frontrangeleaf
Posts: 120
Joined: Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:07 am
Delivery Date: 08 Jul 2019
Location: Denver Area

Re: New Owner - First EV = Leaf SL Plus

Sat Aug 03, 2019 6:49 pm

Oilpan4 wrote:
Sat Aug 03, 2019 6:44 pm
That sux.
My solar panel blockers are all on my land.

It is what it is. Those trees are 60' tall to our east. They definitely help keep the house cool. Their presence, and the insulation measures we've taken, have put us in a place where we don't need to run AC. Ever. So it's all good.

Besides, I love the sound of wind in the trees.

;)
Empty-nesters - NW Denver-Boulder Area

2019 Leaf SL Plus
2015 Audi Q5 TDI
2007 BMW Z4 3.0Si
2012 VW GTI

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 15044
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: New Owner - First EV = Leaf SL Plus

Sat Aug 03, 2019 7:03 pm

Got it. I tried Eco mode, but in the summer I still prefer "B". I actually like it quite a bit.


You can use B mode with Eco mode. I do it regularly.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

frontrangeleaf
Posts: 120
Joined: Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:07 am
Delivery Date: 08 Jul 2019
Location: Denver Area

Re: New Owner - First EV = Leaf SL Plus

Sat Aug 03, 2019 8:33 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:
Sat Aug 03, 2019 7:03 pm
Got it. I tried Eco mode, but in the summer I still prefer "B". I actually like it quite a bit.


You can use B mode with Eco mode. I do it regularly.

I get that, but I'm still unclear as to the real differences. My impression is that "B" is strictly about regen, as is "e-Pedal", with the difference between the two being the amount of regen - e-Pedal brakes hard enough to turn on the brake lights, "B" doesn't.

"Eco" is a different accelerator mapping, it basically remaps the pedal position to make it less linear (?), so that you have to push down farther to get similar power at first, but flooring it still provides all available power.

Is that roughly right?
Empty-nesters - NW Denver-Boulder Area

2019 Leaf SL Plus
2015 Audi Q5 TDI
2007 BMW Z4 3.0Si
2012 VW GTI

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 15044
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: New Owner - First EV = Leaf SL Plus

Sat Aug 03, 2019 9:57 pm

You've got it. Eco + B gives you better accelerator control with lots of regen.
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

Flyct
Posts: 287
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 12:04 am
Delivery Date: 05 Dec 2019
Leaf Number: 310009
Location: Bradenton, Florida, US

Re: New Owner - First EV = Leaf SL Plus

Sat Aug 03, 2019 11:01 pm

Welcome Brian,

We also selected the Plus after previously owning a 30 kWh 2015 SL and a 40 kWh 2018 SV. The Plus’ extra range was a game changer for us since we have a cabin 125 miles from home. It makes that trip with no range anxiety. We have a L2 charger at home and installed a 50 amp receptacle at the cabin and have a Nissan EVSE OEM 50 amp plugged in there permanently. We also carry another Nissan 50 amp ESEV in the car that we bought on eBay cheap.

I like to drive the Leaf in D and B mode. My wife likes ECO mode. E-Pedal is ok but not my cup of tea. We really like the ProPilot Adaptive Cruise and lane Steering. Especially on our trip to our cabin.

We have a nice Lexus RX450h Hybrid for road trips and going out to dinner with other couples.

Then we have a Ford F-350 1 ton SRW Towing a 36 ft 5th wheel trailer when we want to go “glamping” with our dog and Parrot. We’re taking the trailer next weekend 200 miles to meet up with friends for several days.

