Steering wheel mounted drive selector

Lately I've been attempting to improve mileage and range by shifting into neutral, eco and drive depending on what the conditions call for. I'm impressed w/ how much of a difference it makes in my area where it is nearly all hills but there are times when it is a little inconvenient to keep my hand on the Selector lever, especially when shifting into Neutral. For this type of driving, it would be nice to have steering wheel controls. Has any enterprising individual out there attempted or is attempting this?

Drivesolo said:

Has any enterprising individual out there attempted or is attempting this?

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Sort of. VolksWagen has. But, unsurprisingly, it's on their own EV version of the Golf, not the LEAF. :lol:

Here is a description:

In addition to three “driving profiles” which vary power mapping and AC power use for improved range or power, VW has included no fewer than four regenerative braking modes. Like the Volt, the shift column has both “drive” and “low” settings, the latter of which provides the most extreme engine braking for heavy traffic or slow hill descents. In this mode the off-throttle regeneration is almost neck-snappingly extreme, slowing the car strongly and progressively as soon as you get off the “gas.” In “drive” the Golf blue-e-motion offers three separate modes which are selected not with the shifter, but with DSG-style paddle shifters mounted behind the steering wheel. Two modes offer varying degrees of regeneration, ranging from a gentle slowing to a stronger regeneration but both are less extreme than the “low” setting. Accompanying these two modes is the “sail” mode which allows the Golf to coast in light traffic with no off-throttle regeneration at all.

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http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2011/07/pre-production-review-volkswagen-golf-blue-e-motion/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Drivesolo said:

Lately I've been attempting to improve mileage and range by shifting into neutral, eco and drive depending on what the conditions call for. I'm impressed w/ how much of a difference it makes in my area where it is nearly all hills but there are times when it is a little inconvenient to keep my hand on the Selector lever, especially when shifting into Neutral. For this type of driving, it would be nice to have steering wheel controls. Has any enterprising individual out there attempted or is attempting this?

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I have many years of EV driving and I can get the same efficiency without ever using neutral particularly with the very low regen in the LEAF. In a LEAF any skilled driver can drive with the same efficiency without neutral. I could understand wanting this if the LEAF had 2-3X the regen but even then there is a neutral point on the pedal. Most of your efficiency is likely a result of carful driving and acceleration not throwing the car in neutral. The LEAF regen is so weak the only point of ECO is for those that can't properly adjust the climate controls to a lower setting. ECO regen should be on D and there should be a higher regen mode. All this Nissan silliness is done so the average joe consumer is not scared by driving an EV. Placing the car in neutral seems like quite a bit of wasted effort for the same result one can achieve by simply driving it normally.

EVDRIVER said:

Placing the car in neutral seems like quite a bit of wasted effort for the same result one can achieve by simply driving it normally.

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I've heard this a few times. Just to be clear, it's great to say it's "not worth it"; heck, there are days when I say that about electric cars in general ;-)

To be clear, however, you are NOT suggesting that regen is as efficient as coasting, correct?

My singular attempt at long range coasting was almost 26 miles without using power. Could I have done the same thing in regen and completed the same trip with more energy? I'm not sure, but I'll give it a try some day soon.

TonyWilliams said:

EVDRIVER said:

Placing the car in neutral seems like quite a bit of wasted effort for the same result one can achieve by simply driving it normally.

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I've heard this a few times. Just to be clear, it's great to say it's "not worth it"; heck, there are days when I say that about electric cars in general ;-)

To be clear, however, you are NOT suggesting that regen is as efficient as coasting, correct?

My singular attempt at long range coasting was almost 26 miles without using power. Could I have done the same thing in regen and completed the same trip with more energy? I'm not sure, but I'll give it a try some day soon.

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Replacing energy through regen is never more efficient over not using it in the first place of course. In a LEAF one can easily get the same efficiency without using neutral and putting extra wear on the selector and other related components. It's all very silly for an EV with such weak regen.

EVDRIVER said:

It's all very silly for an EV with such weak regen.

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Which, to me, suggests MORE coasting to maximize range; not less.

Anyhoo, I will try and satisfy my own curiosity as to how this all applies in practice. So far, I don't mind shifting to neutral, however, I would much prefer some type of steering wheel paddle shifter to control regen and coasting.

TonyWilliams said:

EVDRIVER said:

It's all very silly for an EV with such weak regen.

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Which, to me, suggests MORE coasting to maximize range; not less.

Anyhoo, I will try and satisfy my own curiosity as to how this all applies in practice. So far, I don't mind shifting to neutral, however, I would much prefer some type of steering wheel paddle shifter to control regen and coasting.

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The issue is not coasting it is the use of neutral. Those that understand how to drive a low regen EV like the LEAF which is is easy as it gets, know that there is no need to use neutral. The LEAF has such weak regen, for those that seem to believe they need to coast, just use D as it is almost coasting and there is always a neutral point on the pedal. I could fully understand the desire to coast in a high regen EV or the need to have adjustable regen but with the laughable regen in a LEAF this is really silly. What Nissan needs on the steering wheel are controls that are useful, not a big paddle that sicks out and turns on the radio when you hit the horn.

One technique I have used to maximize range is to keep the accelerator pedal depressed moderately while switching in and out of neutral. (Of course, in an electric car the motor is always coupled 1:1 regardless of whether in neutral or not, so this is one thing you can do in an electric car but not in a gas car.) When on the freeway where there's traffic, I might want to drive at say 45mph to extend range but cannot safely do so when there are cars going at 65mph, so I aim for about 55mph. Once a car passes I shift into neutral to let it gradually coast down to a more efficient speed, and then when another car starts to come up fast behind me I shift back out of neutral. Keeping the pedal depressed some while shifting back and forth. This allows me to safely and easily lower the average speed.

