SageBrush
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Re: Porsche Taycan - A 300 mile EV

Fri Nov 01, 2019 2:15 pm

jlv wrote:
Fri Nov 01, 2019 1:59 pm

Well, I consider the pre-production, kludged Model S they are playing with silly "entertainment"
.
Why ?
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

GRA
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Re: Porsche Taycan - A 300 mile EV

Fri Nov 01, 2019 3:14 pm

SageBrush wrote:
Fri Nov 01, 2019 12:49 pm
^^ Par for the course for that "entertainment" show.
I wonder how the pre-production Model S upgrade is doing on the 'ring. Elon has hinted that it will handily beat the Porsche but I have not seen any results.

Here's why, from about a week ago:
Tesla Model S Nurburgring update: A crash, more Superchargers, and new mods
https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-model-s ... r-spoiler/
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GRA
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Re: Porsche Taycan - A 300 mile EV

Fri Nov 01, 2019 3:18 pm

jlv wrote:
Fri Nov 01, 2019 12:25 pm
GRA wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 5:51 pm
IEVS:
Porsche Taycan Vs Tesla Model S: Review, Road Test, Race, Charging
https://insideevs.com/reviews/379401/vi ... he-taycan/
Oh, and the Taycan beat the S 0-60, 2.61 to 2.68 seconds on the very first (and only) drag race, not that that matters all that much.
Lots of stories the last two days about how it looks like TopGear fudged the results, using prior results from 2017 for the Model S and not the current production numbers with the Raven update.

I've seen those stories. See the bolded section of my previous post. Nobody's buying a Porsche for drag racing, and a tenth or two 0-60 either way between the Model S and Taycan falls into the 'who cares?' category.

EDIT: IEVS has a story which includes a response from the people at Top Gear, wherein they say
In a post published yesterday on the website portion of the Top Gear franchise, the editors admitted that they used fake numbers in their article. If you suspected the reason behind that was some simple bumbling or loss of the fresh figures, you'd be wrong. They claim they went with the fake digits – they were originally generated during an older comparison of the Tesla Model S versus the Mercedes C63 – because they were actually better than the best results produced in this latest test. Yes, it's a head-scratcher.

Besides offering this nonsensical explanation, the site also defended its testing procedure, saying, "...we ran the drag race five times and the Porsche won every time by a small but increasing margin with each subsequent race." It also added that, "... the Tesla was in Ludicrous+ mode, the battery was pre-conditioned and both cars had around 85 per cent charge before the first run."

The problem with this explanation is that it doesn't add up if you pay attention to the video. While we can't speak to the quarter-mile result, it certainly doesn't appear as though the Taycan records a better 0-to-60 time in the first few seconds of the race. Check out the footage beginning at the 55-second mark. Clearly, the Model S stays pulls ahead and stays there for at least the initial four seconds, presumably reaching 60 miles per hour quicker. Also, as you can see in the image at the top of this post, the Model S is clearly ahead of the Taycan above 83 mph.

Of course, it could be that this bit of interior footage was just recorded for dramatic effect and delivery of the (lame) neck-brace joke and wasn't part of the recorded results, but there is no way to know.

It's not unusual for different examples of the same car to vary significantly in testing, not to mention the same car giving different results depending on who's testing it, so this explanation can't be dismissed out of hand. OTOH, the article goes on to note that a screen grab during the race appears to show the S in Range rather than launch mode. For people who can't get enough of watching Model S vs. whatever drag race videos on IEVS, I'm sure that someone will do another test.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GRA
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Re: Porsche Taycan - A 300 mile EV

Mon Nov 04, 2019 7:04 pm

^^^ And here we go, via IEVS (just the S):
Top Gear Tesla Vs Taycan Controversy Continues With New Video
https://insideevs.com/news/380263/top-g ... mes-video/


Interestingly, the 0-60 times are right in line with Top Gear's numbers. They said 2.68 sec., and the Model S P100D Raven used in this test did 2.73 @ 86% SoC, and 2.65 sec. @ 96% SoC using launch mode, and 2.86 sec. @ 86% without it. The 1/4 miles did improve significantly, though.


