DaveinOlyWA
Gold Member
Posts: 12073
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Lizard Pack Holding Up

Sun Mar 20, 2016 9:52 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
lorenfb wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:you are not wrong and we need to understand that small tweaks to the chemistry is not limited to MY releases. It is an ongoing process which would imply that the later the car, the better the battery pack. Now all of this might even qualify as baby steps but the one thing that is sure is that Nissan is not done or even taking short breaks on their better battery quest.


Your battery capacity at 32K miles versus my 2013 (31.5K miles) at about the same delivery time (mine late 11/2013)
has almost an additional 10 Ahr of capacity (mine @ 53 Ahr). Although your production number is about 6K units
later, that's very strange!


oh... I suppose its not a good time to mention my ahr was 64.45 this morning?...
my "build date" was 11/2013. delivery 3 weeks later...

2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 24,261.3 miles.363 GIDAhr 80.66Hx95.95%kwh28.1QCs205,L2's 226
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

lorenfb
Posts: 1310
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:53 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Nov 2013
Leaf Number: 416635
Location: SoCal

Re: Lizard Pack Holding Up

Sun Mar 20, 2016 9:58 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:
lorenfb wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:you are not wrong and we need to understand that small tweaks to the chemistry is not limited to MY releases. It is an ongoing process which would imply that the later the car, the better the battery pack. Now all of this might even qualify as baby steps but the one thing that is sure is that Nissan is not done or even taking short breaks on their better battery quest.


Your battery capacity at 32K miles versus my 2013 (31.5K miles) at about the same delivery time (mine late 11/2013)
has almost an additional 10 Ahr of capacity (mine @ 53 Ahr). Although your production number is about 6K units
later, that's very strange!


oh... I suppose its not a good time to mention my ahr was 64.45 this morning?...



Must be some sort of sampling error, right? So you either have to bring your Leaf to SoCal or I need to
drive to WA so we can use the same diagnostic tools. Without that, who knows whether there's a real
difference. Seriously, you need to locate another Leaf owner in WA to corroborate your data!

Bottom Line: Your are one of the very very few that reports this great of a delta for your mileage.
Your battery in some cases has more capacity than a new 2015, which indicates a potential error
somewhere.

DaveinOlyWA
Gold Member
Posts: 12073
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Lizard Pack Holding Up

Sun Mar 20, 2016 10:06 am

lorenfb wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:
lorenfb wrote:
Your battery capacity at 32K miles versus my 2013 (31.5K miles) at about the same delivery time (mine late 11/2013)
has almost an additional 10 Ahr of capacity (mine @ 53 Ahr). Although your production number is about 6K units
later, that's very strange!


oh... I suppose its not a good time to mention my ahr was 64.45 this morning?...



Must be some sort of sampling error, right? So you either have to bring your Leaf to SoCal or I need to
drive to WA so we can use the same diagnostic tools. Without that, who knows whether there's a real
difference.

Bottom Line: Your are one of the very very few that reports this great of a delta for your mileage!
Your battery in some cases has more capacity than a new 2015, which indicates a potential error
somewhere.


actually I think its a question of unity and shared vision. My electricity is nearly all renewable and it simply recognizes the value of putting extra effort into powering a transportation system that uses renewable electricity. This is the reason (I choose to think) why my LEAF goes a long way on so little while some others do not... ;)

In reality; I have degradation. nowhere nears yours by any means but definitely more than recent readings suggest. But like all LEAFs, the battery stats swell with greater usage. It seems like the more I drive (I drove 193.7 miles on Friday) the higher the stats. If I were to guess what my "real" stats were, I would say its more around 61 ahr or.... halfway to losing my first bar.

obtw; I have over 34,000 miles...
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 24,261.3 miles.363 GIDAhr 80.66Hx95.95%kwh28.1QCs205,L2's 226
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

User avatar
turbo2ltr
Posts: 1376
Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 11:13 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Feb 2011
Leaf Number: 185
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Lizard Pack Holding Up

Sun Mar 20, 2016 11:58 am

Image
Image
Image

Guess it's down father than I thought, but still much better than the 2011.
Silver SL-e
Ford F450 Crew Cab Hybrid Conversion

DaveinOlyWA
Gold Member
Posts: 12073
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 10 Nov 2016
Leaf Number: 314199
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Lizard Pack Holding Up

Sun Mar 20, 2016 7:24 pm

lorenfb wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:
lorenfb wrote:
Your battery capacity at 32K miles versus my 2013 (31.5K miles) at about the same delivery time (mine late 11/2013)
has almost an additional 10 Ahr of capacity (mine @ 53 Ahr). Although your production number is about 6K units
later, that's very strange!


oh... I suppose its not a good time to mention my ahr was 64.45 this morning?...