In answer to EVDRIVER, it's much easier, less stressful, - and safer - to do this than to try and keep a close eye on the power indicator while feathering the pedal, in high traffic. Even though the Leaf doesn't have a large amount of regen, when stretching every last mile of course even a little regen is to be avoided if you can coast without going too fast.

EVDRIVER said:

What Nissan needs on the steering wheel are controls that are useful, not a big paddle that sicks out and turns on the radio when you hit the horn.

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When I hit the horn, I change the station. Every time. Since the horn is useless, I need to unlearn the horn-hitting reflex, at least until I decide to do put in a horn you can hear.

oakwcj said:

EVDRIVER said:

What Nissan needs on the steering wheel are controls that are useful, not a big paddle that sicks out and turns on the radio when you hit the horn.

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When I hit the horn, I change the station. Every time. Since the horn is useless, I need to unlearn the horn-hitting reflex, at least until I decide to do put in a horn you can hear.

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I had the opposite problem. When I tried to push the paddle to change the radio band, the horn blared. I tried it several times with the same embarrassing result every time, so now I always push the XM or FM-AM button on the console.

But, back on topic, yes, I would like a drive selector mounted on the steering wheel or steering column, even though I never use Neutral when driving. What I really, really, want is a larger console storage box, and that huge selector is eating a lot of valuable space there.

Ray

planet4ever said:

oakwcj said:

EVDRIVER said:

What Nissan needs on the steering wheel are controls that are useful, not a big paddle that sicks out and turns on the radio when you hit the horn.

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When I hit the horn, I change the station. Every time. Since the horn is useless, I need to unlearn the horn-hitting reflex, at least until I decide to do put in a horn you can hear.

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I had the opposite problem. When I tried to push the paddle to change the radio band, the horn blared. I tried it several times with the same embarrassing result every time, so now I always push the XM or FM-AM button on the console.

But, back on topic, yes, I would like a drive selector mounted on the steering wheel or steering column, even though I never use Neutral when driving. What I really, really, want is a larger console storage box, and that huge selector is eating a lot of valuable space there.

Ray

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Yes, more Nissan design stupidity, they put a paddle in a recessed hole but make the paddle stick out further than the recess. It seems there is a solution for all these problems. Nissan LEAF, the most modified car to get to work normally

Ford already adopted a steering wheel shift selector. It was over 50 years ago on the Edsel. It did not go over so well.

planet4ever said:

But, back on topic, yes, I would like a drive selector mounted on the steering wheel or steering column, even though I never use Neutral when driving. What I really, really, want is a larger console storage box, and that huge selector is eating a lot of valuable space there.

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This is where I jump in, why oh why do we have gear selectors in modern cars?, for something that most people use twice when they start driving that day.. just put some push buttons on the dash somewhere and be done with it.. chrome them if you have to.

Neutral coasting, or even full auto stop coast/glide are very powerful tools for the hypermilers, for EV drivers the only one that is of any use is to coast without using regen when desired.. why would you want to regen on the hwy?.. its not 100% efficient in recovering your lost kinetic energy so just let go of the gas pedal and let air drag slow you down.. yes if you need to control your speed coming down a mountain then its a good idea. I think regen should be fully customer adjustable, but probably would introduce too many lawsuits in our society.. that is where a mod to give you that control comes in. Some will say regen is fully adjustable by gentle pressure on the gas pedal but that sounds like too much work.. perhaps just an LED that lights up with the slightest bit of regen would be of good use to train your foot.

I gotta ask the folks who use neutral to coast regularly: On a typical trip (let's say a 1/2 hour 20 mile trip or so), in the city with traffic light at about a mile interval or so, how many times do you guys shift in and out of neutral? I figure probably every mile or so, maybe? So about 20 times? Let's say you take 3 such trips a day on the average, totaling about 60 miles a day, that's 60 times. Multiply it by 30 days, that' 1,800 times a month, or 21,600 times a year, or 216,000 times in 10 years.

Aren't you concerned at all that the drive selector is really not designed to be used this often? I'm sure Nissan didn't design it nor test it to make sure it can put up with wear and tear of 60 uses a day on the average.

Sure, feathering the pedal is not as optimal as putting the car in neutral for coasting, but if one feathers the pedal enough, one should be quite skilled after a while to get pretty close to the neutral spot without much effort or distraction with looking at the energy meter.

Having said all this, I do agree that Nissan should give you a selection in D so that when you let go of the pedal, there's no regen at all whatsoever, and you're basically in N. If you want regen, you can always get it from breaking.

You don't need neutral unless your right foot is spastic or numb. You coast by keeping your foot on the accelerator in a neutral position (not accelerating, not decelerating, power meter in dead-center). The power meter in dead-center proves you're not using energy by keeping your foot on the accelerator. The only thing the neutral "gear" selection is good for is conveyor-belt car washes or being dragged onto a flatbed.

Also, while hypermiling needs the right amount of coasting and anemic and timed acceleration, in the real world we have speed limits, intersections, traffic stuck behind us, and red lights and traffic stopped in front of us. It's rarely practical, possible, or legal to coast to the top of a hill (down to very low speed), coast down hills or through big dips (up to very high speed), through red lights, through the back end of that car in front of you, etc. Since you have to slow down anyway, you need regen more often than coasting.

That said, to address the thread topic: it would be very nice to move the "gear" selector to the steering wheel or dash and regain some of that stupidly-wasted-for-the-sake-of-convention console space.

planet4ever said:

I had the opposite problem. When I tried to push the paddle to change the radio band, the horn blared. I tried it several times with the same embarrassing result every time, so now I always push the XM or FM-AM button on the console.
Ray

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This can be very embarrassing when stopped at an intersection.