2016-2017 model year 30 kWh bar losers and capacity losses

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True. I was worried that Nissan would go bankrupt and I guess that would make my warranty worthless. I'm still not sure they are out of the woods. They returned to profitability but the dealership I charge at every couple of weeks has had an ever dwindling supply. They spread the cars out and parked them at an angle to make it look like they had supply. But right now, they have almost no new vehicles. So I'm still worried about claiming the warranty.
 
On a sad note, I have to report that I crashed my Leaf yesterday in a rainstorm. Airbags deployed, front end crushed. Most likely totaled. I walked away. Now I have to replace it. Tesla is on a six month backorder, the LFP battery option is gone (talked to Tesla last night). The ID4 is not in stock currently, the Ionic is delayed to next year, and even Leafs are in short supply. The Aptera isn't scheduled for production until next year. I seem to be stuck on a SL+ as the only viable option due to cost constraints. With $11,000 in rebates and tax incentives, I'm finding it difficult to pass up. With a 60KWH battery, battery degradation is less of a concern and I don't plan on taking any long trips in it so charging rate isn't an issue. If I get a decent settlement from the insurance company, I might only need $20K financed after the rebates. It's not the car I wanted but it is the car I can get. It does leave a taste in the mouth but seems to to be my only real choice. I might do a 24 mo. lease but seems like money down the drain.
 
Yowza! Sorry to hear about that.

Yeah, for giggles, I checked the cheapest Model 3's for order a few days back and the ETA was March 2022. I checked inventory used and new 3's and the prices were absurdly high. And, it's not like Tesla addressed any of my issues w/the 3 other than price, a bit.

I was meaning to start a new thread or to add to an existing one about used Leaf market (specifically on Leaf Plus) and new market. Used gen 2 Leafs Plus and non-Plus seem to have absurdly high prices (sold all by various dealers or Carvana). When I checked https://www.nissanusa.com/shopping-tools/search-inventory, seemed like Leaf inventory was quite light and if you try visiting various dealer web sites, they don't even list having Leafs in stock or they have very few.

Keep in mind the MSRPs on new '22 Leafs has dropped. See https://usa.nissannews.com/en-US/releases/2022-nissan-leaf-press-kit.

I began the buyback process for my Bolt (since it got recalled with all of them on 8/20/21). If GM gives me a good offer and I take it, I'd need a replacement car and want to stick with a BEV. I'd been considering buying a '22 Kona EV or as temp cars leasing an ID.4 (almost certainly out as a choice for me now) or Leaf Plus or buying a used Leaf Plus. I'd rather not buy a new Leaf due to CHAdeMO, rapidgate due to no battery thermal management and historically bad resale value.
 
> I'd rather not buy a new Leaf due to CHAdeMO,

Amazingly, I still have *never* QuickCharged my 2017 Leaf. My sister also has a 2019 Leaf; she has never QC'd either.

I almost did it yesterday, when I had to do about a 90 mile roundtrip in my 2017 Leaf (that is 3 capacity bars down). But instead I noticed a free Volta level 2 charger along my way, in a nice shopping area, and charged for about an hour there. Decided to spend the hour getting my walking steps in that area (instead of getting my 10k steps near my house and then driving the trip). Worked out great. I saw the first low battery warning light right as I pulled into my street on the way home.
 
^^^
You're definitely not the first Leaf or EV driver w/DC FC inlet to have never used that inlet or use it a minimal # of times.

FWIW, when I leased my first '13 Leaf, I used it CHAdeMO inlet about 13 to 16 times in a 2 year span, mostly to pick up free juice. The used '13 Leaf I bought afterward didn't have it and I intentionally chose that to get a cheaper car. Was ok.

For my current Bolt w/CCS (owned since end of Jan 2019), I've used its DC FC inlet countless times, mainly once COVID-19 began and I had to start working from home. Was mainly to pick up free juice (previously a lot when DrivetheARC was giving free juice) and it has helped when I was originally on my way to a pharmacy in Stockton, CA to get a COVID-19 vaccine before I was eligible (they were giving out shots to anyone 16+ back then). The drive would've been almost 200 miles roundtrip. I ended up diverting to Antioch, CA due to receiving a call from a slightly closer pharmacy where I was on a waitlist. I ended up DC FCing a bit on the way back and then when I was near home, I lucked out and picked up 41 kWh by DC FCing for free on Electrify America. PG&E (my electric provider) is very expensive so I almost never charge at home.

Electrify America sometimes has free EV juice, often unannounced. They only install 1 CHAdeMO handle at each site (vs. 5 to 7, sometimes as many as 19 CCS) and if the CHAdeMO handle or its charger is broken, oh well. This is my main issue. EA is installing DC FCs all over the place, esp. on highway travel corridors. The chance of arriving at an EA site w/all CCS handles not working is a lot lower vs the lone CHAdeMO not working.

