Why would anyone buy a nissan leaf right now???

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Availability in SoCal still very sporadic. Been looking for a new SL+ for the last 3 weeks and yet to secure one in preferred color. Many dealers putting on large markups and/or so called "dealer accessories" which is a hard pass. Waiting patiently but its starting to wear thin! Fingers crossed that the one with my deposit on it from a "no-addon/markup" dealer will turn up soon.
 
In case white is your preferred color...

https://www.nissanofbakersfield.com/new/bakersfield-2022-nissan-leaf-sv-plus-1n4bz1cvxnc553293

They have a white SL Plus too.

Road trip?
 
alozzy said:
They have a white SL Plus too.

Road trip?

Thanks. Its a hard pass. About $7K more expensive compared to San Diego area dealers. There is a reason those cars are sitting on the lots. Appreciate your help though. Thank you
 
This thread is definitely an interesting blast from the past i stumbled across.

I got my '16 Leaf SL in April of 2017. The 40kwh battery wasn't 2 months from nationwide availability and ironically, in terms of EV availability not a whole lot has changed in my area with sporadic availability - Quad Cities (IL/IA).

When I was looking back then, I had a '92 Geo Prizm that was the family second car that i only drove to work. No A/C, dodgy radio, crank windows that barely rolled down, loose suspension in turns and a head gasket leak. I had originally wanted a BMW i3 but there wasn't one in the area and although i could have had it shipped to the local dealer, since they didn't even list it on their website - I had concerns about whether they would even have a tech to service it if needed.

The Hyundai Ioniq had also just came out but it wasn't and still isn't available around here 4 years later. A host of other EVs were a similar deal and only out in the compliance markets (e-Golf, Focus Electric, 500e, Spark EV). I had even briefly considered the i-miev but that was short lived when I saw the dealer it was at was further away than the EPA range.

I wasn't interested in waiting for the Bolt or Model 3 to come out. (Assumption was Bolt would take until December of that year to make it to my area, Model 3 was in my mind a gamble since Tesla was new to the automaker world.)

All said and done i would buy my leaf again since it's been a no hassle car and now my only car since I divorced. I can fit the kids in the backseat and dogs (Greyhound and smaller Aussie) in the hatch which is a big consideration for any replacement car.

I don't think the Leaf is as compelling as it used to be with more models coming out that are objectively better, but the price makes it still very competitive today. I would still greatly hesitate on a Tesla due to build quality issues, time to repair if in an accident (2-6 months on average to get parts) and 2 hour drive to nearest service center if I had an issue not fixable by OTA or mobile tech.

If money were no object, i would probably be going for a Rivian or the XC40 BEV.
 
gcrouse said:
If money were no object, i would probably be going for a Rivian
Because of the outstanding reliability record, or because service and a fully stocked warehouse is nearby ?
 
While I do like our Leafs, price is what keeps it going.
The number of higher quality cars you can buy for under 20K is shrinking shockingly quickly. If the range fits your needs it is a great value.

I am curious to see if when Ariya hits the showroom floors, if it creates one last hurrah for the Leaf as people will cross shop the 45-60K Ariya vs. The 20-32K Leaf/Leaf+ (post incentives) and debate if the premium is worth it for their needs.
 
With the frequent price increases for Telsa models, it's starting look like the Ariya will be in a different category than the Model Y, which has to be good news for Nissan.
 
Because of the outstanding reliability record, or because service and a fully stocked warehouse is nearby ?

Neither. The factory where they are all built currently is Normal, IL which is 2 hours away and i like to support companies that invest in areas around me. Thankfully i don't live in Ohio where i would be stuck rooting for Lordstown which is doomed.

In terms of vehicle choice, I'd like to switch back to a 4wd SUV without having to go back the gas route since packing 2 kids, 2 dogs and camping gear in a leaf for a week of camping is challenging enough so i want the extra space. Since I tend to buy vehicles on a 10-20 year basis, i want something with decent off road capability for future national park vacations and the 4WD truck/SUV market is in its infancy. The Tesla X/Y aren't really good off-road vehicles, Rivian designed their vehicles with the off-road and camping crowd like me in mind and the only other SUVs with 4wd that are really compelling to me are the XC40, ID.4 with AWD when it comes out and the Wrangler PHEV. I think Bollinger will struggle to come to market and the GM Hummer EV is probably wider than i would prefer on mountain roads.

IMO, Tesla (with it's hype club) is about 10 years ahead of everyone in battery tech but that's all they've got going for them with the fundamentals. As other automakers bring vehicles to market, they are going to be in the same position that Nissan was with the Leaf if they don't expand beyond what amounts to 3 different models. (3/Y might as well be considered like Bolt and Bolt EUV). FSD package for Tesla might as well be vaporware given how far behind Tesla is on that tech compared to other companies like Waymo.
 
WetEV said:
alozzy said:
As we all know, the accelerated pack degradation in hotter climates is a problem for the LEAF. But otherwise, far too much emphasis is put on range and charging time for EVs in general and some of that blame has to fall on the shoulders of the journalists and pundits.

For the vast majority of people who could install L2 charging at home, charging time isn't an issue and the 62 kWh pack provides several days of range.

Frustrating that more people don't understand this...

I'm not sure that pack degradation is still a problem. And with likely future cell chemistries, probably even less so.

Agree. I guess it depends on how you define "problem".

