User avatar
lpickup
Posts: 1164
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 2:14 pm
Delivery Date: 09 Dec 2011
Leaf Number: 16138
Location: Raleigh, NC
Contact: Website

Re: range extender

Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:34 pm

N952JL wrote:During the last five months I've driven about 5,000 miles (3,200 electric &
1,800 gas) for a 64/36 electric/gas split. I feel this is just about normal
for most Americans. This clearly shows that while the Leaf will handle 98%
to 99% of my trips, it still handles less than 65% of my driving needs.

That's a great way to look at it. Yes, when the LEAF is not the appropriate vehicle and you have to resort to gas, you tend to drive more gas miles. I also agree with your statements below about the practical-ness of extended QC-ing (although I think your estimate of being able to go 70 miles @ 70mph might be a bit optimistic).

N952JL wrote:As a single person, this forces me to purchase a second car for the one to two
percent of my trips beyond the range of my electric leaf.

You lost me here though. But I also didn't see exactly how you measured a "trip".

If you measure a trip the same way the LEAF does. I.e. when I go to the bank, then get a coffee, then go to visit my sister, then come home, and then later in the day go to the store, then to dinner, then back home, the LEAF counts that as 7 trips.

If on the other hand you are counting the 98-99% the way I think about it (in terms of days), then the picture is a bit different. My own personal experience is that I've had to resort to the gas car 5 times in the past 5 months. That's about 1 out of every 30 or so days, or 3% of the time. In my opinion, that's probably still too often to rent a car to use on those occasions. But if you can get down to 1%, that's basically 4 times per year (using my day-based definition), which I think would put you in feasible range of renting a car. I don't see how you are FORCED to have a second car.

Let's work through some numbers though. For comparison purposes let's compare having a LEAF as your only car vs. having a 30mpg gas car as your only car (I think as a single person having 2 cars would be excessive for most people). I don't know your electricity cost or gas costs, so I'll use the national average of 11 cents/kWh and $3.90/gal for gas. I'll also assume 4 mi/kWh.

Counting your electric miles (6400/year), that would cost $176 in electricity vs. $832 in gas. You'd also need 2 oil changes in your gas car ($60). So the gas vehicle would cost $716/year more than the LEAF. The question is: can you afford to rent a gas car for those 4 times/year that you need it? That works out to $179/rental. Depending on whether your trips were 1 day or 1 week this may or may not work out for you. But since rentals are usually in the neighborhood of $40/day, it seems pretty feasible to me. Even for me at 12 trips per year, I'm still looking at it being cheaper to rent at $60/rental if most of my rentals were 1 day rentals.

Of course maybe you've already decided to count the fuel savings in the LEAF against the higher purchase price, or towards a replacement battery some day, or some other thing.
...Lance

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chenyj
Gold Member
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 12:29 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Jul 2012

Re: range extender

Sun Jul 22, 2012 1:33 pm

adric22 wrote:... Sure, you are still going to deplete the battery but it might add 15 or 20 miles of range. Then, when you park at your destination, it would keep running and recharging your batteries. After a few hours, you return to your car and you've gained 20 or 30 more miles of range. ...


Enginer has 4KWH and 8KWH range extenders for Leaf. They extend the range by 20 miles and 40 miles respectively.

4KWH Range Extender
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4KWH Range Extender
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4KWH Range Extender
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8KWH Range Extender
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8KWH Range Extender
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8KWH Range Extender
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Last edited by chenyj on Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
2004 Prius with Enginer 8KWH Kit
www.enginer.us

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DaveEV
Forum Supporter
Posts: 6232
Joined: Fri Apr 23, 2010 3:51 pm
Location: San Diego

Re: range extender

Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:36 am

chenyj wrote:Enginer has 4KWH and 8KWH range extenders for Leaf. They extend the range by 20 miles and 40 miles respectively.

Interesting - not up on your website yet - I presume pricing is the same as the PHEV kits? Any details on how it installs?

User avatar
TomT
Posts: 10639
Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 12:09 pm
Delivery Date: 01 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000360
Location: California, now Georgia
Contact: Website

Re: range extender

Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:54 am

Something is wrong with these numbers... If the 24Kwh pack in the Leaf is good for 73 EPA miles, and assuming that only 21 Kwh is actually usable, adding an additional 8Kwh (assuming all of it is usable, which may be a bit of a stretch) is only going to add about 27 miles, not 40... If more than 21Kwh is actually usable, the improvement will be even less. And this doesn't take in to account any range reduction caused by the added weight...

chenyj wrote:Enginer has 4KWH and 8KWH range extenders for Leaf. They extend the range by 20 miles and 40 miles respectively.
Last edited by TomT on Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
59,991 miles/12 bars/289 Gids/68.54 AHr/101% SOH/101.64% Hx 7May15 w/ new Lizard (barely made the warranty).
71,770 miles/12 bars/256 Gids/59.04 AHr/88% SOH/87.92% Hx 3Mar16 at 5 yr lease return.

Now driving a 2019 Tesla Model 3 LR FSD.

Herm
Posts: 3765
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 3:08 pm
Delivery Date: 29 Aug 2012
Location: Timbuktu, Mali

Re: range extender

Mon Jul 23, 2012 7:41 am

YMMV..

This is a solution for those with premature battery capacity fade.

chenyj
Gold Member
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 12:29 pm
Delivery Date: 22 Jul 2012

Re: range extender

Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:26 pm

TomT wrote:Something is wrong with these numbers... If the 24Kwh pack in the Leaf is good for 73 EPA miles, and assuming that only 21 Kwh is actually usable, adding an additional 8Kwh is only going to add about 27 miles, not 40... If more than 21Kwh is usable, the improvement will be even less.



We use the same way Nissan estimates "an estimated range of up to 100 miles[*] on a full charge." method. As everyone knows, the actual range mostly depends on driving speed. 21 usable Kwh / 100 miles = 210 wh / mile.
2004 Prius with Enginer 8KWH Kit
www.enginer.us

eHelmholtz
Posts: 355
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 10:28 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Aug 2011

Re: range extender

Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:56 pm

chenyj wrote:Enginer has 4KWH and 8KWH range extenders for Leaf. They extend the range by 20 miles and 40 miles respectively.

This is an interesting development - anymore details about instillation and cost?

kennyboy
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:34 pm
Delivery Date: 18 Oct 2011
Leaf Number: 8714
Location: Johnson City, TN

Re: range extender

Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:10 am

I want this.

If the 8kWh version was available for a price comparable to their PHEV 8kWh pack, I would have it installed tomorrow.

User avatar
mwalsh
Posts: 9623
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 10:10 am
Delivery Date: 05 Jan 2011
Leaf Number: 0213
Location: Garden Grove, CA

Re: range extender

Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:25 am

chenyj wrote:Enginer has 4KWH and 8KWH range extenders for Leaf. They extend the range by 20 miles and 40 miles respectively.


Nice!
2011 Blue Ocean SL with 80,000 miles
2015 pack on 12/30/15
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Bridgestone Ecopia 422+ tires
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DoxyLover
Posts: 517
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 9:52 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Oct 2011
Leaf Number: 9214
Location: San Jose, CA

Re: range extender

Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:19 pm

kennyboy wrote:I want this.

If the 8kWh version was available for a price comparable to their PHEV 8kWh pack, I would have it installed tomorrow.

Please, more details!
2011 Brilliant Silver Leaf SL
Reserved, quoted and ordered July 11, 2011
Delivered October 16, 2011 (Na. Plug-In Day)

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