smkettner
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Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread

Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:27 pm

TonyWilliams wrote:Finally, Toyota is VERY open about how much they don't like BEVs. So, if you think you're helping Toyota in some way to get involved with BEVs, guess again. If they could stop the CARB-ZEV mandate in California, like happened in 2000-2003, this car would stop production IMMEDIATELY.

This is enough to discourage me from buying the Toyota :|
1 bar lost at 21,451 miles, 16 months.
2 bar lost at 35,339 miles, 25 months.
LEAF traded at 45,400 miles for a RAV4-EV
RAV4 traded in for I-Pace Dec 2018

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TonyWilliams
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Location: San Diego
Contact: Website

Re: Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread

Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:30 pm

Valdemar wrote:Is there a list of RAV4 EV certified dealers around SoCal?


http://www.toyota.com/rav4ev/#!/Welcome

SACRAMENTO

Folsom Lake Toyota 12747 Folsom Blvd. Folsom , CA 95630 (916) 355-1500

Hanlees Toyota 4202 Chiles Road Davis , CA 95616 (530) 753-3352

Roseville Toyota 700 Automall Drive Roseville , CA 95661 (916) 782-2163

Magnussen's Auburn Toyota 800 Nevada Street Auburn , CA 95603 (530) 885-8484



SAN FRANCISCO

Toyota Sunnyvale 898 W El Camino Real Sunnyvale , CA 94087 (408) 245-6640

Stevens Creek Toyota 4202 Stevens Creek Blvd. San Jose , CA 95129 (408) 984-1234

Piercey Toyota 950 Thompson Street Milpitas , CA 95035 (408) 240-1400

Magnussen's Toyota of Palo Alto 690 San Antonio Road Palo Alto , CA 94306 (650) 494-2100

Toyota of Berkeley 2400 Shattuck Avenue Berkeley , CA 94704 (510) 845-2530

Hanlees Hilltop Toyota 3255 Auto Plaza Richmond , CA 94806 (510) 243-2020

Toyota of Walnut Creek 2100 North Broadway Walnut Creek , CA 94596 (925) 933-7440

AutoNation Toyota Hayward 24773 Mission Blvd. Hayward , CA 94544 (510) 889-8000

Fremont Toyota 5851 Cushing Parkway Fremont , CA 94538 (510) 252-5100

One Toyota of Oakland 8181 Oakport Street Oakland , CA 94621 (510) 569-1111

San Francisco Toyota 3800 Geary Blvd San Francisco , CA 94118 (415) 750-8300

City Toyota 255 San Pedro Road Daly City , CA 94014 (650) 755-5500

Toyota 101 525 E. Bayshore Road Redwood City , CA 94063 (650) 365-5000

Toyota Marin 445 East Francisco Blvd. San Rafael , CA 94901 (415) 456-7071

Freeman Toyota 2875 Corby Avenue Santa Rosa , CA 95407 (707) 542-1791

CENTRAL CALIFORNIA

Toyota of Santa Maria 700 E. Betteravia Road Santa Maria , CA 93454 (805) 928-3881

Toyota San Luis Obispo 12350 Los Osos Valley Rd. San Luis Obispo , CA 93405 (805) 543-7001

Salinas Toyota 700 Auto Center Circle Salinas , CA 93907 (831) 444-0700

LOS ANGELES BASIN

Cabe Toyota 2895 Long Beach Blvd. Long Beach , CA 90806 (562) 595-7411

Penske Toyota 9136 E. Firestone Blvd Downey , CA 90241 (562) 861-3300

AutoNation Toyota Cerritos 18700 Studebaker Road Cerritos , CA 90703 (562) 860-6561

AutoNation Toyota Buena Park 6400 Beach Blvd. Buena Park , CA 90621 (714) 522-6144

DCH Toyota of Torrance 2909 Pacific Coast Hwy Torrance , CA 90505 (310) 325-7500

Toyota of Hollywood 6000 Hollywood Blvd. Los Angeles , CA 90028 (323) 275-9160

Toyota of Downtown L.A. 1600 S Figueroa Los Angeles , CA 90015 (213) 748-8301

Carson Toyota 1333 E 223rd St Carson , CA 90745 (310) 549-3131

Toyota Santa Monica 801 Santa Monica Blvd. Santa Monica , CA 90401 (866) 324-2046

Marina Del Rey Toyota 4636 Lincoln Boulevard Marina Del Rey , CA 90292 (866) 823-8348

