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LTLFTcomposite
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Re: Trump EV/alternative energy/climate/environmental policy bashing and discussion

Wed Dec 21, 2016 4:07 am

WetEV wrote:Oh, I'd bet you never read Mother Jones.
Mostly only when somebody points something out. Same for the onion, Drudge, Breitbart, etc... But since we're sharing funny stuff check this out:
https://youtu.be/X9-5fYFjrbs
LTL
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WetEV
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Re: Trump EV/alternative energy/climate/environmental policy bashing and discussion

Wed Dec 21, 2016 7:42 am

LTLFTcomposite wrote:But since we're sharing funny stuff check this out:
Oh, so I'm a "snowflake". How unfunny. Half the country are "snowflakes".

But raises an interesting question.

What would it take for you to be a snowflake too?
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WetEV
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Re: Trump EV/alternative energy/climate/environmental policy bashing and discussion

Wed Dec 21, 2016 7:44 am

Oh, and so this topic doesn't get forgotten:

Image
WetEV
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WetEV
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Re: Trump EV/alternative energy/climate/environmental policy bashing and discussion

Wed Dec 21, 2016 8:05 am

This as well:

Image
Change in spectrum from 1970 to 1996 due to trace gases. 'Brightness temperature' indicates equivalent blackbody temperature


Oh and video.

https://youtu.be/H4YSwajvFAY
WetEV
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WetEV
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Re: Trump EV/alternative energy/climate/environmental policy bashing and discussion

Wed Dec 21, 2016 9:52 am

Does selling access to the President bother you?

https://www.publicintegrity.org/2016/12 ... dent-elect

Are you a snowflake yet?
WetEV
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WetEV
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Trump and the Social Cost of Carbon

Wed Dec 21, 2016 1:41 pm

Trump has a unique opportunity.

Unlike most the Republican party, he isn't judged by how well he follows the party line. (or the decency line, or the honesty line... but I digress.)

Trump could accept that carbon dioxide and other human released greenhouse gases are indeed changing the climate, and that climate change is a danger to his golf courses and luxury waterfront property... I mean the USA. By doing so, and suggesting the USA does something about it, the protects Trump from fallout from any climate disasters during his looting... I mean Presidential appointment for life... I mean Presidential term(s).

Once he does that, he might back a carbon tax at the current EPA estimate of $36 per tonne (3% discount rate). This would allow him to cut taxes for the very wealthy more by having a balancing tax increase, and probably some other looting as well. A carbon tax would remove a potentially very dangerous political issue that might threaten the love that he so desperately needs. A carbon tax would throw environmentalist groups back, and confuse liberals everywhere. Then Trump could eliminate more pollution regulations... So the USA could compete with China for (non-smoking) lung cancer deaths.

Oh, never mind that the EPA cost of carbon estimate over time is way low, and 3% is probably too high of a discount rate... But it could be made lower by valuing future people's lives even less than 3% discount rate already does. At 5%, the EPA estimate for 2015 is just $11 per tonne. A more realistic figure would be closer to $200 to $300 per tonne. So I'd guess that Trump settles on something in the range of $10 per tonne to not more than $36 per tonne.

$10 per tonne would add about 2.8 cents to a gallon of gasoline. $36 would add about 10 cents to the cost of a gallon of gas. Even the realistic cost of $250 would only add about 70 cents to the cost of a gallon of gas. This could be balanced by removing the Federal gasoline tax paying for roads, and loot the Social Security trust fund to pay for the highway trust fund, freeing up even more funds for tax breaks to the billionaires.

Even conservatives would love the confusion of liberals and environmental groups. Think of this as a win-win.
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wwhitney
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Re: Trump and the Social Cost of Carbon

Wed Dec 21, 2016 1:55 pm

WetEV wrote:A more realistic figure would be closer to $200 to $300 per tonne.
I'm curious--do you have a reference for this figure? That's almost an order of magnitude higher than the EPA figure.

Thanks,
Wayne

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Re: Trump and the Social Cost of Carbon

Wed Dec 21, 2016 3:40 pm

wwhitney wrote:
WetEV wrote:A more realistic figure would be closer to $200 to $300 per tonne.
I'm curious--do you have a reference for this figure? That's almost an order of magnitude higher than the EPA figure.

Thanks,
Wayne
(paywalled)
http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/ ... e2481.html

(prepublication, but close)
http://www.eenews.net/assets/2015/01/13 ... _cw_01.pdf

The EPA assumed a fairly high discount rate, and that climate change would have little impact on economic growth. The EPA figure was at a discount rate of 3%. As the costs of climate change are in the future, the higher the discount rate the lower the cost climate change is in real dollars. It seems likely to me that climate change is going have a direct impact on economic growth.

Note the range in Figure 4 goes over $2000 per tonne in 2015, if all of the key indicators are upper end of modeled ranges. This is unlikely, but possible. The EPA's $36 is unlikely, but possible.

Note as well that the cost varies with time. SCC was almost surely negative in 1908, as Arrhenius claimed:


https://books.google.com/books?id=1t45A ... #v=onepage

page 63
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LTLFTcomposite
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Re: Trump EV/alternative energy/climate/environmental policy bashing and discussion

Wed Dec 21, 2016 7:02 pm

WetEV wrote:Does selling access to the President bother you?

https://www.publicintegrity.org/2016/12 ... dent-elect

Are you a snowflake yet?
Fake news abounds in safe spaces.
LTL
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User avatar
LTLFTcomposite
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Re: Trump EV/alternative energy/climate/environmental policy bashing and discussion

Wed Dec 21, 2016 7:47 pm

Glad to hear Trump is talking about import tariffs. For too long we have exported our polution and carbon emissions to poorer parts of the world for the sake of consuming an endless flow of shipping containers full of throwaway goods.
LTL
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