woodyas
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 7:03 am
Delivery Date: 28 Nov 2012
Leaf Number: 023132

Carwings--and correct driving miles

Sat Mar 02, 2013 6:31 am

First and foremost: have now had the Leaf for over 3 months--and still widely, passionately, and vociferously in love with this damn car. Love the ride, the quiet cabin, and the utter joy of never having to go to a gas station again. (Or...at least till my lease expires in a few years)

Yes...some minor quibbles here and there. But overall, I can bellow this out with axiomatic certainty: the best car I have ever had.

Period.

Quick question, though: I have noticed recently that when I log into carwings from the Owners Portal on the computer that the miles given on each day is not ALWAYS THE CORRECT NUMBER. Everything is set up in settings to transmit from the car to the carwings. And I am getting data each day--just not all the miles on certain days. Is this happening to anybody else? What am I doing wrong?

As for why I care: what can I say...I have fallen into the spell of being a Leaf fanatic. Not good. And taking away from my main hobby of reading books.

Thanks Nissan!
Cayenne Red
Leased on 11/28/12
Torre Nissan
La Quinta, CA

edatoakrun
Posts: 5222
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Carwings--and correct driving miles

Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:37 am

="woodyas"
...I have noticed recently that when I log into carwings from the Owners Portal on the computer that the miles given on each day is not ALWAYS THE CORRECT NUMBER. Everything is set up in settings to transmit from the car to the carwings. And I am getting data each day--just not all the miles on certain days. Is this happening to anybody else? What am I doing wrong?...
Here are my suggestions, for you and other CW users.

All 2011-2 LEAFs, AFAIK, have reported the same Carwings odometer and Dash m/kWh error of consistently under-reporting by ~2.5%.

So if your CW miles driven is ~2.5% lower than your dash odometer miles, and your dash m/kWh is showing ~2.5% less than your nav screen m/kWh (0.1 m/kWh lower below ~6 m/kWh, and 0.2 m/kWh lower when you are getting over ~6 m/kWh) this is "normal" for 2011-2012 LEAFs.

Hopefully, Nissan has fixed this error in the 2013s. Any readers have a CW equipped 2013? Please check and report back.

If you are "missing" more miles than this, go to the "rate simulation" page at the CW site.

Here, each "trip" (each start/stop cycle) will be individually reported. Make sure that each of the "trips"you have made each day, is showing up. Each trip will show the same ~2.5% under-report of miles driven as your daily total, and each m/kWh report there will match your dash (if you reset it) for the corresponding trip, again showing the same ~2.5% under-report error.

The Dash, nav screen and CW m/kWh all are mathematically "correct" as a function of the total kWh use reported by CW for every trip, day, or months driving.

It's just that the dash uses the same ~2.5% understated miles to make its calculation of m/kWh as CW does, while the nav screen is always accurate as a function of reported kWh use, as it uses the dash odometer miles, for the m/kWh calculation.

Got it?

BTW, while every LEAF driver, AFAIK, has reported the dash odometer as very close to correct, while using stock tires and wheels, IMO it wouldn't hurt to confirm your dash odometer is correct, by checking with another source, such as Google maps.

Now back to the "rate simulation" page, If you are missing any "trips", that you made on any given day, and every driver is pushing "accept" every time, please report back.

I have missed only a couple of "trips" in the ~12,000 miles since I've been using Carwings (since an update corrected errors in the early LEAFs) so I believe they probably have all been due to operator error on my part, as I make a very quick stab at the screen, and I think I probably just missed "accept" a couple of times.
no condition is permanent

woodyas
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 7:03 am
Delivery Date: 28 Nov 2012
Leaf Number: 023132

Re: Carwings--and correct driving miles

Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:57 am

Very cogent breakdown here!

Do I have it all? Not sure.

But thanks for taking the time to saliently spell all that out.

Good stuff.
Cayenne Red
Leased on 11/28/12
Torre Nissan
La Quinta, CA

edatoakrun
Posts: 5222
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Carwings--and correct driving miles

Sun Mar 03, 2013 12:32 pm

woodyas wrote:Very cogent breakdown here!

Do I have it all? Not sure.

But thanks for taking the time to saliently spell all that out.

Good stuff.
Its probably a lot easier to SEE it at the carwings site, than to understand the explanation I posted above.

BTW, if you haven't already, be sure to also check out the regen kWh reports on the CW "rate simulation" page.

Every LEAF has two sources of kWh for charging the battery, those kWh you download from the grid, and those you gain from recycling that grid energy, during descent or deceleration, to use over again.

The "bubble" and center screen reports of kW use just don't give you the view of total regen kWh that you can only get from the CW "trip" reports.
no condition is permanent

DesertDenizen
Posts: 399
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:23 am
Delivery Date: 11 Sep 2014
Leaf Number: 314507
Location: Tucson

Re: Carwings--and correct driving miles

Sun Mar 03, 2013 1:27 pm

Beautiful write ups Ed! I looked at last month and my ratio of kwh consumed to kwh from regen was 4.05. Sounds good to me!
Fully charged by photo voltaic system.
Nov 9 2014 got my 2015 lease, SL. My third Leaf. Tucson AZ. 5,500 miles, 5.2 long term m/kwh. Let us see if the 'lizard' battery does better than my 2011, which lost a capacity bar at 6,771 miles.

edatoakrun
Posts: 5222
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Carwings--and correct driving miles

Sun Mar 03, 2013 2:50 pm

DesertDenizen wrote:Beautiful write ups Ed! I looked at last month and my ratio of kwh consumed to kwh from regen was 4.05. Sounds good to me!

