New 2020 Leaf SV 40kwh with Technology & All-Weather

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ddansb01

Member
Joined
May 25, 2013
Messages
18
Location
Middle Tennessee
New 2020 Leaf SV 40kw with Technology & All-Weather Packages

This would be my first EV after many years of driving minivans. I will keep the 2018 Odyssey for the 750 mile trips to visit grand kids.

Middle Tennessee weather is fairly mild, compared to other places I have lived (Buffalo & Dallas).

My wife & and I would use the Leaf for local errands, usually around 20 miles round trip with lots of small hills. Average one trip per day.

We did a test drive of 2021 and really liked the ease of entry and exit for our older bodies. We don't really need another vehicle, but want the EV experience.

Charging would be at home where electric is $0.084 per KWH.

Autotrader shows a few 2020 new leftovers in a 200 mile radius that look like a good value for me. We would qualify for the full $7500 rebate.

Are there any significant drawbacks to a new 2020 leftover in my situation? Other advice and suggestions welcome.

Don
 
Battery capacity is measured in kWh, not "kw".

The $7500 is a Federal tax credit. Make sure you have at least that much in Federal tax liability for the tax year when you plan to buy.

How much are we talking about? Make sure you don't overpay. https://electrek.co/best-electric-vehicle-prices/ might be helpful.

40 kWh Leaf's range will not be a problem for your use cases.
 
There’s a dealer that sells manufacture vehicles that qualify for the $7,500 rebate. Here’s a 2019 SL for about $24,000 and it qualifies for the $7,500 tax credit. https://www.walsernissanwayzata.com/inventory/used-2019-nissan-leaf-sl-tech-7500-tax-credit-fwd-hatchback-1n4az1cp8kc300112


Here’s a 2020 SL Plus for $29,400 that qualifies. https://www.walsernissanwayzata.com/inventory/used-2020-nissan-leaf-sl-plus-7500-tax-credit-fwd-hatchback-1n4bz1dp9lc300317

They will ship to you.
 
Drawbacks for the 2020 model year:

* The warning sounds it makes are louder and more aggressive than earlier versions.

* Unlike the 2018 I drive, the 2020 will not allow Recirculate to be engaged when the ventilation is set to Floor + Defrost. We have a 2020 SV+ as well, and I'm irritated at this.
 
LeftieBiker said:
Drawbacks for the 2020 model year:

* The warning sounds it makes are louder and more aggressive than earlier versions.

* Unlike the 2018 I drive, the 2020 will not allow Recirculate to be engaged when the ventilation is set to Floor + Defrost. We have a 2020 SV+ as well, and I'm irritated at this.

I had a 2019 SL+ and now have a 2020 SL+.

Warning sounds are more aggressive in the 2020. The artificial drive noise below 20 mph is annoying but LeafSpy can disable it.

The warning sounds where there is something in your path when backing up is aggressive but functional.

Living in Florida not being able to select recirculate with the Floor +Defrost isn’t a problem.

If I would have found a 2019 with tax credit to replace my 2019 SL+ I would have jumped on it. We were able to pick up our 2020 by adding $6,000 to the insurance check for our totaled 2019. So after the $7,500 tax credit we are $1,500 ahead.
 
You sound like an ideal candidate for a LEAF.

To help with your understanding of kW vs kWh, an analogy might be useful...

A kW is analogous to the rate of flow of water moving through a pipe thats filling the reservoir behind a hydro electric dam. So, in that case, units would be gallons per minute (or liters per minute)...

A kWh is analogous to the amount of water stored behind the dam. So, in that case, units would be gallons (or liters). This represents potential energy, as does kWh for a battery pack.
 
LeftieBiker said:
Drawbacks for the 2020 model year:

* The warning sounds it makes are louder and more aggressive than earlier versions.
You mean the VPS for Reverse and Forward? Technically, those can be disabled without dealer help :D

* Unlike the 2018 I drive, the 2020 will not allow Recirculate to be engaged when the ventilation is set to Floor + Defrost. We have a 2020 SV+ as well, and I'm irritated at this.
Are you sure? I just tried it on my 2020 SL Plus and while it will turn it off when you switch to the mode, you can still turn recirculate back on afterwards by just pressing the button and it stays on recirculate. I actually found it to be a nice feature coming from my old 2013 SV. It would be weird that it only works in the SL trim and not the other S or SV trim?
 
If you mean, brand new, you will be of course eating the new car cost and the loss of value just driving off the lot. You would get the $7500 tax rebate, but if you don't owe enough in taxes next year, it won't benefit you much. You would basically just want to skip the tax withholding for the year to pocket the extra cash and hope you rack up enough for the $7500 to eat into it for tax time next year. If you don't want to mess with any of that, look for either Repo or Lease expiration deals where someone has already eaten the new car cost for you and get a gently used 2020 for nearly half the price of new one that will still have tons of warranty left-over. I might live near you since I am also a Middle TN native, maybe I can help you check out any models you want to purchase, at least on the technical/mechanical level should you decide to go the used Leaf route. :)

ddansb01 said:
New 2020 Leaf SV 40kw with Technology & All-Weather Packages

This would be my first EV after many years of driving minivans. I will keep the 2018 Odyssey for the 750 mile trips to visit grand kids.

