User avatar
TomT
Posts: 10648
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 12:09 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: California, now Georgia
Contact: Website

Re: Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:43 am

You could plan on doubling the price at least if it had to undergo UL testing. However, I don't believe that a conversion of this type requires UL certification regardless. Consider it akin to a "repair..."
smkettner wrote:This is all very interesting. There have been many comments on new EVSEs to check if they are UL compliant... will the conversion meet UL specs?
Last edited by TomT on Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Leaf SL 2011 to 2016, Volt Premier 2016 to 2019, and now:
2019 Model 3; LR, RWD, FSD, 19" Sport Wheels, silver/black; built 3/17/19, delivered 3/29/19.

User avatar
garygid
Gold Member
Posts: 12469
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:10 am
Delivery Date: 29 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000855
Location: Laguna Hills, Orange Co, CA

Re: Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:54 am

This device is UL "listed" for 120v use. Once modified in any substantial way, like running 240v through it, the UL "listing" no longer covers it.

However, the unmodified unit could be defective and still have a UL Listing. The modified version could be "quite safe" and just not have a "Listing" because it has not been submitted (substantial cost and delay).
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
2010 Prius
2011 LEAF, 2014 Tesla S85
2018 & 2019 Tesla Model 3
PU: SDG&E
Solar PV: 33 x 225W -> 7 kW max AC
Craigslist: Xm5000Li Electric Motorcycle

User avatar
Spies
Posts: 837
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2010 8:22 am
Delivery Date: 10 Jan 2011
Leaf Number: 0255
Location: Foster City, CA

Re: Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

Mon Feb 14, 2011 10:37 am

garygid wrote:1. The 2011 LEAF's max charging current draw appears to be just shy of 16 amps. Thus about 3800 watts (not just 3300 watts) when using 240v source.
Thank you for pointing that out! Seems drees's estimation of around 75% of "normal" L2 charge seems about right.
Green Honda EV Plus 02/1998-12/2003 plate "ZERO CO2" rip, Aptera 2e #726 canceled
Blue Nissan Leaf SL loaded reserved 04/20/2010 ordered 08/31/2010 EVSE Blink #182
CARWINGS Nickname Theres233, should be Spies

User avatar
EVDRIVER
Moderator
Posts: 6753
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:51 am

Re: Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

Mon Feb 14, 2011 10:41 am

Spies wrote:
garygid wrote:1. The 2011 LEAF's max charging current draw appears to be just shy of 16 amps. Thus about 3800 watts (not just 3300 watts) when using 240v source.
Thank you for pointing that out! Seems drees's estimation of around 75% of "normal" L2 charge seems about right.

Output is about 2.88kw in a perfect setting. Upgrading to 16A raises other issues besides a new pilot in the micro controller, this also does the light controls and GFI control so it would be a major redesign. Not worth the modification.

User avatar
EVDRIVER
Moderator
Posts: 6753
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:51 am

Re: Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:22 am

garygid wrote:This device is UL "listed" for 120v use. Once modified in any substantial way, like running 240v through it, the UL "listing" no longer covers it.

However, the unmodified unit could be defective and still have a UL Listing. The modified version could be "quite safe" and just not have a "Listing" because it has not been submitted (substantial cost and delay).

Technically, once the case is open the UL listing is void. Same for a basic repair on a TV. Gary's comments are correct.

DarkStar
Posts: 2066
Joined: Sat Jul 17, 2010 10:06 am
Delivery Date: 25 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 568
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon, USA
Contact: Website

Re: Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:56 am

EVDRIVER wrote:
garygid wrote:This device is UL "listed" for 120v use. Once modified in any substantial way, like running 240v through it, the UL "listing" no longer covers it.

However, the unmodified unit could be defective and still have a UL Listing. The modified version could be "quite safe" and just not have a "Listing" because it has not been submitted (substantial cost and delay).

Technically, once the case is open the UL listing is void. Same for a basic repair on a TV. Gary's comments are correct.
Sometimes I think when I just look at something I void any and all certifications it may or may not have had... :D
Mikiko (2011 Nissan LEAF ETEC) Status:
Reserved: 04/20/10 | Ordered: 10/01/10 | EV Project Blink Installed: 03/22/11 | Delivered: 03/25/11 | VIN: 568

Oregon Electric Vehicle Association | Electric Auto Association

User avatar
garygid
Gold Member
Posts: 12469
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:10 am
Delivery Date: 29 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000855
Location: Laguna Hills, Orange Co, CA

Re: Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:22 pm

Many UL Listed items have to be opened for cleaning, filter changing, etc.
So, I did not think that "just opening" any case voids that product's listing.

Perhaps cases marked as "No User-Serviceable Parts Inside" puts a case in a different category?

Many modifications, even small, would cause the Listing on the "stock" item to no longer apply to the item, especially if they in any way impact the high-voltage (over about 25 volts?) parts of the equipment.

However, proper (authorized by the OEM?) service, repair, or upgrade, using properly rated replcement parts, should not make the item "unlisted", I would think. Am I wrong?
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
2010 Prius
2011 LEAF, 2014 Tesla S85
2018 & 2019 Tesla Model 3
PU: SDG&E
Solar PV: 33 x 225W -> 7 kW max AC
Craigslist: Xm5000Li Electric Motorcycle

User avatar
EVDRIVER
Moderator
Posts: 6753
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:51 am

Re: Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:53 pm

garygid wrote:Many UL Listed items have to be opened for cleaning, filter changing, etc.
So, I did not think that "just opening" any case voids that product's listing.

Perhaps cases marked as "No User-Serviceable Parts Inside" puts a case in a different category?

Many modifications, even small, would cause the Listing on the "stock" item to no longer apply to the item, especially if they in any way impact the high-voltage (over about 25 volts?) parts of the equipment.

However, proper (authorized by the OEM?) service, repair, or upgrade, using properly rated replcement parts, should not make the item "unlisted", I would think. Am I wrong?
\\We are speaking in technicalities here but if you repair one part on a TV it would need to be tested again technically. Opening a "sealed" case can be a tech violation, perhaps even changing a lamp shade on a lamp. You get the picture.

User avatar
garygid
Gold Member
Posts: 12469
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:10 am
Delivery Date: 29 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000855
Location: Laguna Hills, Orange Co, CA

Re: Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:00 pm

Does that mean that if the OEM gets one resistor from a different supplier, the original Listing no longer applies?

Legally, what is the "Listing" law (if you already know)?

Or, are you just guessing?

Most items can be repaired and serviced, right?
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
2010 Prius
2011 LEAF, 2014 Tesla S85
2018 & 2019 Tesla Model 3
PU: SDG&E
Solar PV: 33 x 225W -> 7 kW max AC
Craigslist: Xm5000Li Electric Motorcycle

User avatar
DeaneG
Posts: 1110
Joined: Tue May 04, 2010 9:20 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Apr 2011
Leaf Number: 594
Location: Cupertino, CA

Re: Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:32 pm

Typically, the manufacturer maintains a list of controlled components which are critical to the safety listing of each product. These components must be replaced with an identical component to maintain the listing, or the manufacturer has to notify UL and ask that the product's report be amended to include the alternative part. UL may want to re-test a portion of the product's behavior to verify safety.

At least this is how it works when the product is manufactured.
White SL w/L3, 3kWDC Solar PV

Return to “EVSE / Charging Equipment and Networks”