable to fossil fuels, would anyone other than a few cranks be discussing BEVs? Of course not.

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BEVs would still be winning races, like Pike's Peak Hill Climb.

BEVs would still be quiet, responsive and quick in a way that ICE cars can never be.

BEVs would still "fuel" in the garage, and let me drive past gas stations. A real joy, especially when the temperature is 1C 34F, the wind is howling and the rain is coming down sideways.

So GRA, you are wrong.

DaveinOlyWA said:

I laugh when I see posts bragging about "living on the edge" from people getting home with 2% SOC thinking they barely made it. :lol:

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If you move on from the Leaf, don't try that in a Niro EV or this will happen:


https://youtu.be/QkviPRDkwqk

GRA said:

WetEV said:

People that don't know can't give an answer that is meaningful.

BEVs have advantages over their ICEs that they really can't know anything about. You are asking them to compare a sketch of a BEV with all they know about ICE cars.

Now, there might be some real information in some of the answers. But you can't take the whole answer as factual, as it isn't.

Two decades from now, the once 9 year old boys might know more about sex. And the ICE drivers are likely to be driving BEVs.

Still, answers are likely to not be completely factual. Even then.

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Your analogy of asking 9 yr.olds about sex is inapt. After all, the adult general public has lots of experience with sex, and using ICEs as transport, its basic function. Sticking with sex, a more apt analogy would be surveying heterosexuals on what it would take for them to become homosexuals. Gays and bisexuals could point out undeniable advantages like no worries about unintended pregnancies, better understanding of how their partner thinks due to being the same gender, and possible cost savings if the couple is about the same size and build, because they could share clothes :lol: Gay enthusiasts could also make harder to prove claims that the quality and/or quantity of gay sex is better, leading to stronger and/or more frequent orgasms.

None of these claims are likely to persuade many straights to switch, as most are perfectly satisfied with what they've got, and the actual or claimed advantages don't massively outweigh the disadvantages, whatever they perceive them to be.

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Your analogy fails at several levels.


First, much of sexual orientation is genetic, innate. What you want, sexually, depends on who you are, and you can't pretend to be something other than what you are and expect to be happy.

I can't think of anything in automotive that is like that. Even Ford Truck vs GM Truck seems to be mostly learned. I'll have to go look for twin studies of this. :roll:


The ratio between homosexual and heterosexuals has been fairly static since Classical Greek days.

EVs are doubling in use every 2-3 years. Not static.


I doubt if anything significant sexual has been invented since the fall of Rome. OK, maybe the battery powered vibrator. But not much else.

EV technology is showing steady progress in kWh/$, kWh/kg and more.

I saw that, very surprising. Niro also has starting appearing with some mechanical issues, so while I had wanted the Niro early on (prior to buying our first Plus), not sure I sweat it so much now.

DougWantsALeaf said:

I saw that, very surprising. Niro also has starting appearing with some mechanical issues, so while I had wanted the Niro early on (prior to buying our first Plus), not sure I sweat it so much now.

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I had interest in the Niro based on press clippings that completely vanished after the car hit the streets. Its build quality is weak.

Indy Uber driver crosses 100K miles on his 2019 Leaf. Talk about getting value out of NC2C.

https://youtu.be/-6rBv-9P9b4

Can't find efficiency thread for some reason... Can't tell if its the phone or Fi or both. (no, this site is not out of the question)

But December as expected saw me under 4 miles/kwh barely. I am actually surprised I came as close as I did due to my higher average speed on my commuting but guessing climate control experimentation played a small part but ended the month going 810.2 miles @ 3.96 miles/kwh costing $19.86 or 2.45 cents/mile. That is a slight drop from last month despite higher utility rates which I calculated at 12.21 cents/kwh. Due to the rate change in the middle of the month, a straightforward calculation would have been tedious so I split the taxes, etc. 50/50 although my tier one/ tier two usage was 600/450. All my EV charging was tier two.

DougWantsALeaf said:

Indy Uber driver crosses 100K miles on his 2019 Leaf. Talk about getting value out of NC2C.

https://youtu.be/-6rBv-9P9b4

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wow ...lots of driving...great to see that much mileage for the plus model....showing 200 miles on the GOM...about what my plus shows fully charged...hope it stays there to 100,000 miles.

For a brief second it shows 213 miles at 100% with echo on.

When was it NC2C ended for Nissan? I did not get it with my 2019 instead I got 250 in charge credit (which I did exhaust).

It ended either last Summer (I think) or the previous one. They first stopped issuing the cards, so the ones issued could be used for the time promised. I got my two years of occasional QC sessions, then haven't done one since.

salyavin said:

When was it NC2C ended for Nissan? I did not get it with my 2019 instead I got 250 in charge credit (which I did exhaust).

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"The Nissan No Charge to Charge program ended July 7, 2019. However, if you purchased your vehicle prior to this date, you are still able to register for the program. If you have any questions, please contact customer service at (844)-392-4274."

salyavin said:

When was it NC2C ended for Nissan? I did not get it with my 2019 instead I got 250 in charge credit (which I did exhaust).

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july 2019.

My previous NCTC ended Feb 2019 and I used my $250 credit while labor sharing during the onset of CV19. Used all but $7.24 of it in just over 2 months.

Wow you sure used it fast! How many miles did you drive this year?

My NC2C ends June 1 this year. It been handy on a couple road trips. In this era of covid, I have gone out and DC charged just because I was bored and it was free. There are a few NC2C locations within a few miles of my house.

Interestinf that this set of tests showed the SR+ (likely pre 2021 model) and Leaf Plus Tekna (SL+) as having almost identical range. The Niro on the other hand went 32% farther (398 km vs. 300/305 km). Pretty impressive on the Niro front.

https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/kweuax/adac_ev_range_conparison_data_is_from_there_own/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

salyavin said:

Wow you sure used it fast! How many miles did you drive this year?

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13,985.3 This is about 2500 miles less than normal. But I did do a labor share for a total of 24 trips between 92.7 and 96.1 miles so that alone added just over 2300 miles. This was 6 weeks worth that replaced my normal commute of about 105 miles per week at the time so yeah, it was a slow driving year for me.

Latest theory/hypothesis. If the BMS really holds a buffer, then I wouldn't expect the Gen 2 Leafs to show a lost bar until a few (somewhere between 2 and 6) % below 85% SoH in the GOM.

That might explain why we have many 2018 Leafs around 85% SoH and yet not many/any which have lost a bar.

If you look at the graphs in the video, I feel like they pretty similarly mirror what we see in the Pluses. A 7% drop in the first year and the a flattened line.

https://youtu.be/rYkS9AUIYjY