2019 "60 kWh" Leaf e-Plus

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It's already far later than most people hoped. I was excited about this Leaf, but I've moved on. Nissan really needs to get it out there this fall if they want to stay in the game."

Nissan currently has the best selling electric car ever. It it is selling about 8000 new Leafs per month and one of its factories can't keep up with demand. It is the number one selling car in Norway this year, regardless of fuel source. That's never happened anywhere else in the world with any other electric car or manufacturer. The head of Nissan at the release of the second generation Leaf stated that Nissan makes money on every gen 2 Leaf it sells and that it was making money on some of the first generation as well. No other electric vehicle manufacturer is doing that. Nissan are well and truely ahead of the game - people are just judging them by a different set of parameters.
 
geefish said:
It's already far later than most people hoped. I was excited about this Leaf, but I've moved on. Nissan really needs to get it out there this fall if they want to stay in the game."

Nissan currently has the best selling electric car ever. It it is selling about 8000 new Leafs per month and one of its factories can't keep up with demand. It is the number one selling car in Norway this year, regardless of fuel source. That's never happened anywhere else in the world with any other electric car or manufacturer. The head of Nissan at the release of the second generation Leaf stated that Nissan makes money on every gen 2 Leaf it sells and that it was making money on some of the first generation as well. No other electric vehicle manufacturer is doing that. Nissan are well and truely ahead of the game - people are just judging them by a different set of parameters.

Nissan is currently the best selling electric car ever, but this year is well behind other brands.

Tesla is selling 11000 cars (S, X and 3) per month, and is growing at a higher rate. Tesla is making money on the Model S, and probably is making money on the Model X.

And BIAC is the largest selling electric. Yes, China market mostly, with only tiny exports to date.

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WetEV said:
geefish said:
It's already far later than most people hoped. I was excited about this Leaf, but I've moved on. Nissan really needs to get it out there this fall if they want to stay in the game."

Nissan currently has the best selling electric car ever. It it is selling about 8000 new Leafs per month and one of its factories can't keep up with demand. It is the number one selling car in Norway this year, regardless of fuel source. That's never happened anywhere else in the world with any other electric car or manufacturer. The head of Nissan at the release of the second generation Leaf stated that Nissan makes money on every gen 2 Leaf it sells and that it was making money on some of the first generation as well. No other electric vehicle manufacturer is doing that. Nissan are well and truely ahead of the game - people are just judging them by a different set of parameters.

Nissan is currently the best selling electric car ever, but this year is well behind other brands.

Exactly. Nissan has led the way, but now has been leap-frogged. The 40kWh 2018 Leaf is a good evolution of the 30kWh 2017 Leaf, but it's not enough to stay relevant for long. They need at least the option of a 60kWh Leaf to really stay in the game.
 
So.... I'm a little puzzled that it's July and Nissan is not putting out any real information about when the e-Plus will be released. I know they're not Elon Musk or anything, but can we get a tweet or something? What is the best source for e-Plus release information?
Like many people I am going to be stuck between getting a Standard Tesla 3 and a Leaf e-Plus, and my decision will probably be made by who gives me the best information on when I'm getting my car. So far Tesla gets an F (I was on the list on Day 1, in person), and Nissan on this new Leaf gets a C-.
These two cars will have the same range, but not the same federal credits. Who else out there is making this decision, and what factors are you taking into account. Tesla's configurator now predicts 6 months to 9 months (I'll just call it 9 months, seriously guys) for a Standard model. That could put me into a quarter-credit situation, while the Leaf still offers the full credit. Am I really willing to lose $6,000 in credits while sitting around waiting for the 3?
JG
 
barsad22 said:
So.... I'm a little puzzled that it's July and Nissan is not putting out any real information about when the e-Plus will be released. I know they're not Elon Musk or anything, but can we get a tweet or something? What is the best source for e-Plus release information?
Like many people I am going to be stuck between getting a Standard Tesla 3 and a Leaf e-Plus, and my decision will probably be made by who gives me the best information on when I'm getting my car. So far Tesla gets an F (I was on the list on Day 1, in person), and Nissan on this new Leaf gets a C-.
These two cars will have the same range, but not the same federal credits. Who else out there is making this decision, and what factors are you taking into account. Tesla's configurator now predicts 6 months to 9 months (I'll just call it 9 months, seriously guys) for a Standard model. That could put me into a quarter-credit situation, while the Leaf still offers the full credit. Am I really willing to lose $6,000 in credits while sitting around waiting for the 3?
JG
C- is a pretty high score considering the only source of info given by Nissan Corp that I've found is here :
https://www.nissan-global.com/EN/
If Nissan follows it's usual agenda best I would hope for would be around Sept/Oct 18
 
I would not expect the car to hit the market till after December. When did the My18 come out? Base it on that. Charging infrastructure alone would make M3 a better choice if you plan on traveling.
 
