Wholesale value of the 2013 Leaf @Auction-March '18

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The low auction prices have resulted in much lower residuals on 2015 leases -- so leases now cost more than they did two years ago. I bought my most recent one but only because of discounts and rebates were substantial and I plan to keep this Leaf, so resale is less an issue. I also got 0% financing for 72 months.
 
FWIW, I might be buying a '13 SV w/premium package but no QC + LED package (fine by me) that was off lease for $10,500 + tax and title. Need to decide today. The used car dealer just got it at auction and he showed me his invoice. It showed he paid ~$9200 (or exactly?) + $355 auction fee. It only has 12K miles on it! Looked like the car was registered in Santa Clara, CA. Was leased and maintained at a Santa Clara dealer .

Title looks clean w/no accidents from Carfax and Autocheck. Wasn't a branded or salvage title either. I plugged in my OBD2 dongle w/Leaf Spy and confirmed the VIN and mileage. Hx was 88%, IIRC. Car was built 5/2013. Mine that was built a month later has Hx ~89%, IIRC. Still had all 12 capacity bars.

Only downsides are the exterior wasn't that well cared for w/a bunch of scratches on the doors and also the corner of the front bumper. Also, there are somehow either scratches on the speedometer lens or some defect/problem on the inside (back) of the lens. If it were not something I looked at a lot... It's dark grey, not my favorite color but not as bad as black, which is a no for me. And, it's missing a key fob.

Used car dealer said he got 3 of them @ auction today (errr... Wednesday). Mentioned to me auctions are every 2 weeks on Wednesday and he picks up a few each time.

edit: Update. I passed on the above Leaf. I was afraid I'd regret the purchase and think that dealer might be able to get my one more to my liking for about the same price. I can get the speedometer lens cover replaced but since I don't really like the color, repainting it wouldn't be cheap and not something I'd do. And, I figure I'd have to shell out $300 to get another fob and get car programmed to recognize it.

I spoke to the user car lot guy about the auctions. He says usually each time, about 80 Leafs are up for auction. IIRC, about 15 of them should be '13 SVs (or was it '13 SVs w/o QC port?) He'll receive a list of cars next Friday, a few days before the auction itself on a Wednesday (7/15). He said I shouldn't expect these Leafs to be in much better condition and (obviously), it's hit or miss. He did claim that there are a # of out of state dealers coming to buy and that the prices of used Leafs at auction has actually been going up a bit (not sure how much I believe that).

On the invoice he showed me, it had the name Manheim. Just for kicks, I found https://www.manheim.com/. On their login page is "Access to Manheim.com is limited to licensed dealers only. For information on sales open to the public, please visit our Public Auctions sale listing." The latter unfortunately doesn't lead to anything I'd be interested in around me.

I also recall the Leaf he had still had a sticker/decal on the windshield that said something like "Nissan Infiniti Remarketing".
 
I wouldn't consider a leaf without QC. Sure you may not need it, but it's value is going to tank that much harder in the coming years because it doesn't have it. Don't know how long you intend to keep this one, but it is a small consideration.

I also like the LED headlights much more than the halogens, but that's more personal preference.
 
JeremyW said:
I wouldn't consider a leaf without QC. Sure you may not need it, but it's value is going to tank that much harder in the coming years because it doesn't have it. Don't know how long you intend to keep this one, but it is a small consideration.
Problem is one w/QC costs more and to me, it's not worth it. I've used my CHAdeMO inlet about ~16 times and none were really required. It was always on free stations, which there are few of left (and not many to begin with). Every paid CHAdeMO station here in Nor Cal is a ripoff. Almost all are Blink at $0.59/kwh or NRG eVgo (http://www.nrgevgo.com/san-francisco-bay-area/ w/crap billing, to boot).

CCGI is bleeding $ like crazy even at the exorbitant Blink fees so it seems there's really no $ to be made running a paid DC FC network. Thus, I'm not optimistic about the DC FC prices getting any better unless Nissan + other automakers decide to go to a free DC FCing model like w/Tesla Superchargers, which has obviously caused some other issues recently...

But yeah, the used car guy was also bit perplexed by why some people think they need it and thus are willing to (?)/want to pay more for it. Those people probably have no idea of the costs but "want" it, just in case.

In many cases, if the trip is far enough and there isn't reliable destination charging (which I'm going to be stopped at for hours), I'll be taking my ICEV. It's all about time, value, money for me.
 
evnow said:
My buyout price of 21k is a full 10k more than the auction price. Why do people still think financially it is better to buy than lease?
With a lease that has terms that favorable (I presume that the high buyout price meant a low lease payment) that is a reasonable question to ask. But there are a few cases where buying makes sense. For example, those who drive a lot and will greatly exceed the mileage limit. Or, perhaps, those who plan to keep the car for at least seven to ten years (although buying used would seem to be a better deal).

