L2 portable generator charging

Portable charging at L2. After getting stuck and towed 300 yards to my friends house decided I needed a portable emergency charge solution on board the car, sort of a spare tire which is another project. Looking for portable generators at 240 volt the list gets short here in America. Found one, a Pramac S2800 http://www.zoro.com/pramac-portable-generator-rated-watts2400-160cc-s2800/i/G8491594/?utm_source=google_shopping&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=Google_Shopping_Feed&KW3&gclid=CJmWyN-13cUCFQ8waQod5pwAhg&gclsrc=aw.ds" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Desc:
Portable Generator, Rated Watts 2400, 160cc
by PRAMAC
Technical Specifications
Zoro #: G8491594 | Mfr #: S2800
Fuel Tank Capacity: 0.45 gal. Fuel Type: Gasoline
Run Time Hour Meter: No Cylinder Material: Cast Iron
Engine Alternator: Mecc alte Outlets: (1) 120V 5-20R
Voltage: 120 Engine Size: 160cc
Standards: EPA Height: 16-5/8"
Warranty: 3 Month Commercial Use Sound Level dB: 74
Run Time @ Full Load: 2 hr./Tank Run Time @ 1/2 Load: 2.6 hr./Tank
Circuit Breaker: Yes Width: 14-3/8"
Engine Brand: Subaru Engine HP: 6
Length: 21-3/4" Full Power Switch: No
Low Oil Shut Down: Yes Surge Watts: 2800
Rated Watts: 2400 Starter Type: Recoil
Amps @ 120/240V: 20/10 amps
Air Cleaner Type: Paper
Item: Portable Generator Zoro Number: G8491594
Mfr Number: S2800
Product Description
Portable Generator, Rated Watts 2400, Surge Watts 2800, Engine Brand Subaru, Voltage 120, 20/10 Amps @ 120/240V, Circuit Breaker Yes, Engine Size 160cc, Engine Alternator Mecc Alte, 2 hr./Tank Run Time @ Full Load, 2.6 hr./Tank Run Time @ 1/2 Load, Sound Level dB 74, Engine HP 6, 0.45 gal. Fuel Tank Capacity, Recoil Starter Type, Air Cleaner Type Paper, Low Oil Shut Down Yes, Length 21-3/4 In., Width 14-3/8 In., Height 16-5/8 In., Full Power Switch No, Gasoline Fuel Type, Outlets (1) 120V 5-20R
Some modifications were needed for my application, Unit arrives set up tor 120 volt only with both coil outputs tied together on a 1 pole 20A circuit breaker. Removed the 20 amp circuit breaker and separated the generator coil outputs then rewired for 240 volt output. (see Mecc Alte diagram)
Picked up a double pole circuit breaker: http://www.ebay.com/itm/201185736018?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Then added a right angle cable clamp from the hardware store to the back cover with a L14-20 female plug and some cable.
http://stevon.myevblog.com/wp-admin/upload.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
My calculations of load being 8 amps@ 240 volt + 1920 watts total. purchased a portable EVSE charging station kit [http://store.openevse.com/products/openevse-30a-standard-charge-station-combo
(clear cover my modification)
It accepts any input voltage from 100 to 250 volts, switches upon detecting voltage and communicates via the SAE J1772-2001 standard protocol through the J177 cable. EVSE charger sets voltage and available amps on the vehicle's onboard charger. plugged in open EVSE charger, connected generator, set dashboard current to 8 amps for a test, started generator and let her rip!
N.G. Problem, generator voltage dropped to 200 volts and car disconnected EVSE. Gen sped back up, voltage returned to 248, car re-engaged charge, then 1 minute later, same scenario ~ loop! WTF! Looked into non-linear loads and harmonic distortion as the possible problem and solutions for it. Bad power factor? Harmonic Distortion?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_factor" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and a possible solution https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=worppwXhezI" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPFKcUxbNuQ" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; . In order to solve this problem I needed precise information to make calculations and to arrive at precise values to purchase parts and design a solution. What was needed was a power analyzer like a Fluke 43B meter. At $1600 dollars a little pricey for one project. Decided on a used meter found in Bakersfield CA. for $300, He wanted cash only, face to face, living in San Diego 400 miles + away, that was impractical. Talked him into a postal money order and it arrived last Friday. As a test made a "bread board" for easier measurements See picture

