User avatar
49thdiver
Forum Supporter
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2020 10:14 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Jan 2020
Leaf Number: 305065
Location: CANADA's westcoast
Contact: Website

Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015

Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:37 pm

I am not the first one to try this nor I amm sure will I be the last to try it. Hoping we can pull all the info into one place and generate some new interest to make this easier for anyone else that wants to give it a try. Thanks ito everyone that has been here a while and thanks in advance for any help with this project. My specific project is to put a Nissan Leaf pack and charger into a 2002 RAV4 EV.

What I know so far.
The PDM sits on the "EV SYSTEM CAN Circuit" There are a number of connections on the B24 connector that need to be hard wired in order to function along with an external j1772 charger to start with ChaDemo can come later.
The connections are
  • Pin 10, Plug in signal, LightGreen
  • Pin 11, EV System CAN-L, DarkGreen
  • Pin 12, HV detecting circuit Interlock In, Orange
  • Pin 15, HV detecting signal Interlock Out, Pink
  • Pin16 Power On (IGN) , Violet
  • Pin 18, Battery Power Supply, Red
  • Pin 27, EV System CAN-H, Blue
  • Pin 29, EVSE Connection Signal, White
  • Pin30, EVSE communication PWM, Brown
This is the connector :
Image

This is my set up :
Image

and my connection diagram :
Image

When the PDM powers up all I get is a high on pin 29 and two CAN messages, 0x390 & 0x393 each one transmitted several times

I have a wrecked 2015 and access to complete working 2015 which am going to record can bus charging messages and try and play them back on both the working car and on the stand alone PDM to see what happens. Does anyone know is there a risk of bricking the working car by trying sending messages to the charger. I am also going to pull the VCM, the combination display and the charge lights from the wreck to see if I can cobble that together to assist in the diagnosis of the stand alone PDM. Any and advice appreciated. I am new to can bus so have to learn a lot. I am an electronics tech design and service in the it world with a little OBDII hacking experience.

Peter

Others on this forum have advised the following :

Celeron55 :
Project update: I was unable to reverse the charger CAN protocol to an extent that would have made it do any... well, charging. I did get the DC-DC converter to operate, but that was it.

Basically I found out bit 0x04 in the 0x1f2 frame disables the converter (set low to enable, just spam 0x1f2 00 64 00 a0 00 00 00 00 or so every 10ms). You might also need 50b, 1d4 and maybe 55b (probably not). Anyway, that's worthless without the charging working.

I'm now in the process of developing the necessary hardware mods to get it to charge without any co-operation of Nissan's original software. This is actually going fairly well (I already have full control in a lab setup), but making this reproducible or to be something that I can use daily is more difficult.

EDIT: I've basically reverse-engineered enough of the connections to the Renesas R5F35MEEJFE chip that controls the PDM in order to write a new program from scratch for it to do regular charging and dc-dc conversion. Not sure if I'll do that, I'd need a E8a emulator ($150) and basically IAR Embedded Workbench for M16C ($2000? $4000?) to program it. Also, nobody sells these chips for a hobbyist if the one on board is somehow locked. I can find different ones with the same pinout though, eg. R5F35L2EJFE.


IskeSoderlund:
Hi!
Been lurking here for a while, I'm trying to hack a leaf OBD charger. I've come quite a way closer to charging. I've written a program which makes the charger think it's in the leaf. And it seems to work the charger is no longer sending "fault" signals by CAN. And I'm trying to make it charge by sending the same messages that the VCM sends to the leaf when charging, according to CAN captures by carrot. I still haven't been able to make it charge. Is it possible that the charger like the inverter saves DTC and refuses to start charging? If so what's my best option to remove stored DTCs?