I have also heard from a couple of different places the 60 will be out later maybe late spring of 19, arriving behind the stock 40. But know that would help a lot. I have about a 18 months before I have to make the leap, if it were today I would go with the Bolt, but hopefully the Leaf 60 or the T3 will be an option in 18 months.
 
BrockWI said:
I have also heard from a couple of different places the 60 will be out later maybe late spring of 19, arriving behind the stock 40. But know that would help a lot. I have about a 18 months before I have to make the leap, if it were today I would go with the Bolt, but hopefully the Leaf 60 or the T3 will be an option in 18 months.

The good news is that the full tax credit will probably still be available for Nissan at that point. They are falling behind GM, and way behind Tesla. And their sales in the US haven't been noteworthy with the 2018 Leaf.
 
barsad22 said:
So.... I'm a little puzzled that it's July and Nissan is not putting out any real information about when the e-Plus will be released. I know they're not Elon Musk or anything, but can we get a tweet or something? What is the best source for e-Plus release information?
Maybe you haven't heard of the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect?

I was actually surprised that Nissan during the '18 Leaf reveal alluded to a long range, higher performance version and press releases like http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa/presskits/us-2018-nissan-leaf-press-kit have, as well. And (I haven't been following this thread), at an EVent at Nissan's Sunnyvale research office I was at, a slide was put up by the marketing guy indicating 225+ miles range for model year 2019. (There were numerous MNLers present, besides myself.)

I posted about it at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=505320#p505320. Slide at https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10155768448614413&set=g.170730229651313&type=1&theater&ifg=1. I spoke to the person who took that pic and posted it. Seems other sources have ummm.... repurposed that pic. I believe some other cities which had a Leaf EVent might've gotten a slightly different version of that slide.
 
Maybe you haven't heard of the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect?

Osborne effect is an issue if you are the only game in town. Doesn't work if you are offering Old Maid while people are becoming more interested in Texas Holdem.

I think that Nissan USA is more at risk of the Commodore 64 effect. Had an excellent early offering that was ahead of its time and multiple magazines devoted to it and one of the earliest on-line forums. Fell behind, didn't catch up, and people moved on. I refuse to be suckered into a repeat of my 2011. Bolt is looking better and better.
 
2011RedLeaf said:
Maybe you haven't heard of the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect?

Osborne effect is an issue if you are the only game in town. Doesn't work if you are offering Old Maid while people are becoming more interested in Texas Holdem.

I think that Nissan USA is more at risk of the Commodore 64 effect. Had an excellent early offering that was ahead of its time and multiple magazines devoted to it and one of the earliest on-line forums. Fell behind, didn't catch up, and people moved on. I refuse to be suckered into a repeat of my 2011. Bolt is looking better and better.

If you’re ready for a new car, get that Bolt. Everyone I know who has one absolutely loves it.

The 2018 Leaf is a good car. I’m really enjoying mine, but is hasn’t evolved a great deal from the first gen Leaf. The only competitive advantage it has is price, which will disappear if and when the Model 3 SR finally hits, or if Chevy makes all the electric models they were planning before the Bolt was released (I’m a bit worried given how poorly the Bolt has sold despite its awesomeness).
 
jonathanfields4ever said:
2011RedLeaf said:
Maybe you haven't heard of the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect?

Osborne effect is an issue if you are the only game in town. Doesn't work if you are offering Old Maid while people are becoming more interested in Texas Holdem.

I think that Nissan USA is more at risk of the Commodore 64 effect. Had an excellent early offering that was ahead of its time and multiple magazines devoted to it and one of the earliest on-line forums. Fell behind, didn't catch up, and people moved on. I refuse to be suckered into a repeat of my 2011. Bolt is looking better and better.

If you’re ready for a new car, get that Bolt. Everyone I know who has one absolutely loves it.

The 2018 Leaf is a good car. I’m really enjoying mine, but is hasn’t evolved a great deal from the first gen Leaf. The only competitive advantage it has is price, which will disappear if and when the Model 3 SR finally hits, or if Chevy makes all the electric models they were planning before the Bolt was released (I’m a bit worried given how poorly the Bolt has sold despite its awesomeness).


I have a '17 Volt Premier with Driver's Confidence II. I really like the lane following/blindspot monitoring/ACC and will insist on it in any future cars. I am not willing to make payments on two "Premiers". Current Volt LT has no DCII available. I understand the '19s will.
So far, no dealer in Albuquerque has been able to keep a Bolt on the lot long enough for me to see if my fat seat fits well in the maligned Bolt narrow, hard seat.
 
First official comments from a Nissan executive regarding the larger battery Leaf.

https://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2018/07/long-range-nissan-leaf-e-plus-coming-2019-will-200-hp.html
 
geefish said:
It's already far later than most people hoped. I was excited about this Leaf, but I've moved on. Nissan really needs to get it out there this fall if they want to stay in the game."

