LeftieBiker
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Re: Using the Leaf for power in a Blackout: MY "Leaf to Home"

Mon Sep 02, 2019 7:47 pm

Iirc, some inverters can support transient loads above their normal rating

Indeed. I just installed a marine-rated inverter with a modest 1250 watt continuous output, but a 4700 watt (for up to 20 seconds) surge output.
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2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
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RustyShackleford
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Re: Using the Leaf for power in a Blackout: MY "Leaf to Home"

Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:50 pm

BrockWI wrote:
Mon Sep 02, 2019 5:58 pm
I have given up on "breakers" and gone to inline fuses

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01N2 ... UTF8&psc=1
I saw those kinds of connectors on some of the breakers at Amazon too. Looks like you just stick the end of the wire in and tighten a set screw ? How does it adjust for different size cabling (I'l probably want to use 2awg like the OP) ?
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BrockWI
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Re: Using the Leaf for power in a Blackout: MY "Leaf to Home"

Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:58 pm

They will list the maximum size wire they can clamp down on and mine came with 2 sizes of smaller sleeves that fit in to take smaller wire. You can also get them that have bolt on for lead with eyelets on them.
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RustyShackleford
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Re: Using the Leaf for power in a Blackout: MY "Leaf to Home"

Mon Sep 02, 2019 9:07 pm

BrockWI wrote:
Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:58 pm
They will list the maximum size wire they can clamp down on and mine came with 2 sizes of smaller sleeves that fit in to take smaller wire. You can also get them that have bolt on for lead with eyelets on them.
Yeah this seems better - whether I use the breaker or fuse version - skips a connection step.
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coulomb
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Re: Using the Leaf for power in a Blackout: MY "Leaf to Home"

Tue Sep 03, 2019 4:08 pm

GetOffYourGas wrote:
Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:01 am
Makes you wonder how long before all of those high-power accessories are converted from 12V to 400V.
Apart from the extreme safety issue, there is the problem of switching off 400 VDC. A cheap rocker switch isn't going to do it; the contacts will arc and the current will keep flowing. DC rated contactors need magnetic blowouts and/or near-vacuum to switch even moderate power levels. Traction batteries will probably drift towards 1000 V for ultra-fast charging, making the safety and switching problems even more extreme.

This is even a problem with 48 VDC, even 24 VDC to an extent, but it's much easier to manage. I suspect that mild hybrid cars will have the blower, headlights and a few other high powered loads on 48 VDC, but the cigarette lighter, interior lights, dash etc may still run off 12 VDC via a DC-DC converter. Anyone know for sure?
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LeftieBiker
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Re: Using the Leaf for power in a Blackout: MY "Leaf to Home"

Tue Sep 03, 2019 5:15 pm

I suspect that mild hybrid cars will have the blower, headlights and a few other high powered loads on 48 VDC, but the cigarette lighter, interior lights, dash etc may still run off 12 VDC via a DC-DC converter. Anyone know for sure?

Not I, but I agree with your guess. It makes more electrical and financial sense to keep using 12 volt accessories where there is no big advantage to 48 volts, and DC-DC converters are cheap and plentiful. Now they just need to make them more robust and reliable. ;-)
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RustyShackleford
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Re: Using the Leaf for power in a Blackout: MY "Leaf to Home"

Wed Sep 04, 2019 3:47 pm

I've purchased the Xantrex PROWatt 1000 inverter used by the OP. I've a bit confused about connections, as there is a chassis ground terminal on the inverter, as well as the battery cable connections '+'and '-'. I understand the '+' terminal should be connected to the Leaf battery's '+' terminal (via a fuse or breaker) and that the '-' terminal should be connected to a threaded hole on the car's engine nearby (the DC-to-DC converter ?) and NEVER to the '-' terminal on the Leaf's battery. But what should that chassis ground terminal on the inverter be connected to ? Also to the car ? Need I drive a grounding rod near where I intend to park the car when using it for 120vac backup ?
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LeftieBiker
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Re: Using the Leaf for power in a Blackout: MY "Leaf to Home"

Wed Sep 04, 2019 4:03 pm

I had a similar issue with the chassis ground with my inverter. In my case I'm going to disconnect it because the inverter is grounded through the house wiring when plugged in, and having two separate grounds was tripping the inverter's GFCI outlet. You, however, need to ground the inverter. You can use a grounding rod, or a ground wire connected to the house ground circuit or to metal plumbing nearby. Don't try to use the Leaf, as it's isolated from ground.
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RustyShackleford
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Re: Using the Leaf for power in a Blackout: MY "Leaf to Home"

Wed Sep 04, 2019 9:35 pm

LeftieBiker wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 4:03 pm
I had a similar issue with the chassis ground with my inverter. In my case I'm going to disconnect it because the inverter is grounded through the house wiring when plugged in, and having two separate grounds was tripping the inverter's GFCI outlet. You, however, need to ground the inverter. You can use a grounding rod, or a ground wire connected to the house ground circuit or to metal plumbing nearby. Don't try to use the Leaf, as it's isolated from ground.
Actually, I'm now thinking I'll try to back-feed some house wiring; if the GCFI outlet's ground is tied to that ground lug next to the battery connections, sounds like I can just leave the latter disconnected.

Plan for back-feeding house is just to plug a double-male cord from the inverter to a single-pole (120vac) house circuit (as I described a few posts back). Obviously need to be careful; I'm imagining a checklist that goes something like this:

1. Switch off the main breakers (in the load center).
2. Switch off all branch-circuit breakers in the load center, except for the critical loads. I guess theoretically the ones on the other "side" could be left on, but why create confusion and risk).
3. Connect a double-male 14awg (or better) cord between the inverter and an unused outlet on one of the critical circuits.
4. Making sure inverter is switched off, plug the inverter 12vdc cord into the wifty rig described in the OP.
5. Put Leaf into "READY" mode.
6. Switch on inverter.

Critical loads could include fridge*, living room lights and ceiling fan, modem, outlets for phone and laptop charger. Oughta last over two days with 40kwh battery. Fridge is pretty modern and I measured 100+ watts running, but difficult to measure compressor startup surge, and I'm not sure how much the un-defeatable auto-defrost uses. Darn range won't let propane flow without electricity; it's got a neutral, so probably has 120vac components and the gas shutoff is probably one of them, so I could leave the double-pole breaker on and hope the energized hot supplies the 120vac components (or switch the hots if it doesn't); sounds good in theory, a bit spooky in practice ...
Last edited by RustyShackleford on Wed Sep 04, 2019 9:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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LeftieBiker
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Re: Using the Leaf for power in a Blackout: MY "Leaf to Home"

Wed Sep 04, 2019 9:53 pm

RustyShackleford wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 9:48 pm
DELETED

Are you asking for a post to be deleted, or just noting that you deleted one of two posts?
Scarlet Ember 2018 Leaf SL W/ Pro Pilot
2009 Vectrix VX-1 W/18 Leaf modules, & 3 EZIP E-bicycles.
BAFX OBDII Dongle
PLEASE don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

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