Some downsides to leasing, as opposed to "buying and holding": in states with value-based registration fees, one pays a lot more for newer cars than older ones. Same with insurance rates for collision/comprehensive. In my state the very generous state tax credit is much lower for leased cars than purchased ones, although that is something of an outlier case. An obvious advantage of leasing is that one can upgrade to the latest and greatest range and technology. (But what about those for whom the present LEAF is adequate for one's needs? They do exist.)

In general, I agree that for most people leasing makes more sense than buying new. But at this point I think buying used makes more sense than either leasing or buying new.
 
Can't compare used to buying new. It would almost always cost more to buy from Macy's than the local thrift store.
 
evnow said:
Can't compare used to buying new. It would almost always cost more to buy from Macy's than the local thrift store.
Of course you can. And the fact that it is usually cheaper is the whole point. The early adopters didn't have a used LEAF market to consider. Now that there is one it greatly increases options for driving electric at a reasonable cost.
 
cwerdna said:
JeremyW said:
I wouldn't consider a leaf without QC. Sure you may not need it, but it's value is going to tank that much harder in the coming years because it doesn't have it. Don't know how long you intend to keep this one, but it is a small consideration.
Problem is one w/QC costs more and to me, it's not worth it. I've used my CHAdeMO inlet about ~16 times and none were really required...
BTW, I finally got an answer from the used car dealer I've been working with on how much a '13 Leaf SV w/both premium and QC + LED package (like the one I'm leasing now) would be used. It'd probably be $1K to 1.5K more. No thanks.

It's not worth $1K to me, let alone $1.5K. I guess I'm taking a gamble, but I'm hoping that I don't see a delta greater than that when I try to sell later...
 
cwerdna said:
BTW, I finally got an answer from the used car dealer I've been working with on how much a '13 Leaf SV w/both premium and QC + LED package (like the one I'm leasing now) would be used. It'd probably be $1K to 1.5K more. No thanks.

It's not worth $1K to me, let alone $1.5K. I guess I'm taking a gamble, but I'm hoping that I don't see a delta greater than that when I try to sell later...
DCQC Port
LED Headlights
Auto On/Off Headlights
Fog Lights
Bose 7 Speaker Stereo
Around View Monitor

A lot of stuff for $1,000 to $1,500.
Had it been available on the 2011 I think 90% of people would have taken the two option packages.

But you have been using it for two years on a lease, so it is your judgement on whether you will miss the options or $1,500 more.

But in four years for me, DCQC has enabled at least ten to fifteen trips that would not have happened without it.

And if Nissan will step up and repair their defective DCQC units at dealers (nearly a hundred broken at dealers and dealers are pressuring Nissan to replace the defective design units) DCQC will be important the remaining time I own the car.
 
One has to wonder if the Nissan QC was designed by the same person who designed the first Leaf battery! :lol:

TimLee said:
And if Nissan will step up and repair their defective DCQC units at dealers (nearly a hundred broken at dealers and dealers are pressuring Nissan to replace the defective design units) DCQC will be important the remaining time I own the car.
 
TimLee said:
cwerdna said:
BTW, I finally got an answer from the used car dealer I've been working with on how much a '13 Leaf SV w/both premium and QC + LED package (like the one I'm leasing now) would be used. It'd probably be $1K to 1.5K more. No thanks.

It's not worth $1K to me, let alone $1.5K. I guess I'm taking a gamble, but I'm hoping that I don't see a delta greater than that when I try to sell later...
DCQC Port
LED Headlights
Auto On/Off Headlights
Fog Lights
Bose 7 Speaker Stereo
Around View Monitor

A lot of stuff for $1,000 to $1,500.
Had it been available on the 2011 I think 90% of people would have taken the two option packages.

But you have been using it for two years on a lease, so it is your judgement on whether you will miss the options or $1,500 more.
To be clear, the $1K to $1.5K delta was between a ’13 SV with premium vs. premium AND QC + LED. It was NOT the difference between a base SV vs. one w/both packages.

So, that $1K to $1.5K would buy
DCQC Port
LED Headlights
Auto On/Off Headlights
Fog Lights

I WANT the premium package (Bose stereo + AVM).

I can’t speak to the LED headlights, but the other things aren’t worth $1K to me, let alone $1.5K.

He was estimating that a ’13 SV w/both packages would cost me $11K to $11.5K.

