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Re: All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2011 12:22 pm
by SanDust
BnBinSD wrote:Is there any info on how much each vehicle's battery pack weighs? I've always wondered if some mfr's have an edge in this area, or they're all pretty much the same.
I think what you're really interested in is the energy density of the cells. How much the pack weighs is a function of the wh/kg of the cells and how many cells you have. If you double the energy density of each cell and double the number of cells in a pack you have the same weight as you started with. IOW it's not about kg it's about kW/kg or kWh/kg and the mass of the pack per se isn't that relevant.

You'll see the biggest differences in mass at the anode.

Re: All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2011 12:55 pm
by Rusty
SanDust wrote:I think what you're really interested in is the energy density of the cells. How much the pack weighs is a function of the wh/kg of the cells and how many cells you have.
Only partially agree. True pack weight is a function of energy density. But it's also affected by pack structure and mechanics. In a comparative analysis, some vendor's packs are ambient cooled, air cooled from cabin AC, or liquid cooled (which might want to be added to the table as well). So in addition to wh/kg pack weight reflects a manufacturer's engineering trade-off decisions between additional pack functionality and weight trade-off considerations, including their affect on AER and potential pack lifetime.

Re: All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 6:56 am
by ChargedUp
EVNOW great work on the spec sheet. Do you really think the base model Leaf compares with the feature set of the FFE?

Re: All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 7:26 am
by Caracalover
Wny no Tesla roadster? It was the first, and should get a nod.

Re: All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 7:35 am
by TomT
It's no longer in production. I believe the list is only intended to reflect those vehicles that are in or will likely be in production.
Caracalover wrote:Wny no Tesla roadster? It was the first, and should get a nod.

Re: All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 8:37 am
by evnow
ChargedUp wrote:EVNOW great work on the spec sheet. Do you really think the base model Leaf compares with the feature set of the FFE?
Yes - out of 6 feature differences between SV & SL, FFE has only the camera. The most important difference between SV & SL is is the QC - and FFE doesn't have that. By any rational measure, FFE is closer to SV than SL.

But, this is the topic for a different thread.

Re: All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 9:04 am
by IBELEAF
Interisting, Leaf being the first available car still has the right balance of price and specs.

Re: All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 9:30 am
by Herm
IBELEAF wrote:Interisting, Leaf being the first available car still has the right balance of price and specs.
Self selection much?.. I bet someone in the Volt forums would have a different opinion :)

Re: All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Posted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 7:53 pm
by evnow
Update to the list considering some of the suggestions - including better numbers for i3.

Re: All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Posted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 11:08 pm
by LEAFfan
evnow wrote:
JRP3 wrote:Aren't most people doing better than 73 miles? The 30% hit seems a bit extreme compared to real world results.
73 miles is about 3.4 m/kwh. I think it is on the lower side - ofcourse in cold climates, driving on freeways you can go below that. But I'd say the average is better than that.
My question would be what percentage of LEAF drivers drive 70mph on the freeways/Intersates and how often? That's the ONLY way (without HVAC) they should be getting 3.4m/kW h. I would hope the average would be much higher than that if they aren't using HVAC and the freeways. I've never driven any appreciable distance yet on the freeways so I don't know for sure what I would get, but if I did use them for a longer trip, I would drive 60mph (in the rl) and go over 80 miles (on a 100% charge). I believe I could get at least 4.0 on the dash.
Oh, btw, a Toyota salesperson told me the other day that the RAV4 BEV is due out for sale mid 2012 at the same time as the newly designed 2012 RAV4 ICE. I don't really believe it, but time will tell. He had no dollar figure, but I'm going to guess it to be at least 40K+.