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LEAFer
Posts: 2647
Joined: Mon May 24, 2010 10:10 am
Delivery Date: 19 Jan 2011
Leaf Number: 000215
Location: Sacramento Area

Re: Sacramento area?

Mon Jun 07, 2010 8:57 pm

Potential Energy = mass * g * height.

So, for example, for a 1,000 foot climb in a 3,500 lbs LEAF (estimate; incl. 1 driver),

PE used = (3,500*0.454) [kg] * 9.8 [m/s/s] * 304.8 [m] ==> [kg*m*m/s/s] =[Joules]

1 Joule = 1 Watt * Second

PE = 1,589 * 9.8 * 304.8 = 4,746,407 [Joules] ==> 4,746,407 / 3.600 [Wh] = 1.3 kWh.

So ... IN ADDITION to whatever driving distance you complete (as if you are on flat ground, for example 250Wh/mile), you also spend 1.3 kWh to climb 1,000 feet. If the regen is totally efficient (and the LEAF's charger let's you) you can gain all of that potential energy back on the downhill. (The level of incline on the rise does not matter so long as the car can handle it. On the descent it depends on the firmware allowing regen or coasting if you can. If you need to use the friction brakes you're wasting the Potential Energy.)

Hope this helps :)
2011 Silver SL+QC [Mfg: 11/2010] 36mo/15k LEASE
06Jun2013 Status [28.5 months][34,173 miles][11 bars]
Lost CapacityBar 6/6/13 @34,173 miles while in LEAF Battery Monitor: 83.41%, 71.4F (avg); cool overnight;

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evnow
Moderator
Posts: 11447
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 11:41 am
Delivery Date: 25 Feb 2011
Leaf Number: 303
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: Sacramento area?

Mon Jun 07, 2010 9:04 pm

LEAFer wrote:PE = 1,589 * 9.8 * 304.8 = 4,746,407 [Joules] ==> 4,746,407 / 3.600 [Wh] = 1.3 kWh.


Nice. My normal driving distance is 5.5 miles - and a difference of about 1000 feet. Looks like the altitude doubles my energy consumption on the way up :lol:
1st Leaf : 2/28/2011 to 5/6/2013
2nd Leaf : 5/4/2013 to 3/21/2017
Volt : 3/25/2017 to 5/25/2018
Model 3 : 5/10/2018 to ?

Bicster
Posts: 579
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:18 am
Delivery Date: 26 Jun 2015
Location: Houston, TX

Re: Sacramento area?

Tue Jun 08, 2010 7:35 am

I can tell you that the instantaneous fuel consumption gauge on my ICE car reflects about 2X fuel consumption while climbing hills, and about 1/2 on the way back down.

Of course the only hills around here are man-made: overpasses, underpasses, freeway ramps, bridges...
Reserved on April 20, 2010 - Never purchased

GeorgeParrott
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2010 5:18 pm

Re: Sacramento area?

Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:12 am

Sacramento area buyers can contact the following dealer only slightly out of area for a MUCH BETTER selling price than ANY of our more convenient local Nissan outlets. I gave up on our local dealers after trying to get any of them to discount MSRP for the Leaf. Heck, the selling dealer has NO COSTS in this sale since all the cars are assigned by us to the delivering dealer. Every LEAF sale is above the dealer's allocation of new vehicles, so every one is "clear profit" above some minimal handling costs for writing the order and final prep on the car. I offered every local dealer the proposal to "split the difference between MSRP and their Invoice cost" and NONE accepted that. However the CHICO NISSAN dealer responded....

Hello there! Thanks for getting in touch with us about the Leaf. I wanted to E-mail you and let you know that splitting the INV and MSRP will not be a problem on your purchase. Feel free to let anyone you know who is interested know that I will gladly honor this deal for them as well.

Feel free to contact me direct, or my EV Leader Ron Ricci, or our EV Specialist Antonio Leon if you have any questions.

Thx Again for the oppertunity Mr Parrott


Ryan Sutton
General Sales Manager
Chico Nissan-Hyundai
(530)891-1777 Ph.
(530)891-4060 Fx

George Parrott in W. Sacramento with an August order time for a RED Leaf with the option package

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Visual
Posts: 71
Joined: Wed May 05, 2010 3:26 pm
Delivery Date: 26 Jun 2015
Location: El Dorado Hills

Re: Sacramento area?

Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:48 am

Thanks for this post - its great to find a dealer who's willing to be reasonable, though I guess times have been so tough for them they're having a hard time letting go of the margins on cars that ARE selling...
Cayenne Red Leaf - Schneider EVSE
Sacto area.

desiboysf
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 10:51 am

Re: Sacramento area?

Tue Aug 17, 2010 10:54 am

What is the invoice price for the Leaf? I have not been able to find for either trim level.

GeorgeParrott
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2010 5:18 pm

Re: Sacramento area?

Tue Aug 17, 2010 12:17 pm

As of today (Aug.17) there is still not public or dealer understanding of the "invoice price" of the Leaf. Giving a selling dealer "fair profit" for services demands that some $$ above invoice be charged. Splitting that difference seemed reasonable to me and to Chico Nissan. "Theory" suggests that the invoice price is probably $1200-2200 LESS than MSRP, given typical differentials at the MSRP range of $34,000. I am sure we are all eager to have actual "invoice" and since there was a big recent dealer's meeting, MAYBE that information will become public soon?

George

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evnow
Moderator
Posts: 11447
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 11:41 am
Delivery Date: 25 Feb 2011
Leaf Number: 303
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: Sacramento area?

Tue Aug 17, 2010 1:02 pm

GeorgeParrott wrote:Giving a selling dealer "fair profit" for services demands that some $$ above invoice be charged.


What about holdback ? Given that there is no inventory cost - that is more than enough. We, the customers, have done all the hard work - we have researched everything, figured out all the details. Dealers don't need to spend any time "selling" the car.

Any profit on Leaf a dealer makes is essentially subsidizing that gas guzzler sitting on the lot.
1st Leaf : 2/28/2011 to 5/6/2013
2nd Leaf : 5/4/2013 to 3/21/2017
Volt : 3/25/2017 to 5/25/2018
Model 3 : 5/10/2018 to ?

desiboysf
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 10:51 am

Re: Sacramento area?

Tue Aug 17, 2010 2:21 pm

I read that the dealer willing the split the profit was discounting the car by $1600 or so. That leads me to believe that the invoice is probably somewhere around $31K.

GeorgeParrott
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2010 5:18 pm

Re: Sacramento area?

Wed Aug 18, 2010 10:06 pm

For those of us in the Sacramento area....there is one silver Nissan Leaf being regularly used by the California Fuel Cell Partnership based off Industrial Blvd. in W. Sacramento. I have seen it driving around downtown and TODAY (18 Aug.) saw it parked in front of the CFCP headquarters. I talked at some length with one of the Nissan engineers who are field testing both the Leaf and other fuel cell technologies here.

Anyway, if you want to check out one, I cannot guarantee it will always be parked there, but it often is....during office work hours. Apparently it is on some kind of employee rotation for who gets to drive it for a week at a time. Heck, it even had a kiddie car seat in the back today.

George Parrott
W. Sacramento

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