If anyone wants my codes for the program or help with making the charger "think" its in a leaf just contact me!
Last edited by 49thdiver on Tue Aug 18, 2020 12:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Peter
Dangerous if left unattended.
1985 Grumman Olsen Kubvan, 2002 Rav4 EV, 2000 Ford Ranger EV, 2015 Nissan leaf, Biktrix LJ

User avatar
49thdiver
Forum Supporter
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2020 10:14 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Jan 2020
Leaf Number: 305065
Location: CANADA's westcoast
Contact: Website

Re: Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015

Wed Feb 19, 2020 1:43 am

After connecting a real J1772 charger to the PDM today I ran some data grabs on the can bus again when plugging and unplugging the j1772 connector. These are messages sent from the PDM with no connection to anything else other than my digiview data acquisition device and a obdII bluetooth dongle.

Update August 2020: Turns out the digiview was misinterpreting the data and sent me off an a bad track of investigation.
I have changed my data acquisition tools to Arduino based MCP2515 devices, as you will see below the data now makes sense.

I have been able do the same data acquisition on a working 2015 leaf and have recorded a charge sequence.
Last edited by 49thdiver on Tue Aug 18, 2020 12:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Peter
Dangerous if left unattended.
1985 Grumman Olsen Kubvan, 2002 Rav4 EV, 2000 Ford Ranger EV, 2015 Nissan leaf, Biktrix LJ

nlspace
Posts: 239
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:21 pm
Delivery Date: 06 Jun 2017

Re: Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015

Wed Feb 19, 2020 7:02 pm

Do you have a schematic of the PDM? What are the boards and different sections in your setup picture, and what are the functions? Is the OBC built into the PDM or is it a stand alone box? i only have a 2012 OBC and it looks different inside from anything you have shown.

User avatar
49thdiver
Forum Supporter
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2020 10:14 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Jan 2020
Leaf Number: 305065
Location: CANADA's westcoast
Contact: Website

Re: Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015

Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:37 pm

nlspace wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 7:02 pm
Do you have a schematic of the PDM? What are the boards and different sections in your setup picture, and what are the functions? Is the OBC built into the PDM or is it a stand alone box? i only have a 2012 OBC and it looks different inside from anything you have shown.
No I have not attempted to reverse engineer it, that would take a serious amount of effort.
ac to dc converter on the left, chadeamo circuit on the top right, dc to dc converter for charging the 12 volt system on the bottom right.
The descriptors toyota uses are different through out what documentation there is. I consider that box in my picture to be the PDM but it also reffered to as OBC/PDM. There was a major engineering change at 2013. Yours will be completely different. I think your charger is in behind the back seat.
Peter
Dangerous if left unattended.
1985 Grumman Olsen Kubvan, 2002 Rav4 EV, 2000 Ford Ranger EV, 2015 Nissan leaf, Biktrix LJ

nlspace
Posts: 239
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:21 pm
Delivery Date: 06 Jun 2017

Re: Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015

Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:52 pm

If there is an AC to DC section, then i would think it is for the OBC? but like i said my 2012 OBC is sitting on the workbench and i'm not up to speed on the later models. You could at least trace out the major functions to create a block diagram without spending much time--it could help the next guy or even yourself with this project.

User avatar
49thdiver
Forum Supporter
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2020 10:14 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Jan 2020
Leaf Number: 305065
Location: CANADA's westcoast
Contact: Website

Re: Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015

Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:18 pm

nlspace wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:52 pm
If there is an AC to DC section, then i would think it is for the OBC? but like i said my 2012 OBC is sitting on the workbench and i'm not up to speed on the later models. You could at least trace out the major functions to create a block diagram without spending much time--it could help the next guy or even yourself with this project.
Sorry I was not clear that is the On Board Charger (OBC) on the top left, the IGBT's or power electronics associated with the charger are on the underside of the module.

Not my priority to reverse engineer the charger at this time, there may be others that have done some of this already.