I've thought about this quite a bit. For our use case, since we have way more battery that we typically need, I'm pretty sure degradation isn't an issue:

  • Even assuming a worst case degradation of 30% inside 8 years, we would still have enough range for our day-to-day needs
  • Much more than that and the capacity warranty would kick in, so there's a "floor" to the risk profile.
  • There will likely also be the option of replacing the battery short of 30% with presumably a much better battery in a few years
  • Not to mention the aftermarket value of the degraded battery, which will would still have something like 3 PowerWalls of capacity in the above scenario

All of the above means to me that the real question is whether this little commuter car can continue to meet some reasonable portion of our transportation needs looking forward. If so, we can keep it. Otherwise, we'll sell. Just like any other vehicle.
 
Biggest drawback then is the same now; the cherrypicked trip. Now in the past, it was easy. Now is more challenging with a lot more public charging (which almost NEVER plays a part in the argument) and 200+ mile ranges but it still remains the #1 obstacle to EV adoption.

The VERY close 2nd is simply education as it relates to their POV. Most still quote decade old news as if it was still true today.

Although its a really bad time to buy; the average sale price for a car in 2021 will appear to be $45,000 which is a huge jump. But also means that the price premium paid for most EVs has evaporated.
 
I doubt my circumstance applies to many, but for me (looking at trading my 2017 Prius 2 for a 2022 SV plus). My reasoning is this...

I'd like to go full EV, particularly as I can offset charging with my own solar.
Being retired, and that I can usually plan my 2-3 times a week to town (averaging 25 miles each trip) while keeping an eye on the local weather forecast. Done a lot of miles in the past, I can usually pick and choose now :).

I expect I'd be paying near MSRP, but my Prius is only now approaching 18,000 miles on the odometer and is in excellent condition. New cars are scarce, but so are good well kept and lightly used trades, which the dealer really wants right now.

The Tech Package...I spent 25 plus years as an Engineering Tech, how could I not :). And it is a step-up the late 217 Prius TSS-P system.
The larger battery pack, while I don't need the range, would have a much longer cycle life since I'll trickle charge only and drive like I'd like to live to see another day...no high pack discharge rate (unless I'd see something very big closing at my six o'clock with the driver only paying attention to their Phone, I see that all the time...). Using a conservative range guestimate of 200 miles my trips would only use about 1/8th of the capacity, so i can keep the Lithiums in their happy zone, not too much charge and not too much discharge. Would also help over the years as the battery does lose capacity.

As for another reason to choose the Leaf, a Chevy Bolt is a dicey proposition at best even if they resume production, and a Telsa Model 3 would now run you basically $50K and even then be well into next year to get. That the Leaf uses air cooling instead of the preferred liquid cooling most use for the battery, shouldn't pose a problem since where I live usually doesn't get into the 100+ range and my trips are short anyway. I like to keep tabs on the cars systems anyway and would use a Leaf Spy and monitor everything that I could and stay well out of trouble. I use a pair of Scan Gauges on my current Prius to keep tabs on things.

Haven't made a final decision to purchase yet, so any comments on my logic are welcome...:).
 
Your logic is fine. Advice on trading in: tell the dealer you aren't going to trade in the Prius, that a family member wants to buy it. Make the deal, THEN ask about the trade. You won't regret doing it that way.
 
Not a bad time to buy used leaf though if you have a car to trade in. The trade in value for my car soared during the pandemic…thousands more than I paid for it two years ago so I bought a 2018 leaf SV with that trade. Felt like I got a good deal and used these cars can be had for a good price right now
 
gearyleaf said:
Not a bad time to buy used leaf though if you have a car to trade in. The trade in value for my car soared during the pandemic…thousands more than I paid for it two years ago so I bought a 2018 leaf SV with that trade. Felt like I got a good deal and used these cars can be had for a good price right now
How much was the 18 Leaf before tax and fees? How many miles? Did it have Tech and weather packages?
 
fester said:
That the Leaf uses air cooling
That term is used loosely. There is no airflow inside the LEAF pack. Cooling is only via contact of the battery case with outside air.
Too bad, really. Air ventilation would be a considerable improvement. It is actually what Toyota does.
 
SageBrush said:
fester said:
That the Leaf uses air cooling
That term is used loosely. There is no airflow inside the LEAF pack. Cooling is only via contact of the battery case with outside air.
Too bad, really. Air ventilation would be a considerable improvement. It is actually what Toyota does.

Keeping water out of the pack seems to be a good idea.
 
I still think the leaf is a great choice and recommend it as an option. But in BC ( and I think all of Canada) it’s realistically no longer available. We recently doubled the amount of leafs we have available for sale in the country. We had one. Now we have two. So there is that. (Just going by autotrader.ca. There may be others). But supply has definitely dried up. Our local dealer told folks we recommended a leaf to it would probably be 6 months before they got one. I think Nissan is concentrating on other markets, or just can’t produce them. Most EV’s sold in this province now are Teslas, and not a single rebate applies to any of them.
 
Supply here in Chicago has rebounded a tad. At one point we were down to just 2 Leafs in the whole metro area, but are back up to a dozen. From the daily changes in stock down then back up, it does feel like they are selling at some pace.

Curious to see how end of year sales numbers stack up.
 
SageBrush said:
Too bad, really. Air ventilation would be a considerable improvement. It is actually what Toyota does.
I’d be interested to learn what Toyota does. I suspect air ventilation for the Leaf would require a considerable amount of redesign.

The Leaf’s thermal inertia is actually an advantage most of the time - the exception being when DCFCs are combined with high speed driving.
 
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