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Re: How To: Reduction Gear Oil Change

Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 7:03 pm
by GaleHawkins
Because of regen the gear teeth do get wear on both sides so that may be a factor in making metal and making making th as e oil dark.

If the battery packs would last as long as the reduction gear oil the Leaf would be a home run. :)

The Archoil AR9100 use typically doubles oil change intervals because of friction reduction being a solid boundary lubricating film solution. We have engines that go months/years without being started so I like the AR9100 to prevent dry start ups before oil pressure builds.

Re: How To: Reduction Gear Oil Change

Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 7:31 pm
by LeftieBiker
Because of regen the gear teeth do get wear on both sides so that may be a factor in making metal and making making th as e oil dark.
I'm finding it hard to understand this. When the motor goes into regeneration mode, it pulls on the "transmission", right? That should result in more wear on the usually unloaded side of the teeth, and more even wear, not less - not unlike engine braking, especially with a manual transmission...unless I'm just too foggy tonight.

Re: How To: Reduction Gear Oil Change

Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 7:38 pm
by bobkart
I agree it would work like engine braking, putting forces on what I call the 'back side' of the gears. I.e. the gear faces that don't touch during normal forward acceleration (although they would under rearward acceleration).

The one obvious source of unevenness on that wear is that Regen will have a lower limit to how much force is applied, compared to normal acceleration. That and not every amount of forward thrust is countered via Regen (i.e. any time the real brakes are applied).

Re: How To: Reduction Gear Oil Change

Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 9:06 pm
by LeftieBiker
The one obvious source of unevenness on that wear is that Regen will have a lower limit to how much force is applied, compared to normal acceleration. That and not every amount of forward thrust is countered via Regen (i.e. any time the real brakes are applied).
But that's also true of ICE drivetrains, especially those with automatics.

Re: How To: Reduction Gear Oil Change

Posted: Mon May 10, 2021 9:29 pm
by bobkart
Yes . . . I believe the gear wear will be markedly higher on the front side of the gears on most any vehicle, with the source of propulsion (ICEV/PHEV/BEV) playing only a small part. (I wasn't trying to suggest otherwise.)

Only in the case that all accelerating force through the gearbox is 100% matched by deceleration force (like an e-pedal with 'full' Regen) could one get close to equal gear face wear. This could also be achieved by having the brakes operate 'inboard' of the gearbox, but that has several obvious downsides. And even then there'd be unevenness due to different force levels (stopping more quickly than starting, for example).

Re: How To: Reduction Gear Oil Change

Posted: Tue May 11, 2021 7:39 am
by voltamps
bobkart wrote:
Mon May 10, 2021 9:29 pm
Only in the case that all accelerating force through the gearbox is 100% matched by deceleration force (like an e-pedal with 'full' Regen) could one get close to equal gear face wear.
Leaf does just that, matching accel and decel using the motor. .... Deceleration from the motor acting as a generator is about equal to the forward-thrust accel mode.
Remember the brake pedal you operate is actually blending in motor decel (regen) with physical brake pads.
We can accelerate at about up to 1/3 G's, and decel up to 1/3 G's is handled by the motor regen. Any braking above 1/3 G's must be done with brake pads phasing in.

One-pedal driving merely shifts (re-maps) the decel regen off the first few centimeters of travel on the brake pedal on to the accelerator pedal retreat (accel pedal lift). One-pedal driving is like a speed command with your right foot, with heavy braking of course shifted back to the usual normal brake pedal when the driver needs it.

Re: How To: Reduction Gear Oil Change

Posted: Tue May 11, 2021 10:09 am
by bobkart
voltamps wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 7:39 am
Any braking above 1/3 G's must be done with brake pads phasing in.
It's that unevenness I'm referring to. At least in my Leaf, maximum Regen deceleration rates aren't matched to acceleration rates . . . it's only something like 40% former to latter.

Re: How To: Reduction Gear Oil Change

Posted: Wed May 12, 2021 9:10 am
by estomax
in gen1 leafs, we get 30kw of regen and 80kw of acceleration, second gen maybe more evenly matched with the one pedal driving and bigger batteries. I have not read up on the newer leafs and what their regen rates might be.

Re: How To: Reduction Gear Oil Change

Posted: Fri May 14, 2021 5:20 pm
by GaleHawkins
Today we got our 2016 Leaf out for the first time since changing the reduction gear ATF so the Archoil AR9100 got well mixed. We drove 12.4 miles with top speed of 70 MPH with the average more 30 MPH since we have no front cap, radiation, etc. We dropped the SOC from 87% to 77%. The last charging was done 6 Nov 2020 and SOH reading was 96.08. Today 14 May 2021 after our 12.4 mile country drive SOH was down to 96.04%. l did not know parking a Leaf froze the SOH with the 12v negative battery cable disconnected.

Re: How To: Reduction Gear Oil Change

Posted: Sun Jun 06, 2021 4:25 pm
by Valdemar
Closing in on 180k miles with the original oil, no major changes in the gear noise levels.