Manhattan Beach Toyota 1500 N. Sepulveda Blvd Manhattan Beach , CA 90266 (310) 546-4848

Culver City Toyota 9077 Washington Blvd. Culver City , CA 90232 (310) 559-3777

Hamer Toyota 11069 Sepulveda Blvd Mission Hills , CA 91345 (818) 365-9621

Keyes Toyota 5855 Van Nuys Blvd Van Nuys , CA 91401 (818) 782-0122

Bob Smith Toyota 3333 Foothill Blvd. La Crescenta , CA 91214 (818) 248-9363

DCH Toyota of Simi Valley 2380 First Street Simi Valley , CA 93065 (805) 526-7500

Toyota of Glendale 1260 South Brand Blvd. Glendale , CA 91204 (323) 461-7228

Claremont Toyota 508 Auto Center Drive Claremont , CA 91711 (909) 625-1500

West Covina Toyota 1800 E Garvey Avenue West Covina , CA 91791 (626) 859-7400

Toyota of Glendora 1949 Auto Centre Drive Glendora , CA 91740 (909) 305-2000

Longo Toyota 3534 North Peck Road El Monte , CA 91731 (626) 580-6000

Wondries Toyota 1543 West Main Street Alhambra , CA 91801 (626) 289-8000

Toyota of The Desert 68105 Kyle Road Cathedral City , CA 92234 (760) 328-0871

John Elway's Crown Toyota 1201 Kettering Drive Ontario , CA 91761 (909) 390-9700

DCH Toyota of Oxnard 1631 Auto Center Drive Oxnard , CA 93030 (805) 988-7900

ORANGE COUNTY

Capistrano Toyota 33395 Camino Capistrano San Juan Capist.. , CA 92675 (949) 493-4100

South Coast Toyota 1966 Harbor Blvd. Costa Mesa , CA 92627 (949) 722-2000

AutoNation Toyota Irvine 9101 Research Drive Irvine , CA 92618 (949) 585-6888

Tustin Toyota 36 Auto Center Drive Tustin , CA 92782 (714) 832-3111

SAN DIEGO

Frank Toyota 2400 National City Blvd National City , CA 91950 (619) 474-5573

Toyota Carlsbad 5424 Paseo Del Norte Carlsbad , CA 92008 (760) 438-2000

Mossy Toyota 4555 Mission Bay Drive San Diego , CA 92109 (858) 581-4000

Toyota of El Cajon 965 Arnele Avenue El Cajon , CA 92020 (619) 270-3000

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z0ner
Posts: 497
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:16 am
Delivery Date: 18 Apr 2011
Leaf Number: 0909
Location: Orange County, CA

Re: Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread

Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:33 pm

smkettner wrote:
TonyWilliams wrote:Finally, Toyota is VERY open about how much they don't like BEVs. So, if you think you're helping Toyota in some way to get involved with BEVs, guess again. If they could stop the CARB-ZEV mandate in California, like happened in 2000-2003, this car would stop production IMMEDIATELY.

This is enough to discourage me from buying the Toyota :|


Toyota is definitely hostile towards its own product. Corporate is sometimes the only leverage we have with our LEAFs, and if that is gone (in Toyota's case), I'd expect the only thing left for resolution would be lawsuits. Sounds like a lot of fun.

cossie1600
Posts: 71
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Delivery Date: 03 Aug 2013
Leaf Number: 888888

Re: Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread

Tue Aug 27, 2013 12:22 am

As an owner of a Leaf and a RAV4, I can say this without bias. If you can afford it, buy the RAV4. It is SO MUCH better than the Leaf no matter how you look at it. I mean it does cost more money and uses more energy, but the car drives better, has more power, more usable space and way more options. I mean I don't mind getting into my S to get to and from work, but there is no way I want to drive the Leaf daily as it is not comfortable. Also the range on the Leaf is optimistic at best. You can beat the crap out of the RAV4 and it will deliver close to what it indicates. There is absolutely no comparsion, hands down RAV4 is a better car. At roughly $35K, it beats buying a SL with premium package for sure.

cwerdna
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Delivery Date: 28 Jul 2013
Location: SF Bay Area, CA

Re: Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread

Tue Aug 27, 2013 12:37 am

TonyWilliams wrote:For folks outside of California, and there are several with the Rav4 EV and one in Canada, it's more of a gamble. Just remember that the absolute WORST thing that will happen will be having to ship the car back to a certified Rav4 EV dealer, wherever that may be (yes, there are some outside California).