Middle Tennessee weather is fairly mild, compared to other places I have lived (Buffalo & Dallas).

My wife & and I would use the Leaf for local errands, usually around 20 miles round trip with lots of small hills. Average one trip per day.

We did a test drive of 2021 and really liked the ease of entry and exit for our older bodies. We don't really need another vehicle, but want the EV experience.

Charging would be at home where electric is $0.084 per KWH.

Autotrader shows a few 2020 new leftovers in a 200 mile radius that look like a good value for me. We would qualify for the full $7500 rebate.

Are there any significant drawbacks to a new 2020 leftover in my situation? Other advice and suggestions welcome.

Don
 
You mean the VPS for Reverse and Forward? Technically, those can be disabled without dealer help

Someone else here checked it and it didn't work for them, either. I'm thinking early and late revision software on the recirculate issue - with the later version being the bad one. There was a thread here a while back about someone not being able to turn off the weird sonar-like reverse VSP. We don't care enough about it to try.
 
LeftieBiker said:
You mean the VPS for Reverse and Forward? Technically, those can be disabled without dealer help

Someone else here checked it and it didn't work for them, either. I'm thinking early and late revision software on the recirculate issue - with the later version being the bad one. There was a thread here a while back about someone not being able to turn off the weird sonar-like reverse VSP. We don't care enough about it to try.

I can confirm that Forward VSP can be disabled with LeafSpy Pro on a late model 2020 SL+. Initially I thought it wasn’t capable but realized I had the lite version of LeafSpy loaded by mistake. Once I loaded the Pro version the VSP modification selection was active.

I’ll check for the recirculate issue later today and report back.
 
Flyct said:
There’s a dealer that sells manufacture vehicles that qualify for the $7,500 rebate. Here’s a 2019 SL for about $24,000 and it qualifies for the $7,500 tax credit. https://www.walsernissanwayzata.com/inventory/used-2019-nissan-leaf-sl-tech-7500-tax-credit-fwd-hatchback-1n4az1cp8kc300112


Here’s a 2020 SL Plus for $29,400 that qualifies. https://www.walsernissanwayzata.com/inventory/used-2020-nissan-leaf-sl-plus-7500-tax-credit-fwd-hatchback-1n4bz1dp9lc300317

They will ship to you.


What a great forum! Thumbs up to every one that contributed all this amazing knowledge of the Leaf EV.

Flyct,
What an interesting avenue to a good deal. I had access to GM used executive cars at one time in my career and they were a great deal.

The 2 you mentioned are under 5k miles and very reasonably priced. How did you find them?

The Pre-Owned 2019 Nissan LEAF SL at $24,000 from Walser in Minnesota checks a lot of my boxes. And it still has the 7500 Federal tax credit making it about 16,500 before shipping to Tennessee. Would battery degradation be a concern after 2 years, but low mileage?

2020 and 2021 did not have a 40Kwh SL model. This 2019 SL has the Technology package.

A telescoping steering wheel seems to be an area of confusion, Consumer Reports and some Youtube videos say it does not, but the 20 and 21 brochures say it does. The 2019 brochure shows only "Tilt steering column" .

Don
 
ddansb01 said:
The Pre-Owned 2019 Nissan LEAF SL at $24,000 from Walser in Minnesota checks a lot of my boxes. And it still has the 7500 Federal tax credit making it about 16,500 before shipping to Tennessee. Would battery degradation be a concern after 2 years, but low mileage?
In Minnesota with the colder climate, probably not at all. If anything, unless the previous owner abused it, the battery should be in excellent condition. Age and taking care of the battery seem to affect the range more than mileage. :D
2020 and 2021 did not have a 40Kwh SL model. This 2019 SL has the Technology package.

A telescoping steering wheel seems to be an area of confusion, Consumer Reports and some Youtube videos say it does not, but the 20 and 21 brochures say it does. The 2019 brochure shows only "Tilt steering column" .

Don
Short of someone else having the same trim and packages to let you know, it would be difficult to tell just because of the confusion of information on a lot of the review sites. :(
 
ddansb01 said:
What a great forum! Thumbs up to every one that contributed all this amazing knowledge of the Leaf EV.

Flyct,
What an interesting avenue to a good deal. I had access to GM used executive cars at one time in my career and they were a great deal.

The 2 you mentioned are under 5k miles and very reasonably priced. How did you find them?

The Pre-Owned 2019 Nissan LEAF SL at $24,000 from Walser in Minnesota checks a lot of my boxes. And it still has the 7500 Federal tax credit making it about 16,500 before shipping to Tennessee. Would battery degradation be a concern after 2 years, but low mileage?

2020 and 2021 did not have a 40Kwh SL model. This 2019 SL has the Technology package.

