Hi all, I replacing my dead Voltec charger with a portable charger (sorry, EVSE, I got chided last post for calling it a charger :roll: ) with a NEMA 10-30P plug at the end. I took off the Voltec and saw I had a red, black and green wire. I was expecting a red, black and white (hot, hot, neutral). Don't know if that's correct or if my licenced electrician just used the wrong color wire, but I checked the voltage with a multimeter and it comes up 120/120 out of each prong with the black probe on the green wire. Is this safe or do I need to have an electrician rewire with a hot. If that's the case I may opt for replacing the Voltec with another similar "hard wired" unit rather than hire a pro to install a neutral. Thanks!
Help with wiring a NEMA 10-30P outlet!
- Thread starter voltiar
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Help Support My Nissan Leaf Forum:
EVSEs don't use a Neutral wire, just two Hots and a Ground. If you are wiring a new outlet it's a good idea to include a Neutral wire in the outlet for use with dryers, but if the EVSE is the only thing that will be using the outlet then Neutral is optional. If omitting the Neutral the outlet should be labelled to indicate that. If you are just attaching a new plug, then you are good to go. Just make sure all connections are perfect.
Thanks. It sounds like I am good then. This is an outside outlet that's to be used JUST for the car charger. What would happen in someone plugged a dryer in there (a three wire plug, not the newer 4 wire ones)? Would it be unsafe? Not that that's likely to happen, just curious.
smkettner
Well-known member
The outlet is wired to code and will operate fine for any device that has a 10-30 plug.voltiar said:
BTW I see nothing wrong with calling your Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment (EVSE) a charger. Everyone knows what you are talking about even if it in not technically correct. I mean what do you call the cord to charge your phone? Probably not technically correct either.
cwerdna
Well-known member
It can create confusion and result in money wasting mistakes. See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=14728&p=332668#p332668.smkettner said:
There have been cases here and other boards where people with 3.x or 6.x kW OBC have wanted to buy 40 amp L2 EVSEs thinking it would speed up their charging above their 30 or 32 amp EVSEs. And, people could buy the wrong vehicle (e.g. one w/3.x kW OBC only) or equipment level because a salesman misled them into thinking it won't make a difference and that buying a higher wattage "charger" (ahem... EVSE) would speed things up. There are a plethora of other examples.
My house apparently doesn't have the electrical capacity for a 30 amp EVSE (40 amp circuit). Electrician wanted $5K to trench and run another cable. Imagine someone doing this for a 3.x kW OBC equipped car and when a 15 or 16 amp L2 EVSE would've been enough.
smkettner
Well-known member
cwerdna said:
No I don't buy it. I think everyone does know what the person is talking about when they say "charger" in the context of the main subject that can vary between L1, L2, L3 and DC charging or even the on-board charger and probably other stuff. If you did not know how is everyone so quick to correct them?
I use the word "charger" a lot in general conversation. But not really on this board for obvious reasons.
"My charger died today. Can someone help me find another one?"
cwerdna
Well-known member
You don't buy it?smkettner said:
How about these? If people keeping being sloppy with their terminology, they and others get confused. And, if the person doesn't actually ask around or understand, they will waste money. I quickly found a few of these via Google searches.
http://www.mychevysparkev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=3792 - Spark EV only has 3.3 kW OBC and he wants to speed up charging by buying a 30 amp "charger" instead of a 15 amp.
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?t=20436#p434670 - he wants to buy a 48 amp "charger" (UGH!) to speed up charging
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=417427#p417421 - at least he got the answer quickly
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?t=14182#p322585 followed up by http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=322596#p322596
I'm sure I can find more, if I spend more time digging.
It is important to understand what each of the separate pieces are and there can be bottlenecks. To overload the name "charger" to represent both the on-board charger and the EVSE really adds to the confusion. The person may not get that they're separate distinct components.
wwhitney
Well-known member
For a grounded, 240V connection, NEMA 6 is the correct series. The NEMA 10 series is for 240/120V ungrounded connections. So if this is a new installation of EVSE and receptacle, get an EVSE with a 6-30 plug and install a 6-30 receptacle
EVSEs may be sold with a 10-30 plug on them for use with old ungrounded dryer circuits. So if you have one of those already, it would be more proper to install a 6-30 receptacle and use a 6-30P to 10-30R pigtail. Note the P means plug and the R mean receptacle.