Also, it's possible the lone charger which has CHAdeMO is in use by a CCS driver and even worse if they've left their car and no contact info. If VW-owned EA didn't pull this crap and treated the two standards equally or closer to equally, I wouldn't have this issue. Seems clear they were looking out for their own (VW's) business interests and it worked in getting people to shy away from Leafs.

On my Bolt, I also DC FC sometimes at a dual-standard DC FC 5 miles from home in an area where I frequently pass which is 19 cents per kWh. That is cheaper than me charging at home.

I've also been meaning to take a roadtrip down to LA (over 330 miles each way) since Dec 2020 but scrubbed it back then due to COVID. Might happen Dec 2021. I have only 1 car in my household right now, my Bolt.
 
cwerdna said:
On my Bolt, I also DC FC sometimes at a dual-standard DC FC 5 miles from home in an area where I frequently pass which is 19 cents per kWh. That is cheaper than me charging at home.

I am on the SRP EV plan, so EV charging is 5.75 cents per kwh (as high as 6.14 cents, depending on the month) if I charge at home and use the car's timer correctly. Which i do :) .

https://www.srpnet.com/prices/home/electricvehicle.aspx

At work, I can also solar charge for free.
 
outerspaceguy said:
cwerdna said:
On my Bolt, I also DC FC sometimes at a dual-standard DC FC 5 miles from home in an area where I frequently pass which is 19 cents per kWh. That is cheaper than me charging at home.

I am on the SRP EV plan, so EV charging is 5.75 cents per kwh (as high as 6.14 cents, depending on the month) if I charge at home and use the car's timer correctly. Which i do :) .

https://www.srpnet.com/prices/home/electricvehicle.aspx

At work, I can also solar charge for free.
We can only dream of rates that cheap in Pacific Gouge & Extort land. To try to keep this thread more on-topic, my reply's at https://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=610409#p610409.
 
Johnlocke,

I am sorry to hear of your accident, but glad you are OK--cars can be replaced. You are probably correct about a total since the air bags deployed. My 2011 was technically repairable (air bags did not deploy and I drove it out of the intersection), but the other driver's insurance company decided to total it because they thought that would cost them less than repair and rental car. I think a Plus model LEAF would serve you well since battery degradation has been minimal on mine after 2 years and 37k miles. The larger battery is a real "game changer" in terms of driving and charging flexibility. I charge every 2 or 3 days instead of every night with the previous cars.
 
cwerdna said:
^^^
You're definitely not the first Leaf or EV driver w/DC FC inlet to have never used that inlet or use it a minimal # of times.

FWIW, when I leased my first '13 Leaf, I used it CHAdeMO inlet about 13 to 16 times in a 2 year span, mostly to pick up free juice. The used '13 Leaf I bought afterward didn't have it and I intentionally chose that to get a cheaper car. Was ok.

For my current Bolt w/CCS (owned since end of Jan 2019), I've used its DC FC inlet countless times, mainly once COVID-19 began and I had to start working from home. Was mainly to pick up free juice (previously a lot when DrivetheARC was giving free juice) and it has helped when I was originally on my way to a pharmacy in Stockton, CA to get a COVID-19 vaccine before I was eligible (they were giving out shots to anyone 16+ back then). The drive would've been almost 200 miles roundtrip. I ended up diverting to Antioch, CA due to receiving a call from a slightly closer pharmacy where I was on a waitlist. I ended up DC FCing a bit on the way back and then when I was near home, I lucked out and picked up 41 kWh by DC FCing for free on Electrify America. PG&E (my electric provider) is very expensive so I almost never charge at home.

Electrify America sometimes has free EV juice, often unannounced. They only install 1 CHAdeMO handle at each site (vs. 5 to 7, sometimes as many as 19 CCS) and if the CHAdeMO handle or its charger is broken, oh well. This is my main issue. EA is installing DC FCs all over the place, esp. on highway travel corridors. The chance of arriving at an EA site w/all CCS handles not working is a lot lower vs the lone CHAdeMO not working.

Also, it's possible the lone charger which has CHAdeMO is in use by a CCS driver and even worse if they've left their car and no contact info. If VW-owned EA didn't pull this crap and treated the two standards equally or closer to equally, I wouldn't have this issue. Seems clear they were looking out for their own (VW's) business interests and it worked in getting people to shy away from Leafs.

On my Bolt, I also DC FC sometimes at a dual-standard DC FC 5 miles from home in an area where I frequently pass which is 19 cents per kWh. That is cheaper than me charging at home.

I've also been meaning to take a roadtrip down to LA (over 330 miles each way) since Dec 2020 but scrubbed it back then due to COVID. Might happen Dec 2021. I have only 1 car in my household right now, my Bolt.
EA has announced that they will stop installing CHADEMO handles after this year. Just CCS. This might not apply in California since EA has a separate agreement with CARB. I think someone is going to have to come up with a CCS/CHADEMO adaptor that can handle the comm link differences. CHADEMO is dead, long live CCS.
 