We only pay 10 cents/kw in Florida so the Leaf costs us less than 3 cents/mile to drive.
2019 Leaf SL Plus w/All Options
2015 Lexus RX450h Hybrid SUV
2019 F-150 XLT Extended cab
2019 Ford F-350 Lariat Ultimate Crew Cab Short Bed Diesel
2017 Grand Design Reflection 337RLS 5th Wheel RV
2017 Kawasaki FXT-Pro LE Side by Side

LeftieBiker
Moderator
Posts: 15044
Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 3:17 am
Delivery Date: 30 Apr 2018
Location: Upstate New York, US

Re: New Owner - First EV = Leaf SL Plus

Sat Aug 03, 2019 11:17 pm

We also selected the Plus after previously owning a 30 kWh 2015 SL


2016 SL?
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

jjeff
Posts: 2126
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 9:10 am
Delivery Date: 13 Jul 2014
Leaf Number: 422121
Location: MSP MN

Re: New Owner - First EV = Leaf SL Plus

Sun Aug 04, 2019 6:00 am

frontrangeleaf wrote:
Sat Aug 03, 2019 6:09 pm
Hey JJeff, thanks for the welcoming thoughts.

Having grown up outside of Chicago and attended school in MN and WI, I'm familiar. Not running true snows in the winter in the mid-west strikes me as maybe a little odd since icing is pretty common, but I know it's the norm. What I know or think I know about snow tires I have from personal experience and reading too much on Tirerack. Here's my understanding such as it is:

M+S - "Mud and Snow" designation goes back to the old belted bias days, and refers strictly to tread geometry. That is, there is no performance requirement to gain that designation. Nowadays virtually any so-called "all-season" has that designation. As far as I can tell, "M+S" is basically meaningless or nearly so. It's not a racing slick. Good to know, LOL. :)

"All-season" itself is purely a marketing designation. Depending on the tire, it may well mean "all seasons in Florida..." (hot, dry and wet). As I understand matters, all-seasons are typically optimized for temperatures down to around freezing, but not lower. I regard all-seasons as basically 3 calendar season tires depending on where you live. Might be less in Canada for example. Any tire rated for dramatically long mileage is suspect in the slick.

The "3 peak mountain snowflake" symbol to which you refer, on the other hand, is a "severe winter service" rating associated with a tire providing at least 15% more traction in a linear direction (when braking and accelerating, not laterally in a corner, that is) when compared to a reference tire under lab conditions. These tires are optimized for temperatures as low as 0 degrees as I understand matters. They are the tires to which I was referring in my OP. I am looking hard at the Michelin X-ice3s. Great tire (I've had them on a different car), and also efficient. I'll prolly go with a 205/55R17 on our stock wheels. Narrower is better on a snow tire. Just a touch taller doesn't hurt either.

True snows employ a whole range of technologies to get grip under lousy, slippery and cold conditions, beginning with the rubber formula, extending into silica (sand) particles embedded in the tread, micro pores to pump water off the tread, and on and on. They are a different animal, but tend to wear quickly under warm temperatures because they are formulated to stay softer and more compliant under cold conditions, so that they can grip microscopic irregularities on the road surface. In Colorado, it is now illegal to drive on tires inappropriate for winter conditions when the "chain law" goes into effect in the mountains (whenever winter storms hit, basically). So many people were driving on iffy tires in the winter time and causing accidents and traffic jams during ski season, that the chain law for big rigs was extended to all vehicles. The fines for causing an accident on bad/inappropriate tires when the chain law is in effect are steep. I gotta say, I'm OK with that. The mountains are no place for iffy tires in the winter time.

Pure "summer" tires, on the other hand, are not rated for temperatures below 45 degrees Fahrenheit. They are definitely inappropriate and even dangerous in winter conditions. I'm not surprised you had bad experiences with the tires you got used from SoCal. Our Q came with them originally, which I was OK with, since we bought dedicated snows for it as soon as winter broke.

I have since replaced those original summers with a high quality "ultra-high performance all-seasons" - which I'm pretty sure is more marketing mumbo jumbo, aka a contradiction-in-terms. They are nice tires, though, and I like them. Conti DWS 06 is the model. I run them as our 3-season tires on all of our cars, the roadster included. Not a summer tire though, to be clear. And OK in the winter, but definitely more about performance in the dry and the wet. I wouldn't recommend them for MN as your only tire. Not likely to use these on the Leaf though, more likely to try the Conti Pure Contact LS for that car. I might go a little wider just for fun. Need to know more about the car first.