Here's the latest from Nurburgring and the Model S Plaid, via IEVS:
Tesla Model S Plaid Laps Ring In 7:13: Beats Taycan By 29 Seconds
https://insideevs.com/news/380247/tesla ... at-taycan/


That car has some major aero mods from stock, and no word on when it might be available to buy.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

SageBrush
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Re: Porsche Taycan - A 300 mile EV

Mon Nov 04, 2019 9:59 pm

GRA wrote:
Mon Nov 04, 2019 7:04 pm
and no word on when it might be available to buy.
.
Wrong
2013 LEAF 'S' Model with QC & rear-view camera
Bought off-lease Jan 2017 from N. California
Two years in Colorado, now in NM
03/2018: 58 Ahr, 28k miles
11/2018: 56.16 Ahr, 30k miles
-----
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR, Delivered 6/2018

GRA
Posts: 11957
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Porsche Taycan - A 300 mile EV

Tue Nov 05, 2019 4:22 pm

You've seen an official, guaranteed date for it, with a production equipment spec? We've seen Elon make a few off the cuff claims, but we know what those are worth. If you've got a hard date, do tell.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

GRA
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:49 pm
Location: East side of San Francisco Bay

Re: Porsche Taycan - A 300 mile EV

Tue Nov 19, 2019 5:16 pm

IEVS:
It Turns Out Porsche Taycan Deliveries Are Delayed
https://insideevs.com/news/383171/porsc ... ery-delay/


Apparently, it's not just Tesla that runs into early issues with production and delivery.

A recent post on the Facebook Porsche Taycan Group reveals that the Taycan is now running on an 8- to 10-week delivery delay. A Norwegian reservation holder received an email from the German automaker explaining the situation. . . .

Check out the email from Porsche below (translated from Norwegian):

  • "Taycan is our first fully electric sports car. The car is developed from scratch and manufactured in a brand new factory. All Porsche employees have worked with full pressure to start delivering Taycan as scheduled in January. Still, as a result of the enormous complexity surrounding the production of Taycan, we must report that unfortunately the delivery dates are somewhat delayed.

    We currently expect delays of around eight to ten weeks, and a new production time for your car will be communicated through your seller as soon as this is ready. We strongly apologize and guarantee that we will do everything we can to deliver your Porsche Taycan as soon as possible
    ."
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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jlv
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Re: Porsche Taycan - *NOT* a 300 mile EV

Wed Dec 11, 2019 2:44 pm

Official EPA rating of 201 miles.

(Perhaps the thread title shouldn't include "300 mile EV" anymore)

https://insideevs.com/news/387298/2020- ... epa-range/
LEAF '13 SL+Prem (mfg 12/13, leased 4/14, bought 5/17, sold 11/18) 34K mi, AHr 58, SOH 87%
Tesla S 75D (3/17)
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iPlug
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Re: Porsche Taycan - A 300 mile EV

Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:14 pm

Shnikies, just 69 MPGe (49 kWh/100 miles). Doesn't this thing have a coefficient of drag of only 0.22-0.25?

Are thread starters allowed to modify the thread title to correct the info to "Porsche Taycan - A 200 mile EV"?
'19 Model 3 SR+ (own), '19 Leaf SV (leased), '12 Plug-in Prius (sold 3/19), '16 Leaf SV (prior lease), 11.43kW Solar PV (16MWh/yr real production), 20.5 SEER/13.0 HSPF ducted air-source heat pump, 3.70 UEF heat pump water heater, Induction Cooktop

GRA
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Re: Porsche Taycan - A 300 mile EV

Wed Dec 11, 2019 6:50 pm

Note that the City efficiency is lower than the Hwy efficiency, which shows the effects of a 5,132 lb,. curb weight. I suspect some of the rest is due to grippy, non-LRR tires. This is somewhat disappointing for the U.S., not that I think the typical Taycan customer will care given how the car will likely be driven.
Guy [I have lots of experience designing/selling off-grid AE systems, some using EVs but don't own one. Local trips are by foot, bike and/or rapid transit].

The 'best' is the enemy of 'good enough'. Copper shot, not Silver bullets.

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