Must be some sort of sampling error, right? So you either have to bring your Leaf to SoCal or I need to
drive to WA so we can use the same diagnostic tools. Without that, who knows whether there's a real
difference. Seriously, you need to locate another Leaf owner in WA to corroborate your data!

Bottom Line: Your are one of the very very few that reports this great of a delta for your mileage.
Your battery in some cases has more capacity than a new 2015, which indicates a potential error
somewhere.


I agree with you in the sense that Nissan instrumentation and its measurements should not be taken too seriously. Other than using them for reference points (at least they are consistent in their inaccuracies...) but either way your comments told me that a range test was in order. unfortunately, my area does not lend to much wide open driving especially on a Sunday and I did actually have things to do but I did post pix and as always there are a few different ways you can take the data

OHH, I'm halfway theeerrree! Living on a Prayer!

http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com/2016/03 ... range.html
2011 SL; 44,598 miles. 2013 S; 44,840 miles.2016 S30 (build 10/2016)"low water marks" 24,261.3 miles.363 GIDAhr 80.66Hx95.95%kwh28.1QCs205,L2's 226
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

dhanson865
Moderator
Posts: 1476
Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 7:12 am
Leaf Number: 16156
Location: Tennessee

Re: Lizard Pack Holding Up

Sun Mar 20, 2016 10:27 pm

turbo2ltr wrote:Guess it's down father than I thought, but still much better than the 2011.


Two things, when I get the time or another mod beats me to it we'll have to move these posts to the 2013 battery thread. Just don't want to confuse people about the "lizard pack" terminology and this is a lizard pack specific thread.

The other is your screenshots. seriously old leaf battery check app? I assume that is android? Why not upgrade to leafspy?
2012 Leaf tires 195/65/15 Dunlop Enasave 01 A/S, 15" Rims
wiki/index.php?title=Real_World_Battery_Capacity_Loss
(leaf range chart)
(efficiency 3.x KW vs 6.x KW)
please join Truedelta.com and input your repairs.

User avatar
turbo2ltr
Posts: 1376
Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 11:13 pm
Delivery Date: 04 Feb 2011
Leaf Number: 185
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: Lizard Pack Holding Up

Mon Mar 21, 2016 8:35 am

Yes, sorry, feel free to move my posts.

Because I haven't used it since that version. And the only reason I used it in the first place is because I left my USBCAN adapter at work so I couldn't use my own CANMon program. I'm kinda over tracking data. I just drive and enjoy it. It's a lease so as long as it satisfies my needs until the end of the lease, I'm happy. At this point, barring catastrophic pack failure, it should do that without an issue.
Silver SL-e
Ford F450 Crew Cab Hybrid Conversion

Evoforce
Posts: 637
Joined: Wed Mar 04, 2015 9:58 pm
Delivery Date: 28 Feb 2015
Location: Fountain Hills Arizona

Re: Lizard Pack Holding Up

Mon Mar 21, 2016 12:44 pm

turbo2ltr wrote:Yes, sorry, feel free to move my posts.

Because I haven't used it since that version. And the only reason I used it in the first place is because I left my USBCAN adapter at work so I couldn't use my own CANMon program. I'm kinda over tracking data. I just drive and enjoy it. It's a lease so as long as it satisfies my needs until the end of the lease, I'm happy. At this point, barring catastrophic pack failure, it should do that without an issue.