One of the problems with getting to a good all-season design that might truly be 4-season is that the things you do to optimize for rain and mileage de-optimize the tread design for snow, and vice versa. In recent years, so-called "all-weather" tires have debuted, first in Europe as I understand matters. I ran one of those on our Tig - a dutch tire from Vredestein called the Quadrac 5. Independent tests show it a step behind full-on snows, but much better than typical all-seasons in winter conditions. The tread design is literally split 1/2 for rain and 1/2 for snow. The Quad 5 does carry the 3 mountain peak/snowflake symbol. There are other all-weather designs coming out every year. Each is optimized slightly differently.

I get what you're saying about storing and paying for extra wheels, etc. Especially with active TPMS sensors (why not passive TPMS using the ABS sensors on each wheel, like everyone else does?), it does get expensive. We do have a lot of hills around here, some of them steep. Investing a bit more in tires that really work when the weather turns is important to us. Once you get past the initial hit, though, you spread your mileage across 8 tires, so that your running expense is about equal. And avoiding just one accident you wouldn't have pays you back with interest. Hence my conviction.

The first time we bought dedicated snows. we put them on our car just before a trip back to Chicago to visit family over Christmas. On the way home, this is years ago, we hit an ice storm on I-76. I'm driving along, and I'm seeing oncoming traffic in the other lane, and those cars are all full of snow and crap. Didn't think much of it. I check for brake grip and wiggle the wheel a bit - everything seems fine. But I slow first to 55 and then to 45 as things get worse. Pretty soon I have folks passing me on the left. 10 miles up those same folks are in the median getting out of their cars, off the road. Everyone looks alright, so we continue. "That's odd," I'm thinking. "Huh." I check brakes and wiggle the wheel again. Everything's fine. We pull into the garage at home an hour later, I open my door to discover almost 2 inches of ice on the car!

That was our first experience with the difference a good tire can make. I have since avoided 2 major accidents on I-70 up in ski country, both severe and unfolding barely 5-6 cars in front of us, because I could. I might also add, I've taken winter driving courses put on by the Rocky Mountain Audi club on frozen Lake George each winter. This is a thing we take pretty seriously.

Another long post, I'm afraid. I'll rein it in going forward.

Hope this helps,

-brianV
Thanks Brian, great post :) I've bookmarked it for future reference as I said, I'm definitely not going to drive another winter in those summer tires! My daughter drove down a short but moderate hill one of, if not the first snow and ended up sliding through the stop sign at the end, across a busy road and ended up hitting a curb on the other side of the somewhat busy divided road, she was panicking the whole way :shock: It ended up costing $700+ to have the "A" looking part that supports the driver's front wheel replaced(it got bent) and the front end aligned. As it was close to our $500 collision deductible we didn't turn it in and just paid the whole $700, a somewhat expensive lesson to NOT run summer tires in the winter but it could have been SO! much worse, I can't really complain. Truthfully I hadn't really known much about summer tires and just noted they were in pretty good shape when we got the car, probably 80% tread left but I now know how much tread is left doesn't tell the whole story of a tire.
2012 SL purchased used 2/'16
2013 S w/QC purchased new
Juicebox Premium 60a L1/L2 EVSE, Ebusbar 16a L1/L2 EVSE
'12 EVSEupgrade'd 20a L1/L2 EVSE, '13 EVSEupgrade'd adjustable 6-20a L2, 6-13a L1 EVSE
Zencar 13, 20, 30a L1/L2 portable EVSE
GE Durastation 30a

Flyct
Posts: 287
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 12:04 am
Delivery Date: 05 Dec 2019
Leaf Number: 310009
Location: Bradenton, Florida, US

Re: New Owner - First EV = Leaf SL Plus

Sun Aug 04, 2019 6:25 am

LeftieBiker wrote:
Sat Aug 03, 2019 11:17 pm
We also selected the Plus after previously owning a 30 kWh 2015 SL


