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Re: Hydrogen and FCEVs discussion thread

Tue Oct 22, 2019 1:45 pm

Oilpan4 wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 6:13 am
Do any of the hydrogen fan boys know how much hydrogen is going to cost?
The only way I can figure people are going for this is they have to think hydrogen is going to be free or so cheap it's almost free.

Everyone is aware that sustainable H2 has to be brought down in price to be comparable to gas/mile. DoE's target is $4/kg, untaxed, which would be below the per mile cost of gas for most vehicles in most markets. Whether they can get there remains to be seen, but that's why they and others are spending R&D money to reduce the cost/increase the efficiency of electrolysis, and are also exploring other avenues. See https://www.greencarcongress.com/hydrogen_production/ for examples.

In the meantime, H2 from excess renewables is essentially free, not counting the cost of the electrolyzer etc.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

Oilpan4
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Re: Hydrogen and FCEVs discussion thread

Tue Oct 22, 2019 4:53 pm

The most logical use for "renewable hydrogen" would be to replace natural gas made industrial hydrogen.
At $4 per kg it would catch on like a wild fire in California.
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GRA
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
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Re: Hydrogen and FCEVs discussion thread

Mon Oct 28, 2019 6:01 pm

That's one of the uses now in early deployment.

I occasionally post lab results, so here's one with the usual caveat that most such lab results will never go beyond a paper let alone be commercialized:
Study: hydrogen boride nanosheets are a promising hydrogen carrier; 8wt% under ambient conditions
https://www.greencarcongress.com/2019/1 ... 28-hb.html
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GRA
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
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Re: Hydrogen and FCEVs discussion thread

Wed Oct 30, 2019 4:33 pm

GCC:
Hyundai Motor accelerates hydrogen technology development through 3 strategic investments
https://www.greencarcongress.com/2019/1 ... daih2.html


The three companies are involved in PVD coatings, electrochemical - thermally active chemical water-splitting, and lower pressure H2 storage respectively.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GRA
Posts: 11017
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Hydrogen and FCEVs discussion thread

Tue Nov 05, 2019 5:04 pm

Two via GCC:
PowerCell develops new version of MS-100 fuel cell system for electrification on land and at sea
https://www.greencarcongress.com/2019/1 ... cell2.html


For marine/off-road applications, 100kW, Minimum lifetime 20k hours.


PowerCell signs development contract for 3.2 MW maritime fuel cell system with Havyard Group
https://www.greencarcongress.com/2019/1 ... cell1.html


For a Norwegian passenger ship ioperating along the coast from Bergen to Kirkenes, using (presumably 16) 200kW stacks in parallel.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GRA
Posts: 11017
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Hydrogen and FCEVs discussion thread

Sat Nov 09, 2019 3:02 pm

GCC:
Blue World Technologies signs strategic cooperation agreement with Chinese EV manufacturer AIWAYS; methanol fuel cell vehicles
https://www.greencarcongress.com/2019/1 ... world.html
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GRA
Posts: 11017
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Hydrogen and FCEVs discussion thread

Sun Nov 10, 2019 3:47 pm

GCC:
ExxonMobil, FuelCell Energy expand agreement to optimize carbonate fuel cell technology for large-scale carbon capture
https://www.greencarcongress.com/2019/1 ... -fcel.html


ExxonMobil and FuelCell Energy, Inc. signed a new, two-year expanded joint-development agreement to further enhance carbonate fuel cell technology for the purpose of capturing carbon dioxide from industrial facilities.

The agreement, worth up to $60 million, will focus efforts on optimizing the core technology, overall process integration and large-scale deployment of carbon capture solutions. ExxonMobil is exploring options to conduct a pilot test of next-generation fuel cell carbon capture solution at one of its operating sites.

FuelCell Energy’s proprietary technology uses carbonate fuel cells to efficiently capture and concentrate carbon dioxide streams from large industrial sources. Combustion exhaust is directed to the fuel cell, which produces power while capturing and concentrating carbon dioxide for permanent storage. . . .

Laboratory tests indicated that applying carbonate fuel cells to natural gas power generation could capture carbon dioxide more efficiently than current, conventional CCS technology. The early research indicated that by applying this new technology, more than 90% of a natural gas power plant’s carbon dioxide emissions could be captured. . . .

Using fuel cells to capture carbon dioxide from power plants can result in a more efficient separation of carbon dioxide from power plant exhaust with an increased output of electricity. Power plant exhaust is fed into the cathode side of the fuel cell (which is deployed at the power plant), replacing the ambient air used in typical applications.

The CO2 in the exhaust is transferred to the anode side, where it is much more concentrated and easy to separate. The CO2 from the anode exhaust stream is purified by chilling the stream to extract CO2 liquid. This enables a cost effective capture as the purified CO2 can then be transported by pipeline for Enhanced Oil Recovery applications or underground storage. . . .
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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