He said he’d set the max price for a ’13 SV w/premium at $10K but would give it to me cheaper if he got it for less. He’s targeting a max profit for himself of $1K

If I read the email from the used car dealer correctly, he just picked up a ’13 SV w/premium at auction for $8325 including the $325 auction fee he had to pay, so the car should be $9325 for me (had just a little under 24K miles). I'm guessing I'll be checking it out within the next few days, possibly tonight. (I already had run checks with Carfax and Autocheck against this car.)
 
cwerdna said:
...
I can’t speak to the LED headlights ...
Thanks for the clarification.

You probably should do a night test drive of a LEAF without LED headlights.
I haven't driven one.

I consider the LED low beams very good.
But the halogen highbeams that have poor color and brightness due to the low voltage the LEAF operates at (barely 13V versus 14V the bulbs are designed for) to be poor.

Haven't read much commentary on the halogen low beams so they may be OK.
But best to test before buying.
 
^^^
I may not be able to, unless I maybe go to another dealer to test drive a Leaf w/only halogens.

Even if they were lousy, I’m loathe to pay between $1,675 to $2,175 more just to get LED headlights + the other stuff I don’t really need or want to pay for. LOTS of people only have the S (halogens only) and I bet plenty have a ’13+ SV w/o LED headlights.

FWIW, some people on MNL have complained about the LED headlights (go figure), which I think are fine.

If they're too crappy, I guess I’ll look into upgrading the headlights in some way.
 
To end my saga, I bought a used '13 Leaf SV w/premium package only. This one was blue (more to my liking) w/a black interior. The inside and out were in better shape than the dark grey one I passed on and there weren't scractches on the speedo. It had about 23.8K miles, almost double what the other one had.

It was a Bay Area car. When I ran Leaf Spy Pro on it, it has Ahr=60.15, SOH of 91% and Hx of 92.12%, which is actually a little better than my leased '13 SV. Car had build month of 05/2013, while my leased one was 06/2013.

3 of the tires are almost gone in terms of tread and some are showing uneven wear on the outer edges. Will be buying replacements soon.

Before he picked it up, he told me my max price would be $10K (normally his markup is $1K) but that if somehow it cost him more, he was willing to take less profit to sell to me at $10K as well as lower price if he got it for less. He (we) got real lucky and picked it up at a Manheim auction for $8000 + $325 auction fee. So, I got it for $9325 + tax and license.

Only bummer is the broken latch on the 120 volt L1 EVSE. Posted about it at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=18050&p=430823#p430823. At least it's under warranty though.

I how much the dark grey '13 Leaf SV w/low miles that I passed on (missing a key, scratches, some curb rash, speedometer lens scratch, etc. at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=429492#p429492) went for. The used car guy said $10.5K, as advertised. He claimed the buyer didn't really even care about the speedo or exterior scratches.

UGH! Site is SO SLOW tonight! :(
 
There seems to be a fairly large spread between SV and SL value. I'm not sure why this is the case, but it is. I'm hoping new auction values come up for both SL and SV so I can confirm it.

ebay price was, 2013 SL/premium with 10-20k miles are fetching 14k.
 
cwerdna said:
So, I got it for $9325 + tax and license.
Wow, that is a great deal on a low mileage '13 SV! It is so tempting to pick another one up for that price and relegate the Prius to long trips only. But I'd really prefer to not own 3 vehicles...
 
drees said:
cwerdna said:
So, I got it for $9325 + tax and license.
Wow, that is a great deal on a low mileage '13 SL! It is so tempting to pick another one up for that price and relegate the Prius to long trips only. But I'd really prefer to not own 3 vehicles...
Thanks! It was a '13 SV w/premium package, not SL.

It's not THAT low mileage... just a tad under 24K miles.

Low mileage was the '13 SV w/premium I passed on (http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=429492#p429492) w/only 12K miles! I guess they hardly drove it, for some reason. That sold for $10.5K, warts and all (some curb rash, some door scratches, dark grey color I didn't like, missing a key, scratches on the (eyebrow) speedometer lens, etc.)

Ideally, I'd have wanted a '13 SV w/premium w/silver exterior and black interior in comparable condition to mine but w/o worn out tires that I got replaced today.

Problem is, judging by the 21 '13 SVs he sent me before the auction, it's sometimes hard to get the color and package choice you want. If it has QC + LED package, it jacks up the price. I didn't to pay for that and I also passed on any w/light interior (due to it getting dirty easily). Some of the SVs had no package, which I didn't want either.

I could keep waiting and waiting, but it'd be a 2 week wait each time, and one could come thru w/other warts (e.g. missing a key, missing SD card, damage, capacity bar missing, etc.)
 
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