^^^
Indeed about EA and CHAdeMO. I'd seen news about that (e.g. at https://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=607697#p607697).

This is a big part of why I'm balking at buying a new Leaf at all. EA has barely cared about CHAdeMO even before that news.
 
GerryAZ said:
Johnlocke,

I am sorry to hear of your accident, but glad you are OK--cars can be replaced. You are probably correct about a total since the air bags deployed. My 2011 was technically repairable (air bags did not deploy and I drove it out of the intersection), but the other driver's insurance company decided to total it because they thought that would cost them less than repair and rental car. I think a Plus model LEAF would serve you well since battery degradation has been minimal on mine after 2 years and 37k miles. The larger battery is a real "game changer" in terms of driving and charging flexibility. I charge every 2 or 3 days instead of every night with the previous cars.
If I get a SL+, I'm hoping that I'll only need to charge a couple of times a week. I think that 1200-1500 charge cycles might be possible with the larger battery before I hit 66% capacity. My last 30KWH battery was up to almost 900 charge cycles and still had 75% capacity. I also plan on mostly L2 charging since I have a large PV array and SDG&E net metering. I have a reservation on an Aptera but that's a couple of years out and it would be mostly for shits and giggles or weekend fun. It will also depend on Federal and state rebates whether I buy one. I'm driving my pickup now but the gas will kill me long term. If I could wait for six months, I'd have a better set of selections to choose from but I need a car soon and the Leaf seems to be the only real option.
 
cwerdna said:
^^^
Indeed about EA and CHAdeMO. I'd seen news about that (e.g. at https://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=607697#p607697).

This is a big part of why I'm balking at buying a new Leaf at all. EA has barely cared about CHAdeMO even before that news.
If I planned to do any long distance travel I'd be worried as well, but the truth of it is that I'll using the Leaf mostly locally and it will probably never leave California. EVGO seems to be interested in keeping CHADEMO alive if only for the Tesla community. They have been upgrading stations with Tesla adaptors and new software.
 
RaleighEV said:
I bought my 2017 Leaf SV in May of that year. I never quick charged it until I noticed that I had lost 2 bars last Oct. So I bought Leaf Spy and started keeping a closer eye on things. The first few quick charges brought the SOH from 75.x to 76.x. SOH stayed 76.x for months with me doing about 2 QCs a month. I wasn't trying to kill the battery but it was fun to go on longer drives and see how fast a QG would take. SOH took a dive lately. I guess Summer will do that. I work at home and it was plugged in most of the time (L1).

When I brought it for the yearly battery check I wondered if the report would be different than the first 3. It wasn't, 5 stars for everything. Even the, "Frequent charging when battery state is already high". I know it's a useless test but I'd rather pay for 3 - 5 of them, than be told I didn't follow the warranty rules.

So at about year 4.5 on my 2017 SV:

AHr = 58.01
SOH = 72.99%
Hx = 43.82%
cell delta = 13 mV (at 57.3% SOC)
QC = 17
L1/L2 = 1,451
odo = 36,264 miles

I'd appreciate any comment or insights. By the way LeftieBiker, I think it's a riot that you dubbed the 30kwh battery, the lettuce pack. There is not much to laugh about in these forums, but that is a good one.

Your 3rd bar is about to drop. Should happen at 72.5% SOH, the fourth will go at 66.25% SOH.
 
One year update.
One year since I received new 40 kWh replacement battery for my 2016 Leaf SV.

According to LeafSpy Pro,
I can charge to: 37.5 kWh
AHr = 110.48
SOH = 95.7%
GIDS = 484
Hx = 110.58%

Odometer 77k miles. I added 6k miles in one year since battery
 
Geico totaled my Leaf yesterday. I expect the check in a few days. I've got a reservation in on an SL+. Given the current market for used cars, I plan on buying a new SL+ rather than trying to replace my old Leaf. At $16K for a '16 leaf and $20K for an '18 Leaf with the 40KWH battery VS $29K after rebates on a new 60KWH SL+, I think it makes more sense to buy new and get the 8 yr. battery warranty that comes with it. The rebates tip the scales to the Leaf especially since the wait for a Tesla is up to 6 months now.
 
Hello Everyone,

Wondering what I should do.

2016 Nissan Leaf SV
~35k miles
Down 5 Bars :shock:
No BMS Firmware update yet

Should I just take it in to try to get a Battery Warranty Replacement? Do you think they will see if the firmware has been updated yet? Or should I wait until I lose another Bar. Probably going to lose another Bar next year.

Thanks
 
Get the firmware update since it's required before any warranty claim will be honored. After that, the BMS will adjust and you can get a better idea of the battery's condition. You will probably eventually qualify for a warranty replacement but that won't happen without the firmware update so do that first.
 
Yep on the above. The update is aka campaign PC630 (https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2018/MC-10143139-9999.pdf). NTB18-039 is at https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2018/MC-10143483-9999.pdf.
 
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