Cheers, Wayne
EVSEs may be sold with a 10-30 plug on them for use with old ungrounded dryer circuits. So if you have one of those already, it would be more proper to install a 6-30 receptacle and use a 6-30P to 10-30R pigtail. Note the P means plug and the R mean receptacle.
Cheers, Wayne
smkettner
Well-known member
Sure, what model do you have now?LeftieBiker said:
smkettner
Well-known member
I want to charge my car faster. If I buy an 80 amp charger will that help?
Sorry that must confuse everybody let me rephrase the question.....
I want to charge my car faster. If I buy an 80 amp EVSE will that help?
No, I don't buy it. You knew what I was saying from the start.
Or do you expect people to just figure it out themselves if the right terminology is used?
I think the questions will still get asked and properly answered either way.
Sorry that must confuse everybody let me rephrase the question.....
I want to charge my car faster. If I buy an 80 amp EVSE will that help?
No, I don't buy it. You knew what I was saying from the start.
Or do you expect people to just figure it out themselves if the right terminology is used?
I think the questions will still get asked and properly answered either way.
I agree with smkettner. It's not the word charger/EVSE that's the problem, it's understanding your car will only charge as fast as it's designed to.
Everyone calls it a charger, even the charger manufacturers! EZ-Charge calls them charging stations, not EVSE stations. Chargepoint, Blink, EVgo does the same.
We get it, it's not technically a charger, but to most people, it is. If it's one thing this industry needs is to simplify things. My favorite is CHAdeMO. What genius thought of that? How about just call it a Level 3 charger, or L3?
Everyone calls it a charger, even the charger manufacturers! EZ-Charge calls them charging stations, not EVSE stations. Chargepoint, Blink, EVgo does the same.
We get it, it's not technically a charger, but to most people, it is. If it's one thing this industry needs is to simplify things. My favorite is CHAdeMO. What genius thought of that? How about just call it a Level 3 charger, or L3?
The term "Charging Station" is in fact correct, while the term "Charger" is not. Charging stations enable charging, but except for Fast Charge stations, do not actually charge the batteries. It's always easy to argue for doing what's easy, because people are generally not very thoughtful. I'm sure that as another generation starts to grow up under the rule of a "plain spoken" Republican President, your side will win this debate easily. Assuming, of course, that people continue to read and write, as opposed to just conversing with their personal devices in words that increasingly resemble monkey shrieks. ;-)
LeftieBiker said:
Of course. Glad to help.
No, no, the other kind. A CHARGER! ;-)
arnis
Well-known member
This is how car chargers should look like
240VAC is traditionally black and red (hots) and green (ground. 120VAC is black (hot), white (neutral) , and green (ground). Some dual voltage cables have white instead of red. Technically the white should be marked red when only 240V is used. a 14-30R uses 4 wires red, black, white, and green. An EVSE does not use the neutral but adding the forth wire costs very little. My EVSE is connected to a 14-50R with #4 hots and #6 ground and neutral. F0r EVSE use I ignore the neutral but the receptacle is wired normally and the only added cost was 10 feet of #6 wire.
cwerdna
Well-known member
This guy is a perfect example of a guy who didn’t understand his Spark EV only has a 3.3 kW OBC.cwerdna said:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/chevroletevgroup/permalink/960686314288277?sfns=mo
He wrote:
“Hey, finally set up Level 2 charging at home.
I sprung for a 32 amp charger for my Spark, so we could fill up fast midday.
On my test yesterday, the charging unit’s readout told me it was doing about 13 amps.
Can the Spark not take 30-32 amps? What’s going on?”
coulomb
Well-known member
Ok, if cwerdna can resurrect this thread for "a technicality" (I actually agree with him; correctness matters), then I can ask about the above.GlennD said:
I guess all you North Americans understood what he meant from context right? But I'm an Australian, and find it astounding that a white wire could be either neutral or hot depending on context, if that's what he's saying. I thought it made sense to have the second hot a red, so red with respect to black would always be 240V. (And that seems to agree with a quick google search.) But surely a "dual voltage" cable would have a neutral. If white is a hot, what color is the neutral?
I won't even mention that in Australia and a lot of the rest of the world, black is neutral and white is phase B (240 or soon 230 VAC with respect to ground, which we call earth.) :|
Correctness matters. Sometimes it's a matter of life and death.
BTW, is it true that you actually have pure green ground wires in places? The extra cost of the yellow stripe to pander to color blind people is outrageous?