Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

greenleaf said:

Bassman said:

Ingineer,
Can a 5000 watt step up transformer be used to power your modified L1/L2 EVSE? I see a 5000 watt Seven Star Step up Transformer Voltage converter that says it can be operated continuous at 80% and will make a 120 volt outlet a 240 volt.

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No it will not work with a single outlet.

As mentioned by others, the maximum power available from a single 15A 120V outlet is limited to 1800W. Any higher current would trip the breaker.

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Well, many residential outlets are served by 20A circuits these days, so you can get by with 2.4kw (resistive) if you were to push it, though it's not advised. The minimum you'd need would be probably around 25 amps, which you are unlikely to find anywhere in a residential setting. In fact, the only place you would ever be likely to see a 120V 30A outlet, is the old RV plug standard, though many places only offer a NEMA 14-50 and 5-15/5-20 these days.

Not to mention that a 3kw transformer (minimum needed) is going to be very bulky and extremely heavy!

The "Quick220" is a much better solution if all you have access to are standard residential 5-15 outlets, but again; try to find a dryer outlet first, that's your best/safest option!

-Phil

IF IF IF one had a 30A 120v circuit (max 24A continuous), the 1:2 transformer would give 240v at 12A continuous, just enough for the mod-L1 EVSE.

HOWEVER, a 240v circuit would usually be much easier/better.

The 33-amp value above is incorrect, should be 24 amps, I believe.

Ingineer said:

... A lot of residential wiring is 14awg, and on many more recent installations, they use the friction-lock back wiring to daisy-chain the outlets. Drawing a continuous 12A on such systems could waste a lot in heat in the walls, all the while slowing down your charge.

If you do use a device like that "Quick220", (should be called a Quick240, really) try to make sure you choose outlets as close to the breaker panel as you can.

-Phil

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The same advice would, of course, apply to using even the unmodified EVSE on a 120V line.

We have 20 amp 120 volt outlets at work and I already have the transformer from when I worked overseas. I use it to power 220 volt equipment bought while in Hong Kong. Irealize that the Quick 220 is a better solution, but it means spending an additional $240 plus shipping.

mwalsh said:

Also take care not to overload your panel. Always bear in mind what you're currently using before adding a new circuit.

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ok, not even close. house was designed for central air which it does not have. 200 amp panel, total amps on the panel now is . the thing is barely half full.

**edit** sorry about that. my son is messing me up here

it has a total of 90 amps of 220 a 40 a 30 and a 20
on 110
5@20 amps
6@ 15 amps

davewill said:

Ingineer said:

... A lot of residential wiring is 14awg, and on many more recent installations, they use the friction-lock back wiring to daisy-chain the outlets. Drawing a continuous 12A on such systems could waste a lot in heat in the walls, all the while slowing down your charge.

If you do use a device like that "Quick220", (should be called a Quick240, really) try to make sure you choose outlets as close to the breaker panel as you can.

-Phil

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The same advice would, of course, apply to using even the unmodified EVSE on a 120V line.

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Actually it's worse on 120V, as you also have the Neutral return to worry about! That doubles the heat in the same wiring, as compared to the "Quick220" method.

This is why there are warnings on the EVSE and we also require people who submit their EVSE's for upgrade to acknowledge this in our release form. It's definitely possible that if you plugged a 12A load into a worn-out receptacle or used a cheap power-strip, etc, you could start a fire before any breakers would trip!

Luckily, the Leaf's charger will detect appreciably high voltage drop and stop charging, which adds some extra safety.

-Phil

Bassman said:

We have 20 amp 120 volt outlets at work and I already have the transformer from when I worked overseas. I use it to power 220 volt equipment bought while in Hong Kong. Irealize that the Quick 220 is a better solution, but it means spending an additional $240 plus shipping.

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As the above posts mention; there is almost no way you can use a transformer, as you'd need a 30 AMP circuit which you simply don't have. And I seriously doubt that transformer is rated for 3kva! It's probably half that at best!

Try it, and you'll likely pop a breaker within seconds, and/or possibly either burn up the transformer!

DON'T!

-Phil

DaveinOlyWA said:

mwalsh said:

Also take care not to overload your panel. Always bear in mind what you're currently using before adding a new circuit.

Click to expand...

ok, not even close. house was designed for central air which it does not have. 200 amp panel, total amps on the panel now is . the thing is barely half full. <snip>

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This is definitely worth verifying, but even the 100-year-old victorians around this area with knob-and-tube wiring can usually handle 12A as long as nothing else is on the circuit. I've seen some of these with only two 20 amp circuits! But in theory, you could still use a Quick220 and charge at 240v as long as you make sure everything substantial in the house is off, and that the wiring and outlets are in good enough condition to do this safely.

People in those buildings run 1600w space heaters all the time!