A telescoping steering wheel seems to be an area of confusion, Consumer Reports and some Youtube videos say it does not, but the 20 and 21 brochures say it does. The 2019 brochure shows only "Tilt steering column" .

Don

I almost bought a Leaf from Walser in Minnesota a while back. They were great to deal with, and actually knew stuff about Leafs which was great. I ended up going a different route, but it was close. Price they are offering now for the SL+ is about 2k better than when I purchased a year ago.

Re: The steering wheel, the Leaf added a telescoping steering wheel for 2020. 2019 only tilts, 2020 and 2021 tilt and telescope.
 
ddansb01 said:
The Pre-Owned 2019 Nissan LEAF SL at $24,000 from Walser in Minnesota checks a lot of my boxes. And it still has the 7500 Federal tax credit making it about 16,500 before shipping to Tennessee. Would battery degradation be a concern after 2 years, but low mileage?
MN is a pretty cool climate so unless the original owner let it sit plugged in at 100% for weeks on end, you should be OK. Walser is also a pretty decent dealer, it's where I purchased my '12SL and they were straightforward. Unfortunately, it was originally from So Cal and I believe the original owner let it sit at 100% for weeks on end but then it was 4 years old, had poor battery chemistry, and had only 10 bars, at least it was cheap. Do you know if the vehicle was originally from MN? Walser gets Leafs from all around the states so even though it's for sale in MN doesn't mean it was driven here. Carfax will give you where it was originally sold and serviced. I saw a carfax listing on Walsers site for this Leaf but doesn't give any information about where it was sold or where it's first 2k miles were......
 
Flyct said:
There’s a dealer that sells manufacture vehicles that qualify for the $7,500 rebate. Here’s a 2019 SL for about $24,000 and it qualifies for the $7,500 tax credit. https://www.walsernissanwayzata.com/inventory/used-2019-nissan-leaf-sl-tech-7500-tax-credit-fwd-hatchback-1n4az1cp8kc300112


Here’s a 2020 SL Plus for $29,400 that qualifies. https://www.walsernissanwayzata.com/inventory/used-2020-nissan-leaf-sl-plus-7500-tax-credit-fwd-hatchback-1n4bz1dp9lc300317

They will ship to you.

How are they able to sell used vehicles that still qualify for the $7500 rebate?
 
Good question! I think it has something do with the cars were 'fleet' vehicles and never claimed the credit. Someone here went through this already so maybe they will chime in with the answer.
 
This thread piqued my curiosity so I did a little research. Called Walsers and googled the VIN. I even talked to the IRS and and HR block to find out if the vehicle would actually qualify for the 7500 tax credit. That car is a great deal (even with shipping to WA) if it indeed qualifies for the credit, but a pretty lousy deal if not considering there are new 2020s that are being pretty deeply discounted right now where I live.

Walsers stated that the Leaf has never been titled/registered, so it would still qualify for the tax credit even though it's used. They said it was basically owned and driven by the factory/Nissan corporation, and that's why there's no Carfax record of it prior to Feb 2021. He said that he even had the MSO paperwork that "proved" it was never titled, and that the dealership would guarantee that the vehicle is eligible. Searching the VIN showed it was auctioned in Tennessee that month.

The IRS lady was nice but couldn't provide any info--she recommended I ask a CPA. The local H&R Block office did a little research and told me that unless the vehicle is "new" it won't qualify. So I've got conflicting stories.

Anybody have any experience with this? I'd love to hear it!
 
To be clear, there is a $7500 Federal tax credit (https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/taxevb.shtml). It's not a rebate.

I'm not accountant but the difference between and tax credit vs. rebate at https://www.marketplace.org/2009/03/05/tax-credit-and-tax-rebate/ (which I quickly found via a Google search) seems to also apply to this Federal tax credit. If your Federal tax liability for the given tax year is below $7500, then the max benefit you can receive is your Federal tax liability.

Also, can the OP fix the title to indicate 40 kWh instead of "40kw"?
 
farflung said:
Walsers stated that the Leaf has never been titled/registered, so it would still qualify for the tax credit even though it's used. They said it was basically owned and driven by the factory/Nissan corporation, and that's why there's no Carfax record of it prior to Feb 2021. He said that he even had the MSO paperwork that "proved" it was never titled, and that the dealership would guarantee that the vehicle is eligible. Searching the VIN showed it was auctioned in Tennessee that month.

Not a tax accountant, but it has never been titled, so there would be no technical reason the IRS would deny the claim. It was sold at auction by the manufacturer (Nissan), meaning it was used as a demo or show car, or maybe used by exec on campus (but never sold to anyone or given to an owner).

The wording of the credit text says the “ original use of the vehicle commences” with the taxpayer claiming the credit. That’s kinda nebulous, I guess...would be up to the taxpayers conscience to decide if they thought the vehicle’s original use started with them. I could see it both ways.

I’d think the vehicle has no chance of causing any red flags with IRS, but, I think if you’re worried about it, stay away, otherwise you will always be worried after claiming the credit. You can find similar deals elsewhere (ie similar used ones that are $7,000 less that don’t qualify for credit).
 
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