hooked up meter, connected the car to house current then started a charge session with dashboard current set to 8 amps. Load seemed quite linear at 240 volts, 0.99 Power Factor with 12 percent THD. A puzzle, why did the generator overload? Second test, connected car, generator and openESVE charger, set dashboard current to 8 amps for the test, started generator and it loaded down again! meter read 14 amps @ 240v or 3360 watts! No wonder 2800 max watt generator bogged down. the open EVSE charge station allows you to program amps so I reset station from default 16a to 10a @ 240v and the car charged OK (no stalling) on the generator @ L2 2.4 kwatts. PF is 0.98 @ 12percent THD! SUCCESS :mrgreen: Next concern was that if involved in an accident Gen would cruise through the cabin if it was not secured. Chose vinyl coated 1/4 inch aircraft cable and a lock to secure generator to the car with an antitheft side benefit as well. Generator stock cradle had to be modified with some steel and welding.

Total cost in parts was less than $700.00 US

187 posts about charging from a generator here:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=5792" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

52 posts here:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=4047" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It can be done.
My 45 Kw Onan generator charges just fine, but it's installed INTO the house EL system, grounded common to my EVSE.

Good Luck

KillaWhat,

I have a Spark EV and this is a truly PORTABLE 240 volt L2 solution. At 70 lbs generator pushing 2.4Kw at 240 volts is more than enough for emergencies, car only takes 3.3Kw max anyways. I got stuck 300 yards from my friend's house, but it was up hill. Car just shut down, no warning or beeping or "limp" mode. Had to roll down hill backwards to move to the side of the road! Power brakes and steering still operated with power. An average woman or 12 year old kid can open the hatch and pull out this 70 lb genset. It would be quite the struggle for them but possible. It is only needed as a backup for emergencies, sort of like a spare tire (wish I had one of those) another project for another day.

Stephen

Deleted.

stevon said:

KillaWhat,

I have a Spark EV and this is a truly PORTABLE 240 volt L2 solution...

Stephen

Click to expand...

I don't think Leaf Spy will be of much help here. :mrgreen:

stevon said:

A puzzle, why the generator overload?. Connect car, generator and
penESVE charger, set dashboard current to 8 amps for the test, started generator and it loaded down again! meter read 14 amps @ 240v or 3360 watts! No wonder 2800 watt Max generator bogged down. the open EVSE charge allows you to program amps so I reset it to 10a @ 240v and car charged OK on the generator @ L2 2.4 kwatts.

Click to expand...

On the spark the 8 amp dash setting is only for L1/120V. On L2 it'll go by whatever the pilot from the EVSE is set to, up to 16 amps.

Also please consider cleaning up the punctuation and formatting on your post. It's very hard to read.

stevon said:

Portable charging at L2.
After getting stuck and towed 300 yards to my friends house decided I needed a portable emergency charge solution on board the car, sort of a spare which is another project. Looking for portable generators at 240 volt the list gets short here in America. Found one, a Pramac S2800 http://www.zoro.com/pramac-portable-generator-rated-watts2400-160cc-s2800/i/G8491594/utm_source=google_shopping&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=Google_Shop" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
ping_Feed&KW3&gclid=CJmWyN-13cUCFQ8waQod5pwAhg&gclsrc=aw.ds
Desc:
Portable Generator, Rated Watts2400, 160cc by PRAMAC
Technical Specifications
Zoro #: G8491594 | Mfr #: S2800
Fuel Tank Capacity: 0.45 gal. Fuel Type: Gasoline
Run Time Hour Meter: No Cylinder Material: Cast Iron
Engine Alternator: Mecc alte Outlets: (1) 120V 5-20R
Voltage: 120 Engine Size: 160cc
Standards: EPA Height: 16-5/8"
Warranty: 3 Month Commercial Use Sound Level dB: 74
Run Time @ Full Load: 2 hr./Tank Run Time @ 1/2 Load: 2.6 hr./Tank
Circuit Breaker: Yes Width: 14-3/8"
Engine Brand: Subaru Engine HP: 6
Length: 21-3/4" Full Power Switch: No
Low Oil Shut Down: Yes Surge Watts: 2800
Rated Watts: 2400 Starter Type: Recoil
Amps @ 120/240V: 20/10 Air Cleaner Type: Paper
Item: Portable Generator Zoro Number: G8491594
Mfr Number: S2800
Product Description
Portable Generator, Rated Watts 2400, Surge Watts 2800, Engine Brand
Subaru, Voltage 120, 20/10 Amps @ 120/240V, Circuit Breaker Yes,
Engine Size 160cc, Engine Alternator Mecc Alte, 2 hr./Tank Run Time @
Full Load, 2.6 hr./Tank Run Time @ 1/2 Load, Sound Level dB 74, Engine
HP 6, 0.45 gal. Fuel Tank Capacity, Recoil Starter Type, Air Cleaner
Type Paper, Low Oil Shut Down Yes, Length 21-3/4 In., Width 14-3/8
In., Height 16-5/8 In., Full Power Switch No, Gasoline Fuel Type,
Outlets (1) 120V 5-20R
Some modifications were needed for my application, Unit arrives set up or 120 volt with both coil outputs tied together on a one pole 20A
circuit breaker. Seperated coil outputs and purchesed a dual pole circuit breaker: http://www.ebay.com/itm/AIRPAX-CIRCUIT-BREAKER-B21-4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
-4-00A-02-31-V-NSN-5925-01-263-5966-28812-000/191319438119?_trksid=p2047675.c100011.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo
%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D29005%26meid%3D80ea7f4277144bb3b013c1aab477e6a5%26pid%3D100011%26rk%3D2%26rkt
%3D2%26sd%3D201053211248
Added a right angle cable clamp from the hardware store to the back
cover and a L14-20 female plug with cable.

My calculations of load being 8 amps@ 240 volt + 1920 watts total. purchased a portable EVSE charging station kit http://store.openevse.com/products/openevse-30a-standard-charge-station-combo" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; It accepts any input voltage from 100 to 250 volts, switches upon detecting voltage and communicates via the SAE J1772-2001 standard protocol through the J177 cable. To the car setting voltage and available amps on the vehicles onboard charger. plugged in open EVSE charger, connected generator, set dashboard current to 8 amps for the test, started gen and let her rip! N.G. Problem, generator voltage dropped to 200 volts and car charger disconnected EVSE combo. Generator then sped back up, voltage returned to 248, car re-engaged charge, then a minute later, same scenario ~ loop! WTF! Looked into non-linear loads as the possible problem and solutions for it. Bad power factor? Harmonic Distortion?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_factor and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPFKcUxbNuQ" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; . In order to solve this problem I needed precise information to make calculations and to arrive at precise values to purchase parts and design a solution. What
was needed was a power analyzer like a Fluke 43B meter. At $1600 dollars a little pricey for one project. Decided on a used meter found
in Bakersfield CA. He wanted cash only, face to face, living in San Diego 400 miles + away, that was impractical. Talked him into a postal
money order and it arrived last Friday. As a test made a "bread board" hooked up meter, connected car to house current and started a charge
session. Load seemed quite linear at 0.99 Power Factor with 12 percent THD. A puzzle, why the generator overload?. Connect car, generator and
openESVE charger, set dashboard current to 8 amps for the test, started generator and it loaded down again! meter read 14 amps @ 240v or 3360 watts! No wonder 2800 watt Max generator bogged down. the open EVSE charger allows you to program amps so I reset it to 10a @ 240v and
the car charged OK (no bogging or disconnect) on the generator @ L2 2.4 kwatts. PF is 0.98 @ 12 percent THD. Next concern was that if involved in an accident Generator
would cruize through the cabin if it was not secured. Decided on using vinyl coated 1/4 inch aircraft cable and a lock to secure generator to the car with an anti theft side effect as well. Generator cradle had to modified with some steel and some welding.
Cheers!
Stephen

Click to expand...

Some one on another forum suggested keeping a UPS power supply in the back as a safer/cleaner (no fumes) solution. To be honest that never occurred to me.

I have stated this in the past, but it could be useful here for those newer to EV driving. I have a gas generator in the garage for emergency power but have never used it and would NEVER use it to charge the EV. I would rather use the EV to supply emergency power to the house than the other way around.

