coleafrado
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Re: Nissan corporate news

Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:54 am

LeftieBiker wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 4:52 pm
GRA wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 4:34 pm
In a time of economic uncertainty car purchases get put on hold when possible (except by those people who can ignore the economy), so all car sales are going to take a dive, but 'affordable' BEVs are likely to be hurt a lot more. People who might have been willing to stretch a bit up front to hopefully gain savings long-term, won't be now.
The used EV market may get healthier as a result.
What does a healthier used EV market look like?

LeftieBiker
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Re: Nissan corporate news

Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:31 am

coleafrado wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:54 am
LeftieBiker wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 4:52 pm
GRA wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 4:34 pm
In a time of economic uncertainty car purchases get put on hold when possible (except by those people who can ignore the economy), so all car sales are going to take a dive, but 'affordable' BEVs are likely to be hurt a lot more. People who might have been willing to stretch a bit up front to hopefully gain savings long-term, won't be now.
The used EV market may get healthier as a result.
What does a healthier used EV market look like?
Selling prices near the book value, with adequate sales of vehicles.
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GRA
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Re: Nissan corporate news

Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:47 pm

GaleHawkins wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 9:41 pm
GRA wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 4:34 pm
In a time of economic uncertainty car purchases get put on hold when possible (except by those people who can ignore the economy), so all car sales are going to take a dive, but 'affordable' BEVs are likely to be hurt a lot more. People who might have been willing to stretch a bit up front to hopefully gain savings long-term, won't be now.
Most people that I know can do just fine with current cars for another 3-10 years. We will just have to wait and see how much world governments put into auto bail outs like they did in 2008.

For run of the mill EV's I do not think it looks good for the folks that do not know if they will have a job long term. Tesla may be zinged for retires down a few hundred grand in their retirement accounts since the first of March or that they do not know if COVID-19 is going to take them out. Some people are not excited about putting $50K to $100K into a new car or pickup when they see their retirement accounts deflating due to things out of their control.

Indeed. Along that line, via GCC:
BNEF projects impact of COVID-19 on renewables, energy storage, EVs, etc.
https://www.greencarcongress.com/2020/0 ... -bnef.html

. . . The global auto market is very sensitive to macroeconomic conditions and will be hit hard by the coronavirus and any economic contraction that accompanies it, BNEF says. Early data from the main markets in Asia shows a drop in vehicle sales of 44% for China and 18% for Korea, two of the hardest hit countries. . . .
Those numbers are for Jan.-Feb.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

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coleafrado
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Re: Nissan corporate news

Sat Mar 14, 2020 3:56 am

Renault (Nissan partnership still alive?) seemingly taking the lead on European EV sales in January - almost 10,000 of the new Zoe (with a 50 kWh pack) sold, versus around 3,200 Leafs and under 2,000 Teslas. Nearly 75,000 sold in total for a huge jump year-over-year.

https://news.yahoo.com/europe-electric- ... 27343.html

palmermd
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Re: Nissan corporate news

Wed Apr 08, 2020 12:25 am

More automotive furloughs. I expect we'll see most every OEM report the same.

https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/04/ ... pi-an.aspx
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cwerdna
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Re: Nissan corporate news

Wed Apr 08, 2020 12:35 am

^^^
Indeed. The Big 3 had shutdowns (https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/18/general ... s-say.html) but I'm not sure if they restarted yet.

I can't speak to the orders and lockdowns in all other areas, but in my county the order (https://www.sccgov.org/sites/phd/Diseas ... 33120.aspx) doesn't consider auto sales as "essential" so they have to shut down but it does allow "on-line purchase of automobiles if they are delivered to a residence or Essential Business".

But given the sudden huge spike in unemployment, even if the retail auto sales weren't prohibited, auto sales would still fall big time.

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LeftieBiker
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Re: Nissan corporate news

Wed Apr 08, 2020 4:21 am

But given the sudden huge spike in unemployment, even if the retail auto sales weren't prohibited, auto sales would still fall big time.
Yes, the remaining pool of buyers will consist mainly of bargain hunters and people who have no choice because their only vehicle has worn out or been crashed. I'm on the fence, but if it looks like a choice between moving up to an SV+ that I'd be willing to buy off-lease, or staying with my 40kwh SL as they stop making Leafs, I'll get the SV+.
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frontrangeleaf
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Re: Nissan corporate news

Wed Apr 08, 2020 11:50 am

I'd like to see them keep the Leaf as a more affordable alternative to the next generation, but I'm not sure that's in the cards anymore. Might never have been given all their troubles.

By more affordable, I mean to reposition the SL+ to compete with the likes of the higher end Corolla and Mazda 3 hatchbacks, meaning near $30k plus or minus, after incentives. Depending on what VW does with their new line, the market could see some change around that price point. Nissan could then offer the bigger fancier eCUV for $35-45k. I don't see them commanding $40-50k for it ala Tesla. Other models to compete proportionately lower.

We paid just $27k before sales taxes and tags for our SL+ after incentives, which was roughly $10k cheaper than the Model 3 SR+ at the time, and between a similarly equipped Corolla and Mazda 3 hatchback, again after incentives/rebates before sales taxes and tags. So yes, we feel we got a lot of car for our money, and it was definitely competitive to similar conventional cars. Our Leaf drives rings around any Corolla I've ever been in, and I drive them with some frequency for business. Mazda 3 is the better comparison, definitely out handles the Leaf, but is no quicker.

I'm struck by how close they've come, and by how far they still have to go. Hopefully they find a way to survive.

Edit: Clarified that I'm talking about the SL+.
Last edited by frontrangeleaf on Wed Apr 08, 2020 1:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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cwerdna
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Re: Nissan corporate news

Wed Apr 08, 2020 12:02 pm

frontrangeleaf wrote:
Wed Apr 08, 2020 11:50 am
I'd like to see them keep the Leaf as a more affordable alternative to the next generation, but I'm not sure that's in the cards anymore. Might never have been given all their troubles.

By more affordable, I mean to reposition it to compete with the likes of the higher end Corolla and Mazda 3 hatchbacks, meaning near $30k plus or minus, after incentives.
I'm confused by this. MSRP has been starting around $30K before $7500 Federal tax credit and nobody has been paying MSRP for ages.

https://www.autoblog.com/2010/03/30/201 ... low-as-25/
https://usa.nissannews.com/en-US/releas ... -press-kit - click on Pricing
https://usa.nissannews.com/en-US/releas ... ion-design
https://usa.nissannews.com/en-US/releas ... w-ev-sound

And, some parts of the US have some state/regional incentives (e.g. CA's CVRP which was (IIRC) $5000 for a small amount of time, then $2500 for ages then $2000).

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LeftieBiker
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Re: Nissan corporate news

Wed Apr 08, 2020 12:54 pm

I think that an SL+ (or loaded SV+) for $35k is a good deal, and an S+ for under $30k is competitive. Asking for big price cuts below that as a matter of future policy doesn't seem reasonable to me. They can keep the S40 and SV40 for well under $30k to compete with commuter cars. The Leaf doesn't generally compete directly with the Model 3 because of the big difference in comfort and performance - they are apples and oranges when it comes to real world car buying/leasing decisions.
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