I would prepare for a full on war if Toyota made me do that, however. The overwhelming majority of issues should be able to be resolved at a local Plug-In Prius certified dealer.

Unfortunately, PiPs are only available in ~15 states or so... Per http://www.toyota.com/prius-plug-in/#!/Welcome
When and where will the Prius Plug-in be available?

The Prius Plug-in became available at participating dealers starting in March 2012 in 15 states : Arizona, California, Connecticut, Hawaii, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, Oregon, Rhode Island, Vermont, Virginia and Washington. Availability in additional states is currently under study. Visit the Toyota Hawaii site for more information on purchasing a Prius Plug-in in Hawaii.

Most of the above states are CARB emissions states.

'19 Bolt Premier
'13 Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

cwerdna
Posts: 9038
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Re: Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread

Tue Aug 27, 2013 12:44 am

cossie1600 wrote:As an owner of a Leaf and a RAV4, I can say this without bias. If you can afford it, buy the RAV4. It is SO MUCH better than the Leaf no matter how you look at it. I mean it does cost more money and uses more energy, but the car drives better, has more power, more usable space and way more options. I mean I don't mind getting into my S to get to and from work, but there is no way I want to drive the Leaf daily as it is not comfortable. Also the range on the Leaf is optimistic at best. You can beat the crap out of the RAV4 and it will deliver close to what it indicates. There is absolutely no comparsion, hands down RAV4 is a better car. At roughly $35K, it beats buying a SL with premium package for sure.

FWIW, Tony loved his Rav4 EV for the first few months or so, until he started having problems besides the noisy gearbox.

Reliability problems on a vehicle from Toyota Motor Corp. are pretty unusual. Unfortunately, judging by reports on myrav4ev.com, it seems like some of the probs Tony and others have experienced aren't that unusual (let's exclude the charging timer bugs) but it seems that the Tesla bits are largely to blame. And, the types of probs I've seen on teslamotorsclub.com on folks w/Model S doesn't exactly inspire confidence. Tesla simply doesn't have the experience and (very likely) the systems and processes in place yet that major automakers have like a Toyota and Honda that have been producing cars for many decades (Toyota since 1935 and Honda since 1963).

For me, I could easily afford to buy (even w/cash) or lease a Rav4 EV, but I have some unusual circumstances and Rav4 EV lease (even after the lease deal finally got better) was just much more than I wanted to pay. I also didn't want to buy (also related to my circumstance). It was also WAY more range than I needed for my commute (~12 miles each way). Also, the lack of CHAdeMO port really sours things.

I did contemplate leasing a Rav4 EV and thus ditching my Prius as I could drive to SF and back on a charge, but alas, no QC if I wanted to drive around SF a bit. And, the potential for downtime due to the types of reliability probs (some serious) that others have experienced made me think twice about having a Rav4 EV only and no ICEV.

The sketchy reliability (concerned it'll turn out to be a reliability turd) and slow (new) sales even w/incentives made me real concerned about future resale value, in the event I needed to sell.

Keep in mind, I am somewhat of a Toyota fan and definitely a Prius fan.

'19 Bolt Premier
'13 Leaf SV w/premium package (owned)
'13 Leaf SV w/QC + LED & premium packages (lease over, car returned)

Please don't PM me with Leaf questions. Just post in the topic that seems most appropriate.

cossie1600
Posts: 71
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2013 11:04 pm
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Re: Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread

Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:00 am

I leased both the Toyota and Nissan on the same month, let's see how they compare over the next three years as I am stuck with them regardless. As owner of a Prius and a 370z, I can tell you what is more reliable and what companies have more competent people working for them. Since I am leasing them, I am not really worried about it. As far as the residual, the Toyota is set at about $20K while the Leaf is at $14K. Given the 1st gen RAV4 is still a desirable item and there are way less of them, I can picture this car being the same thing. I do understand your point about the quick charge, but 90 realistic miles range is truly a lot easier to deal with than the 55 like the Leaf (drive it like a normal person at 80% charge). Like I said I understand your concern and I can see why it fits some people better, but there is no way you can say the Leaf is a better car with a straight face. The Toyota is way faster/way more comfortable and has a greater range.

The guy who designed the driver seat on the Leaf should be run over too, it is the most uncomfortable seat ever!!!