Nissan currently has the best selling electric car ever. It it is selling about 8000 new Leafs per month and one of its factories can't keep up with demand. It is the number one selling car in Norway this year, regardless of fuel source. That's never happened anywhere else in the world with any other electric car or manufacturer. The head of Nissan at the release of the second generation Leaf stated that Nissan makes money on every gen 2 Leaf it sells and that it was making money on some of the first generation as well. No other electric vehicle manufacturer is doing that. Nissan are well and truely ahead of the game - people are just judging them by a different set of parameters.
Er, not so sure about that. An independent engineering company has a YouTube video that shows Tesla is enjoying about a 30% profit on the Model 3. I don't know the details of the analysis, but that's the biggest profit margin in the EV world that I've heard of. Here's a link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAS-yjWj9DY
 
SalisburySam said:
geefish said:
It's already far later than most people hoped. I was excited about this Leaf, but I've moved on. Nissan really needs to get it out there this fall if they want to stay in the game."

Nissan currently has the best selling electric car ever. It it is selling about 8000 new Leafs per month and one of its factories can't keep up with demand. It is the number one selling car in Norway this year, regardless of fuel source. That's never happened anywhere else in the world with any other electric car or manufacturer. The head of Nissan at the release of the second generation Leaf stated that Nissan makes money on every gen 2 Leaf it sells and that it was making money on some of the first generation as well. No other electric vehicle manufacturer is doing that. Nissan are well and truely ahead of the game - people are just judging them by a different set of parameters.
Er, not so sure about that. An independent engineering company has a YouTube video that shows Tesla is enjoying about a 30% profit on the Model 3. I don't know the details of the analysis, but that's the biggest profit margin in the EV world that I've heard of. Here's a link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAS-yjWj9DY

Yeah, most serious analyses indicate that Tesla is making money on a per-unit basis on all three models of cars. The company is in the red because they are investing heavily in the future. Someday soon that needs to end, and the company needs to be self-supporting, but I digress. The point remains that they are making and selling the S, X, and 3 profitably.
 
I have to give Nissan a thumbs up for providing and sticking to manufacturing EV's. I also give them a thumbs up for many of their franchised dealerships providing quick charging. When they finally have liquid TMS on their traction battery, it will be a fantastic day! Their previous cars have been well engineered (except battery), and with what I am expecting, it will finally have a well engineered, long mileage capable, traction battery with TMS. I really want them to do well.
 
Evoforce said:
I have to give Nissan a thumbs up for providing and sticking to manufacturing EV's. I also give them a thumbs up for many of their franchised dealerships providing quick charging. When they finally have liquid TMS on their traction battery, it will be a fantastic day! Their previous cars have been well engineered (except battery), and with what I am expecting, it will finally have a well engineered, long mileage capable, traction battery with TMS. I really want them to do well.
As do I. As I mentioned in another post, I really, really like my LEAF for almost everything. Unfortunately, it weakens over time at a vehicle’s primary purpose: actually getting me someplace. That someplace has had to become nearer and nearer every year to an unacceptable level.

My opinion: Nissan has not taken advantage in any way of its first mover advantage. From an excellent, ground-breaking, market-dominant all electric vehicle in 2011-2012, Nissan added only some tweaks over the years (heat pump, faster charger, slightly better battery chemistry, fewer nag screens) and the really disappointing (at least to me) and uncompetitive 2018 range increase to only 150 miles. During that time it also removed some useful features like the button to turn off the always annoying backup beeping, and the electronic parking brake. Nissan also perpetuated LEAF weaknesses such as the ancient vintage of the maps, a horrible (to me) voice command system, and a truly non-intuitive user interface for navigation. The LEAF of today, I believe, could have been so very much more, easily a Tesla Model 3 lookalike or possibly more, had the early years’ management team decided to leverage their lead. There is always an opportunity for redemption and MY19 might be that chance for the LEAF. It is just sad that whatever that vehicle will be could probably have been done in MY16 and been a Volt/Bolt/Tesla-killer car.

And it gets worse as basic driver expectations are escalating. You can imagine many areas where a gee-whiz feature of today will become standard soon but I see at least two: In 2010 when I registered for my LEAF, who could envision vehicles from multiple manufacturers having 300+ mile ranges? Fast forward 8 years and here we are. That could mean 300+ ranges will rapidly become table stakes possibly in base configurations with optional much longer ranges. Navigation systems based on static, expensive-to-update map information more than a few months old will be phased out and instead live Waze-like current information online will be available as been done for years on smartphones and tablets making this more the norm.

It is an exciting time for electric vehicles, I think. What I have not seen unfortunately, is the will on Nissan’s part to leapfrog to a position better than a few years behind other competitors’ products. Could they come back? Certainly. Will they? Unlikely, given the glacial pace and limited scope of improvements in the 2011-2018 model years.

That said, I stilll love my LEAF...until this Thursday when I get my Model 3.
 
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