-Phil

Phil,
Do you still have any new, modified EVSEs for sale (no exchange)?
A spare EVSE would be handy.
Thanks, Gary

garygid said:

Phil,
Do you still have any new, modified EVSEs for sale (no exchange)?
A spare EVSE would be handy.
Thanks, Gary

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We keep going out of stock! We should have another unit in next week, I can let you know if you like. If you would, please send us a message using the form on the site, that way we can keep a list of who wants what and make sure first come is first served.

-Phil

Ingineer,
With the following post in mind, I have a question. If we can upgrade to the 6.6kW charger, how will that affect your modded evse?

Maybe now people will believe me......

Though well on its way to joining the Dodo, one of the internal combustion engine's advantages over its plug-in competition is refuel time -- it only takes a few minutes to gas up, but you're talking hours for an EV to top off its batteries via a standard 220 / 240-volt socket. This fact is not lost on Nissan, as it just revealed plans to offer a higher-rate charger in its 2012 Leaf -- the current model's 3.3kW charger needs eight hours to power up -- in order to better compete with the Ford Focus Electric's three to four hour charge time courtesy of its 6.6kW. And all you early adopters won't be "orphaned," as 2011 model Leafs can be retrofitted with the new electrics -- no word if Daddy Warbucks will be footing the bill.

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rawhog said:

Ingineer,
With the following post in mind, I have a question. If we can upgrade to the 6.6kW charger, how will that affect your modded evse?

Maybe now people will believe me......

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It will not affect it at all, it will still charge at 12A on 120v or 240v yielding roughly 1.4kW or 2.8kW respectively. The EVSE tells the car what the maximum amps it should limit charge to, and a 6.6kW charger will still obey this.

Personally, I don't lend much credence to ABG's posts, as they are often full of hype. Until Nissan itself officially announces a 6.6kW charger, I am not going to buy into rumors.

Unfortunately, upgrading the existing Leaf's Charger is non-trivial. It's a lot of parts, wiring, and labor. I don't see it happening! (see my investigation here)

-Phil

I will use the web form to let you know when I am ready for one.

However, I thought others would want to know about your modified spare (no exchange) L1/L2 EVSE (and its price) even if you have them available only occasionally, or perhaps only by appointment.

This non-exchange "Spare/Backup" EVSE is not (yet) listed on your site, so many will not know think to ask you about it.

Cheers, Gary

garygid said:

I will use the web form to let you know when I am ready for one.

However, I thought others would want to know about your modified spare (no exchange) L1/L2 EVSE (and its price) even if you have them available only occasionally, or perhaps only by appointment.

This non-exchange "Spare/Backup" EVSE is not (yet) listed on your site, so many will not know think to ask you about it.

Cheers, Gary

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The price is $699 (when in stock). We will eventually get it added to the site, we just were waiting for more stock to arrive first.

-Phil

Several people have recently asked me questions on extension cords. First off, for future questions, please ask them here in the forums instead of sending me email or a PM, that way everyone gets to benefit from the answers.

You can probably extend the EVSE's 24 foot range an additional 30 feet if you use a good quality L6-20 extension cord made with a minimum of 12AWG cable. One such source for these cords is here. That is a 15 foot extension, which will give you up to almost a 40 foot reach (with the EVSE's cord) or you can get 2 and that will give you almost 55 feet.

I don't recommend you exceed this distance without moving to a heavier gauge cordset, such as at least 10awg. Otherwise your charge time will increase, and you (or some poor soul) will be paying for electricity that never makes it to your car, and is instead heating up the cord. Also: if the voltage drop is too much, the Leaf will stop charging altogether!

-Phil

I received the upgraded EVSE from Ingineer about a week ago and have only used it at work in 120V mode until yesterday. Friday night I built a NEMA 10-50 adapter using Home Depot parts and was able to enjoy 240V charging with my portable (now L1/L2) at my father-in-laws house. Like everyone else has already said, it works great! Thank you Ingineer for offering this.

Picture pictures.!!

Ingineer said:

Question: If I were able to offer an additional upgrade level for the EVSE to a selectable 20A, would it be worth it?

I did some more digging, and I believe with some time investment I could update the unit's software such that we could add a user selectable current. (up to 20A)

All the components in the EVSE are rated to 20A, so this is possible w/o any additional hardware modifications. The Leaf would only pull ~16A on 240v, but it might pull more on 120v if permitted so that would be a reason to go over 16A. (I'll have to test this)

The time investment would be significant, so wanted to gauge interest. If you are interested, what would it be worth to you?

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Still reading through all 48 pages of this thread so I am not sure what the outcome is but I would be interested. I have a 20amp 120v outlet in my garage that ismbegging to be used.

On a 120v outlet this mod is of little value to you. It's only useful if you have access to a 240v outlet.

Based on your other post about adapters (very helpful btw) it looks like you can convert a dedicated 120v outlet to a 240v by swapping wires to create 2 hot wires. Is that possible? I imagine there would be wiring changes at the service panel too.