My focus is to try and get the charger to charge at the moment that effort is going to be focused on the can bus and what systems I can port over from the wrecked leaf. We managed to strip out all the modules today and are now going to set out to reconnect it all on the bench. I t may come to it that I will need to reverse engineer but the issue there will be getting the OBC independent processor to cooperate. So much is done in software these days that knowing what the hardware does may not get me any closer to charging.

I was also able to grab data from the EVCAN SYSTEM circuit today from the working leaf while starting and stopping charging this should help understand what the dependency is between the other systems such as the VCM and the BMS. I will be posting the data here once I get it in a readable form.

Thanks for your interest and good luck with your OBC.
Last edited by 49thdiver on Tue Aug 18, 2020 12:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Peter
Dangerous if left unattended.
1985 Grumman Olsen Kubvan, 2002 Rav4 EV, 2000 Ford Ranger EV, 2015 Nissan leaf, Biktrix LJ

Pashko90
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Nov 16, 2019 10:28 am
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 302702

Re: Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015

Fri Feb 21, 2020 2:30 am

This is very interesting idea. Where is so tittle rav4 ev alive. I'm trying to find one to play around.
Good luck with your project, I will gonna keep my eyes on you.

User avatar
49thdiver
Forum Supporter
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2020 10:14 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Jan 2020
Leaf Number: 305065
Location: CANADA's westcoast
Contact: Website

Re: Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015

Sat Feb 22, 2020 3:25 am

There is another interesting thread over here:
https://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=21843
With a great video description of the layout and some good info.
Peter
Dangerous if left unattended.
1985 Grumman Olsen Kubvan, 2002 Rav4 EV, 2000 Ford Ranger EV, 2015 Nissan leaf, Biktrix LJ

User avatar
49thdiver
Forum Supporter
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2020 10:14 pm
Delivery Date: 15 Jan 2020
Leaf Number: 305065
Location: CANADA's westcoast
Contact: Website

Re: Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015

Sat Feb 22, 2020 4:23 am

For those of you that are interested in data mining here is the latest EVCAN SYSTEM Circuit data grab.
https://www.divemaster.ca/RAV4EV/LEAF/C ... -2020.xlsx
There are a number of data sets on separate sheets pluging and unpluging the charger from a 100% working 2015 leaf.
The most reliable sets are probably the ones that record the plug in or start charging sequence as the pattern seems more obvious to me anyway.
My next step is to hook up a minimal number of modules from the leaf to compare the data results to figure out what messages are missing or needed to get the charger to turn on.

I note in one of the links I found above one of the authors indicates that the charger is a current based charger not voltage and that you could connect any battery (within limits I guess) and it would charge. That idea interests me as I would like to reconfigure the pack for a lower voltage.

Any body with info on that I would love to see it.
Stay tuned.
Last edited by 49thdiver on Tue Aug 18, 2020 12:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Peter
Dangerous if left unattended.
1985 Grumman Olsen Kubvan, 2002 Rav4 EV, 2000 Ford Ranger EV, 2015 Nissan leaf, Biktrix LJ

nlspace
Posts: 239
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:21 pm
Delivery Date: 06 Jun 2017

Re: Stand alone OBC/PDModule EV system Can 2015

Sat Feb 22, 2020 7:51 am

There is both voltage and current sense measurements in the OBC and these are fed to the microcontroller. i'm fairly certain that limits are programmed into that device such that an OBC won't function outside of the narrow range of the program, i.e. it's not a generic chargger that could be used for any battery without re-programming.

In addition the large inductors and transformers in the OBC were likely designed for the current and expected voltages, so those would have to be changed for different voltage operation also.

The benefit of reverse engineering circuitry is the ability to troubleshoot, repair and modify the hardware. It also seems to help when disassembling the firmware.

The only successful re-programming of an EV chargger was done by forum user Coulomb and documented in threads on the diyelectriccar forum:

hardware here,

https://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/s ... ostcount=3

and firmware,

https://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/s ... p?t=134225

Return to “LEAF CANBus”