1. Know the limits of your EV, drive it down to stoping a few times to know how to push it to it's limits. Then you are less likely to be caught short.

2. There are VERY few places in this country where you will be without Line power that you can plug into. If you are driving into one of those places make sure you have enough energy to get through them.

3. If you are worried about reaching your next charging station, it is easier, cheaper, and lighter to just carry a couple of 100' heavy duty extension cords rather than buying and transporting a gas generator (also the gas fumes in the car do not help). Find somewhere to stop, ask the owner of the property if you can buy $1.00 worth of electricity from him so you can make it to your next charging station. If you ask nicely I can not think of anyone who would turn you down. This should get you another 5 miles or so with a one-hour charge. If you have 240v ability, then it would only take 12-minutes.

4. Very few generators are built for long-term continuous use, and those are VERY expensive. The one that most of us have are kind of like the donut spare tires, there for emergency use for a short time.

5. The cost of just the gas to run the generator for an hour is much greater than the $1.00 the electricity cost. Plus the depreciation of the generator for each hour of use.

6. If you have the ability to have someone tow you a short distance or coast down hill, the regen can put as much as 30kwh back into the battery. Again, much faster than a generator or L2 charging. I think I remember seeing a youtube video of someone recharging their battery by being pulled down the road. The front tow ring is in my glove box along with all the books that came with the car. And it is easy to use. Shift the car in forward, B-Eco and you are good to go.

Graffi makes some excellent points.

I'm not going to comment on regen getting 30kwh into the battery by towing, but otherwise, this is really great information.

In addition, many of us own the Leaf because we care about the environment. Small generators are awful for pollution.

From: http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/how-bad-for-the-environment-are-gas-powered-leaf-blowers/2013/09/16/8eed7b9a-18bb-11e3-a628-7e6dde8f889d_story.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
A 2011 test by the car experts at Edmunds showed that “a consumer-grade leaf blower emits more pollutants than a 6,200-pound 2011 Ford F-150 SVT Raptor.”

Bob

stevon said:

An average woman or 12 year old kid can open the hatch and pull out this 70 lb genset.

Click to expand...

Ummm I have to say NOOO :lol:

The avg person (aka MAN) is not going to lift a bag and a half of cement UP AND OVER the back of a car...

Most people people complain about the HANDI 3000i or even the 3000euI which is Honda's nearest competitor.

No way in HELL a kid is going pick this up. :roll:

P.S. And i'm one of the few who have both made a custom gen box for the Rav AND the Leaf that is sound deaden for the 1000i and the 3000 and I know the weights.. and have both gensets :roll:

Bob said:

Small generators are awful for pollution.

Click to expand...

Yes, as are 2 stroke motorcycles, etc.

Isn't carrying a gasoline filled can around in the back of the LEAF introducing a new hazard? Plus I can no longer stand the smell of gasoline. Fresh or combusted. Maybe I am re-sensitized?

I do carry a 100 feet of 12 gauge extension cords, along with a couple of 240V adaptors, some trico clip ons, when going in odd territory (which I have never had to use).

I find the execution clever and perhaps necessary for some, but not for me... Never.

When your lease is up get a Volt.

Thanks everyone for the info, but project is already completed See http://www.mychevysparkev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=4149" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I don't smell any gas yet, maybe on a hot day, I'm keeping back windows cracked open a bit. There is no gas can in the car, top off gen at gas station when needed. Do have a 12 Ga, 30 foot extension and multiple 120 and 240 plug adapters for the openEVSE combo charge kit I built.
The openEVSE combo takes 100 to 250 volts input and has a LCD display with a button for making changes in current level. A propane adapter could be another option for those offended by gas. After all this was designed as an emergency solution to begin with, not a range extender. Out here in SO Cal, it is very spread out, even miles between civilization. When Spark EV is dead, it's dead (only pushable or towable at that point). This option and piece of mind is worth more than the $700 dollars spent, at least to me Have achieved an acceptable solution for the owner (Me). Someone suggested buying a UPS and keeping it in the car, found one :mrgreen: A big ass 240 volt UPS would be the same weight as generator with no smell of gas! less capable range extending of course http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005SQI67U/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
It has built in inverter and self charger too!

