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dgpcolorado
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Re: Pls give us START time in "charging timer" - 2013 Leaf S

Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:37 am

tallgirl wrote:
KJD wrote:The most efficient way to use the power grid is to charge at night when the load is light. Charging during the day just adds to the peak load on the grid. Not a good thing to do.
PV. I charge from the grid during the day when the sun is shining and I don't want to lose $0.033 on the buy / sell spread.

If the PoCo wants my electricity during peak demands, they can damned well pay me the spread.
You are not alone. I also tend to charge at midday when the sun is shining. However, where I live that's off peak— but I don't have TOU billing—so even the local power co-op is happy.
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GregH
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Re: Pls give us START time in "charging timer" - 2013 Leaf S

Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:47 am

dgpcolorado wrote:
tallgirl wrote:
KJD wrote:The most efficient way to use the power grid is to charge at night when the load is light. Charging during the day just adds to the peak load on the grid. Not a good thing to do.
PV. I charge from the grid during the day when the sun is shining and I don't want to lose $0.033 on the buy / sell spread.

If the PoCo wants my electricity during peak demands, they can damned well pay me the spread.
You are not alone. I also tend to charge at midday when the sun is shining. However, where I live that's off peak— but I don't have TOU billing—so even the local power co-op is happy.
In the summer I sell my PV to the grid for about $0.32/kWh then buy it back at night to charge the car for about $0.08/kWh.
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BestPal
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Re: Pls give us START time in "charging timer" - 2013 Leaf S

Thu Apr 25, 2013 3:43 pm

tallgirl wrote:First, to dispel a myth -- crippleware =does= save companies a significant amount of money in maintenance expense, especially when the "low cost" version of the software is the more common in the marketplace. I've been a software engineer for 34 years and I assure you, I could sell a stripped down version of the software with the basic features -- the ones that have been tested the most and for the longest period of time -- for far less than I can sell the latest and greatest with all the bells and whistles, if maintenance expense and development amortization is all that's figured in.

...
I would agree that supporting a second version of software including it's development, QC and roll-out would be expensive for Nissan and what I am asking for in this thread is not practical AT THIS POINT - but hey we have a space on this forum for suggestions, so why not ask. Maybe and hopefully future generations of Leaf will have this corrected. But to say that it would be prohibitively expensive for them to include START timer at the time of initial development, knowing that hardware support is already there.. well that's entirely bogus! I'm in IT development too and I can assure you that if the initial request for software development included request for that functionality, it wouldn't take the development team (most likely one person working on that software interface) more time to include that setting in the software than it probably took them to complain to co-workers at the water-cooler how dumb it is NOT to include it.
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planet4ever
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Re: Pls give us START time in "charging timer" - 2013 Leaf S

Thu Apr 25, 2013 5:27 pm

BestPal wrote:I would agree that supporting a second version of software including it's development, QC and roll-out would be expensive for Nissan and what I am asking for in this thread is not practical AT THIS POINT - but hey we have a space on this forum for suggestions, so why not ask. Maybe and hopefully future generations of Leaf will have this corrected. But to say that it would be prohibitively expensive for them to include START timer at the time of initial development, knowing that hardware support is already there.. well that's entirely bogus!
OK, let's get one thing clear. The timer support in the SV and SL is based on a touch screen for user input. That's really the only "hardware support" other than a CAN message that can be sent to a switching device to start the charging. That touch screen hardware support is not available in the S. Why don't you try to design a fancy timer with start and stop times and days of the week when all you have to work with for user input is two hardware buttons. I guarantee it will not be acclaimed as user friendly.

Given the two-button restriction I fully agree with the decision Nissan made. This is absolutely a situation for KISS. There is very little additional function in having a start time, and much complication in user interface.

Ray
End of April 2013: Traded my 2011 SL for a 2013 S with charge pkg.

BestPal
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Re: Pls give us START time in "charging timer" - 2013 Leaf S

Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:23 pm

planet4ever wrote:OK, let's get one thing clear. The timer support in the SV and SL is based on a touch screen for user input. That's really the only "hardware support" other than a CAN message that can be sent to a switching device to start the charging. That touch screen hardware support is not available in the S. Why don't you try to design a fancy timer with start and stop times and days of the week when all you have to work with for user input is two hardware buttons. I guarantee it will not be acclaimed as user friendly.