If you are having better results than normal for Arizona, We want to discover what you may be doing so we can duplicate it to help make our batteries last longer.
*2011 Leaf 1 bought 2/28/15 @ 28,000ish mi 10 bar (8 bars @ 11/25/15 @ 37,453 ) (New lizard @ 39,275 mi @ 1/20/2016) Now 52,166 mi.
*Tesla Model S 61,000 mi
*2011 Leaf 2 bought 4/28/15 @ 24,000ish mi 12 bar (new lizard Dec. 2014 @ 22,273 mi) Now 35,485 mi

golfcart
Posts: 111
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2016 6:08 am
Delivery Date: 21 Nov 2015
Location: Virginia Beach, VA

Re: Lizard Pack Holding Up

Mon May 02, 2016 5:05 am

Just to add a data point in a climate that is not Arizona, the PNW, or coastal California, I have a 2015S which I'm assuming has a lizard pack. Sorry if this is wordy but I want to try and be thorough. I bought it new just before Thanksgiving 2015. Judging from the manufacture date it had likely sat on the lot for 9+ months before I bought it. I am in the Virginia Beach/Norfolk VA area which is about 150 miles southeast of DC as the crow flies (for folks out west not familiar with the area). We have a similar climate to DC but slightly more moderate due to our proximity to the ocean. All indications from the dealer were that it sat in the sun, fully charged for that time in a non-covered spot on a blacktop parking lot. The daytime highs are above 80 degrees here pretty much June - September.

Image

When i purchased the car it had been testdriven about 10 times and had 22 miles on it. Leafspy told me the had 98% SOH and ~62ahr. Seemed reasonable compared to what I had read on the forum given that the car had sat for almost a year. Having now driven ~6500 miles, L2 charged about 200 times, and QC'd about 35 times in the last 5 months it now shows 100% SOH and ~63aHr.

I charge to 100% daily during work week using a timer to get super off-peak rates after a ~55 mile round trip commute, and usually do not need to charge on the weekend as we stay close to the house. I use the heat and AC when needed and I keep up with traffic on the interstate which means somewhere between 60 and 75 mph (most of it closer to 60) depending on traffic and if I get in the HOV. I do drive pretty smoothly, coasting a lot and using regen to do a lot of braking before a stop but I am not actively hypermiling or anything like that. My dash display says I average 4.2 miles/kWh.

I usually get home from work with 20% - 30% of my battery capacity remaining on the dash depending on HVAC use, how fast I drive, and ambient temperature. The rare times that I discharge the battery below 10% remaining, I usually get to about 80 miles on that charge. Miles / percentage used is definitely non-linear. I usually drive about 6 miles to go from 100% to 90% in the morning, but recently drove 26 miles (all interstate 55mph) to go from 29% to 5% when I pushed it a bit in order to get to a QC station and went over 90 miles on that charge despite mostly interstate driving.

I don't have gid numbers because I haven't purchased leafspy pro yet but based on SOH and real-world range at this point I am very happy with the battery performance of the car. It is as good, if not better, than expected. We'll see soon how the hot weather + daily use impacts it since it just sat on the lot all last summer this will be it's first summer of regular driving.
2015 S with Charge Package

ahagge
Posts: 292
Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2010 8:38 am
Delivery Date: 02 Jul 2011
Leaf Number: 5175
Location: Northridge, CA

Re: Lizard Pack Holding Up

Thu May 05, 2016 8:38 pm

ahagge wrote:Since the latest posts have been about 2011 Lizard Pack retrofits (and since I live literally blocks from TomT), I'll update my previous post. I have a 2011 SL-e with a Lizard Pack (-E variant), installed in April and surviving one San Fernando Valley summer thus far:

Image

BTW, here's the actual numbers (about 10,000 miles of driving):
  • GIDs went from 278 to 259
  • AHr went from 66.14 to 59.749
  • SOH went from 100% to 93%
  • Hx went from a high of 102.30 (about a week after the new battery was installed) to 89.47

So as you can see, this new Lizard battery has suffered a 10% capacity (AHr) loss in about 8 months. What's interesting is that as Tom said, the capacity drop is continuing even though colder weather is setting in. I'm not a happy camper... :x

Update: Updated graph showing correct SOH values


As I've now had my battery for just over a year, so here's another update:

Image

Comments:
With the colder weather of winter and spring, the battery has been holding pretty steady. I'm currently at about 258-260 GIDs, 60.25 AHr, 94% SOH and 90.4 Hx. We'll see what happens during the next 6 months...
Ocean Blue SL-e
Per LEAF Spy as of 03/16/17: 12 bars, 238 GIDs, 56.3 AHr on new (04/30/15) Lizard battery
Orig. battery lost 4th bar at 177 GIDs, 43.19 AHr, 44.74 Hx, 65% SOH after 45 months

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