2016 SL?
Leafs I owned in order: corrected kWh on 2015 SL. I had a Brain fart.

2015 SL (24 kWh)
2018 SV (40 kWh)
2019 SL Plus (62 kWh)
2019 Leaf SL Plus w/All Options
2015 Lexus RX450h Hybrid SUV
2019 F-150 XLT Extended cab
2019 Ford F-350 Lariat Ultimate Crew Cab Short Bed Diesel
2017 Grand Design Reflection 337RLS 5th Wheel RV
2017 Kawasaki FXT-Pro LE Side by Side

frontrangeleaf
Posts: 120
Joined: Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:07 am
Delivery Date: 08 Jul 2019
Location: Denver Area

Re: New Owner - First EV = Leaf SL Plus

Sun Aug 04, 2019 7:19 pm

jjeff wrote:
Sun Aug 04, 2019 6:00 am
Thanks Brian, great post :) I've bookmarked it for future reference as I said, I'm definitely not going to drive another winter in those summer tires! My daughter drove down a short but moderate hill one of, if not the first snow and ended up sliding through the stop sign at the end, across a busy road and ended up hitting a curb on the other side of the somewhat busy divided road, she was panicking the whole way :shock: It ended up costing $700+ to have the "A" looking part that supports the driver's front wheel replaced(it got bent) and the front end aligned. As it was close to our $500 collision deductible we didn't turn it in and just paid the whole $700, a somewhat expensive lesson to NOT run summer tires in the winter but it could have been SO! much worse, I can't really complain. Truthfully I hadn't really known much about summer tires and just noted they were in pretty good shape when we got the car, probably 80% tread left but I now know how much tread is left doesn't tell the whole story of a tire.

Live and learn. Glad it wasn't more serious.
Empty-nesters - NW Denver-Boulder Area

2019 Leaf SL Plus
2015 Audi Q5 TDI
2007 BMW Z4 3.0Si
2012 VW GTI

frontrangeleaf
Posts: 120
Joined: Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:07 am
Delivery Date: 08 Jul 2019
Location: Denver Area

Re: New Owner - First EV = Leaf SL Plus

Sun Aug 04, 2019 7:22 pm

Flyct wrote:
Sat Aug 03, 2019 11:01 pm
Welcome Brian,

We also selected the Plus after previously owning a 30 kWh 2015 SL and a 40 kWh 2018 SV. The Plus’ extra range was a game changer for us since we have a cabin 125 miles from home. It makes that trip with no range anxiety. We have a L2 charger at home and installed a 50 amp receptacle at the cabin and have a Nissan EVSE OEM 50 amp plugged in there permanently. We also carry another Nissan 50 amp ESEV in the car that we bought on eBay cheap.

I like to drive the Leaf in D and B mode. My wife likes ECO mode. E-Pedal is ok but not my cup of tea. We really like the ProPilot Adaptive Cruise and lane Steering. Especially on our trip to our cabin.

We have a nice Lexus RX450h Hybrid for road trips and going out to dinner with other couples.

Then we have a Ford F-350 1 ton SRW Towing a 36 ft 5th wheel trailer when we want to go “glamping” with our dog and Parrot. We’re taking the trailer next weekend 200 miles to meet up with friends for several days.

We only pay 10 cents/kw in Florida so the Leaf costs us less than 3 cents/mile to drive.

We're about a decade away from retiring, but certainly looking forward to limiting expenditures on driving. Sounds like you have things nicely dialed in. I am also interested in trying out the ProPilot features when we travel north to visit our son in Ft. Collins, about 75 miles each way. The Leaf Plus should handle that nicely, as there's no mountain travel involved.
Last edited by frontrangeleaf on Sun Aug 04, 2019 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Empty-nesters - NW Denver-Boulder Area

2019 Leaf SL Plus
2015 Audi Q5 TDI
2007 BMW Z4 3.0Si
2012 VW GTI

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