Given the two-button restriction I fully agree with the decision Nissan made. This is absolutely a situation for KISS. There is very little additional function in having a start time, and much complication in user interface.

Ray
Have you seen the 2013 S interface? If not, please take a look at it. The END timer is easily accessible with just those two buttons - no problem to set it up. I use it every day. What makes you think that duplicating that line in the menu with a start timer is much too complicated? I do not understand your assumptions. And I'm not here to argue with anyone, this is a thread for SUGGESTIONS for Nissan. That's my suggestion that really would help ME with my use of LEAF. Why is it taken as such a big deal that I dared to speak of it? Come on... breath. Please.
Last edited by BestPal on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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davewill
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Re: Pls give us START time in "charging timer" - 2013 Leaf S

Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:29 pm

BestPal wrote:Have you seen the 2013 S interface? If not, please take a look at it. The END timer is easily accessible with just those two buttons - no problem to set it up. What makes you think that duplicating that with a start timer is much to complicated. I just don't get it.
I've had this argument on other interfaces so many times it isn't funny. Some people don't mind using just a button or two to skip through lots of options, and others seem to find it almost impossible. I certainly have had my share of trying to talk people through such things over the phone. If I had been designing this I'd have been tempted to do the same thing Nissan did, but I can see why you want it.
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dgpcolorado
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Re: Pls give us START time in "charging timer" - 2013 Leaf S

Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:39 pm

planet4ever wrote:...Given the two-button restriction I fully agree with the decision Nissan made. This is absolutely a situation for KISS. There is very little additional function in having a start time, and much complication in user interface.

Ray
I agree Ray. For the basic S model Nissan was trying to implement KISS. For you, me, BestPal, or most of the other denizens of MNL, learning to program start/stop timers would be no big deal. But remember the huge number of people back in the days of VCRs who left the clock flashing 12:00 because they could never figure out how to set it or how to use the program recording timers. It became a running joke about the people who were technologically unsophisticated.

For those of us who want the more sophisticated timers, the SV and SL models are available. But end-time-only has a lot of advantages and few disadvantages for most people.
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BestPal
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Re: Pls give us START time in "charging timer" - 2013 Leaf S

Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:55 pm

dgpcolorado wrote:I agree Ray. For the basic S model Nissan was trying to implement KISS. For you, me, BestPal, or most of the other denizens of MNL, learning to program start/stop timers would be no big deal. But remember the huge number of people back in the days of VCRs who left the clock flashing 12:00 because they could never figure out how to set it or how to use the program recording timers. It became a running joke about the people who were technologically unsophisticated.

For those of us who want the more sophisticated timers, the SV and SL models are available. But end-time-only has a lot of advantages and few disadvantages for most people.
Excellent, excellent points. But what should I care if it would make my life easier? ;) Doesn't hurt to ask... although as I'm finding out even on this forum the amount of resistance to such a suggestion makes it almost not worth it to ask :D All right, all right, I see your point that for MOST people it might be a little too much. How about an option to enable extra features in the menu IF you want to? KIDDING!!! Stop chewing my flipping head off :D
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GregH
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Re: Pls give us START time in "charging timer" - 2013 Leaf S

Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:27 pm

If, as I understand it, Nissan opted to just put one setting (end time) rather than two (start and end) to make the non touch screen interface easier... Why 'end' and not 'start'? Could it be that it's simpler for people to comprehend what time they want it full by? Or.. Is this an acknowledgement that more time at lower SOCs is important (ie only charge right before you need it)...?
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Reddy
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Re: Pls give us START time in "charging timer" - 2013 Leaf S

Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:57 pm

I'll add another twist into the mix. In the future, when there are millions of EVs (we can hope can't we?), the charging stations will likely meter out the electricity depending upon the health of the grid. Having only a single "end" time allows short (millisecond to minutes) reduction in electricity flow throughout the night without affecting the customer. Thus, charging might start any time from the time you plug in, until your end time. Probably just as easy to have both start & end times as well, I don't know.
Reddy
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Long: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... al#p226115"
Cold: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... 60#p243033"

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