Keep in mind I still see the S model with QC and maybe SV being great value, but getting a SL premium over the RAV4 is laughable to me.

cwerdna wrote:
cossie1600 wrote:As an owner of a Leaf and a RAV4, I can say this without bias. If you can afford it, buy the RAV4. It is SO MUCH better than the Leaf no matter how you look at it. I mean it does cost more money and uses more energy, but the car drives better, has more power, more usable space and way more options. I mean I don't mind getting into my S to get to and from work, but there is no way I want to drive the Leaf daily as it is not comfortable. Also the range on the Leaf is optimistic at best. You can beat the crap out of the RAV4 and it will deliver close to what it indicates. There is absolutely no comparsion, hands down RAV4 is a better car. At roughly $35K, it beats buying a SL with premium package for sure.

FWIW, Tony loved his Rav4 EV for the first few months or so, until he started having problems besides the noisy gearbox.

Reliability problems on a vehicle from Toyota Motor Corp. are pretty unusual. Unfortunately, judging by reports on myrav4ev.com, it seems like some of the probs Tony and others have experienced aren't that unusual (let's exclude the charging timer bugs) but it seems that the Tesla bits are largely to blame. And, the types of probs I've seen on teslamotorsclub.com on folks w/Model S doesn't exactly inspire confidence. Tesla simply doesn't have the experience and (very likely) the systems and processes in place yet that major automakers have like a Toyota and Honda that have been producing cars for many decades (Toyota since 1935 and Honda since 1963).

For me, I could easily afford to buy (even w/cash) or lease a Rav4 EV, but I have some unusual circumstances and Rav4 EV lease (even after the lease deal finally got better) was just much more than I wanted to pay. I also didn't want to buy (also related to my circumstance). It was also WAY more range than I needed for my commute (~12 miles each way). Also, the lack of CHAdeMO port really sours things.

I did contemplate leasing a Rav4 EV and thus ditching my Prius as I could drive to SF and back on a charge, but alas, no QC if I wanted to drive around SF a bit. And, the potential for downtime due to the types of reliability probs (some serious) that others have experienced made me think twice about having a Rav4 EV only and no ICEV.

The sketchy reliability (concerned it'll turn out to be a reliability turd) and slow (new) sales even w/incentives made me real concerned about future resale value, in the event I needed to sell.

Keep in mind, I am somewhat of a Toyota fan and definitely a Prius fan.

Bicster
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Location: Houston, TX

Re: Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread

Tue Aug 27, 2013 12:21 pm

TonyWilliams wrote:Just remember that the absolute WORST thing that will happen will be having to ship the car back to a certified Rav4 EV dealer, wherever that may be (yes, there are some outside California).


I humbly disagree. You're not just shipping it to CA (or wherever), you're also shipping it back. So there's maybe $1,200-$1,800 for an out-of-state service visit. Now, how many times have you had to return a car to the service department for the same issue? I've had to do that many times with various cars. It could get quite expensive, and you're still paying for the car the whole time.

I'd consider shipping a RAV4EV to Houston, but only if I could get local service.
Reserved on April 20, 2010 - Never purchased

TomMoloughney
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Re: Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread

Tue Aug 27, 2013 1:06 pm

Bicster wrote:
TonyWilliams wrote:Just remember that the absolute WORST thing that will happen will be having to ship the car back to a certified Rav4 EV dealer, wherever that may be (yes, there are some outside California).


I humbly disagree. You're not just shipping it to CA (or wherever), you're also shipping it back. So there's maybe $1,200-$1,800 for an out-of-state service visit. Now, how many times have you had to return a car to the service department for the same issue? I've had to do that many times with various cars. It could get quite expensive, and you're still paying for the car the whole time.

I'd consider shipping a RAV4EV to Houston, but only if I could get local service.


That's my concern also or I probably would have gotten one already. I'm in Jersey, so it's a cross country shipping fee. Also, I have owned a few Toyota's already and the two dealers near me have horrendous service departments. My Tacoma had to go back three times for a simple problem so I can't imagine they would have any chance to fix a RAV4 EV, even if they agreed to try to.

lion
Posts: 557
Joined: Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:23 pm
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Re: Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread

Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:46 am

Same here, if my local dealer would be willing to support the car, I would have one as well.

You would think they would love the data from having these cars in all kinds of climates, but as Tony mentioned, Toyota must really hate battery vehicles. I'm hoping they will get desperate enough to move all 2600 vehicles that they will allow out of state sales/support (dreaming at this point, I know).

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