Is that ratio already calculated for you somewhere at CW?

I had always expressed my regen as r/t (regen/total kW use) rather than as consumed (=grid)/regen.

So, following your suggestion, I checked my c/r ratio. It was 6.0 last month, and 6.28 for January.

I went back to 2012, for a Summer c/r, when I get much greater regen, due to fewer charges past "80%" and higher battery temps (my~55 mile commute which begins and ends with ~2,000 ft total descent and ascent, is only comfortable in winter at "80%" on sunny days) and I got 4.48 for last August.
no condition is permanent

DesertDenizen
Posts: 399
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:23 am
Delivery Date: 11 Sep 2014
Leaf Number: 314507
Location: Tucson

Re: Carwings--and correct driving miles

Sun Mar 03, 2013 3:00 pm

I was just being lazy and divided the total of the Consumption column by the total of the Regeneration column. I would not have guessed regen of 1 kwh for each 4 consumed. It will be interesting to see what I get in the summer. I am exclusively in ECO and rarely use my brakes and coast a lot. Never even looked at the Rate Simulation page until I read your post.
Fully charged by photo voltaic system.
Nov 9 2014 got my 2015 lease, SL. My third Leaf. Tucson AZ. 5,500 miles, 5.2 long term m/kwh. Let us see if the 'lizard' battery does better than my 2011, which lost a capacity bar at 6,771 miles.

FGARCIA25
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2013 9:09 pm
Delivery Date: 14 Feb 2013

Re: Carwings--and correct driving miles

Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:42 pm

I can confirm that the above statement is still the same with the 2013 model. I have the SL version and always wonder why is this the case.

edatoakrun
Posts: 5222
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:33 am
Delivery Date: 15 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2184
Location: Shasta County, North California

Re: Carwings--and correct driving miles

Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:59 am

FGARCIA25 wrote:I can confirm that the above statement is still the same with the 2013 model. I have the SL version and always wonder why is this the case.

Hi, FGARCIA25,

Is the "statement" you refer to this:

...All 2011-2 LEAFs, AFAIK, have reported the same Carwings odometer and Dash m/kWh error of consistently under-reporting by ~2.5%.

So if your CW miles driven is ~2.5% lower than your dash odometer miles, and your dash m/kWh is showing ~2.5% less than your nav screen m/kWh (0.1 m/kWh lower below ~6 m/kWh, and 0.2 m/kWh lower when you are getting over ~6 m/kWh) this is "normal" for 2011-2012 LEAFs...
Or were you referring to something else?

Congratulations on the 2013. Have you tried a 100% to LBW or VLBW range test yet?

With a new 2013 in Florida, you could probably get well over 100 miles without having to try very hard, and (if you wanted to discharge further) maybe even get close to the current MNL long-range record (set in a 2011 MY, but at higher altitude and, possibly, temperature, putting you at a disadvantage) If you wanted to try for it.
no condition is permanent

LEAFfan
Posts: 4828
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 6:08 pm
Delivery Date: 08 Jun 2011
Leaf Number: 1855
Location: Phoenix Area

Re: Carwings--and correct driving miles

Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:20 am

edatoakrun wrote:
FGARCIA25 wrote:I can confirm that the above statement is still the same with the 2013 model. I have the SL version and always wonder why is this the case.

Hi, FGARCIA25,

Is the "statement" you refer to this:

...All 2011-2 LEAFs, AFAIK, have reported the same Carwings odometer and Dash m/kWh error of consistently under-reporting by ~2.5%.

So if your CW miles driven is ~2.5% lower than your dash odometer miles, and your dash m/kWh is showing ~2.5% less than your nav screen m/kWh (0.1 m/kWh lower below ~6 m/kWh, and 0.2 m/kWh lower when you are getting over ~6 m/kWh) this is "normal" for 2011-2012 LEAFs...
Or were you referring to something else?

Congratulations on the 2013. Have you tried a 100% to LBW or VLBW range test yet?

With a new 2013 in Florida, you could probably get well over 100 miles without having to try very hard, and (if you wanted to discharge further) maybe even get close to the current MNL long-range record (set in a 2011 MY, but at higher altitude and, possibly, temperature, putting you at a disadvantage) If you wanted to try for it.
FYI, the Phoenix Efficiency Rally is coming in May again, and I plan to shatter my record. I will drive at LEAST 180 miles on one charge. :mrgreen:
Remember, when I set that record, the car had already lost 10-11% BC.
2013 LEAF SV Del. 2/28/13
2013 LEAF World Record for Most Miles Driven On One Charge-188 miles/8.8 m/kW h
4.8 kW DC PV ($ .91/W fully installed)/ Dec., 2010

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