Max Configurable Power 2700 Watts / 3000 VA Buy used for around $800 bucks with shipping

JimSouCal said:

Bob said:

Small generators are awful for pollution.

Click to expand...

Yes, as are 2 stroke motorcycles, etc.

Isn't carrying a gasoline filled can around in the back of the LEAF introducing a new hazard? Plus I can no longer stand the smell of gasoline. Fresh or combusted. Maybe I am re-sensitized?

I do carry a 100 feet of 12 gauge extension cords, along with a couple of 240V adaptors, some trico clip ons, when going in odd territory (which I have never had to use).

I find the execution clever and perhaps necessary for some, but not for me... Never.

Click to expand...

Out here in SO Cal, it is very spread out, even miles between civilization.

Click to expand...

Ah yes, the Wilds Of SoCal. Sometimes actual miles between houses, and the white wine is barely drinkable. I shudder at the very thought. ;-)

How about a portable solar generator? I'm not sure how this would or wouldn't work (at night for example) or even if it would fit in hatch area

http://www.wayfair.com/Wagan-E-Power-Cube-1500-Collapsible-Solar-Power-Panel-" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Array-with-Inverter-EL2546-WXY1028.html
These must be NASA grade solar cells! (the kind that converts 3 different wavelengths of light at the same time)
http://cleantechnica.com/2014/12/03/new-solar-cell-efficiency-record-set-46/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Quote "Such solar cells are complicated and are not used in residential or commercial applications… because they are incredibly expensive. They are used in space applications by the likes of NASA, where a bit of extra space (or, as it may be, less space via extra efficiency) can make a huge difference."
This product seems to be more of a dreamer's wish gimmick than a practical solution. Snake oil comes in all forms these days..........
Suppose anything is possible!

Overall Product Weight: 88lbs
Overall: 21.2" H x 15.5" W x 20.5" D

Dana453 said:

Hey friend! I strongly recommend you using honda generator eu3000is for this purpose. I am also using honda generator for years and it is working smoothly. It provides really great power backup.

Click to expand...

Hey "friend"... hope you enjoyed your single post on this forum.

Good luck making future posts.

Post deleted and user banned.

Dana453 said:

Hey friend! I strongly recommend you using honda generator eu3000is for this purpose. I am also using honda generator for years and it is working smoothly. It provides really great power backup.

Click to expand...

Dana453,

The eu3000is at 144.0 lbs is too heavy and it is too physically large to fit in hatch area without loosing back seating. The hatch area cover shelf when closed, conceals generator and cables being neat and also a theft deterrent.

You have put lots of thinking and time into this solution. I am wondering why it has to be level2. If you are planning for an emergency, why not have a smaller, cheaper, simpler, lighter choice that you are dragging around every day and will maybe use once a year at most?
Why not keep a cheap spare 110 volt charge cable and a simple harbor freight generator.
I like this one:
http://www.harborfreight.com/2500-peak2200-running-watts-47-hp-125cc-portable-inverter-generator-61171.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Probably it would produce cleaner power as well. No need it blowing up your onboard charger with some poor power output from a basic generator. You'd take longer to charge, but at 4 miles of charge per hour, unless you are really out in the sticks, running the gen for an hour will get you where you need to be. This is also arguably more quiet than your generator solution.

Thanks for sharing your solution, these are just my thoughts.

Chuck101,
Thanks for your input.
Wanted to "do it once, do it right" the first time. Why a half ass solution? Besides as you can tell I really enjoyed the process. The extra 70 lbs isn't noticeable, car handles and accelerates great! When stuck on the side of the road minutes matter, every minute is more aggravation and/or embarrassment not to mention dangerous. Went to another friend's house at 56 miles one way. She and her neighbors had no 220 plugs in their houses available. Was forced to run the generator to get home until 11:00pm. The neighbors put up with the noise but not if generator was running until 6am the next day at L1 ! A 12 to 14 hour 120 volt charge was not an option either, had to be at work the next day.Tested the generator's power quality with the Fluke power analyzer and found that the Pramac S2800's pure sine wave and THD output was the same as SDGE supplied power to the house. The inverter types have "square" sine waves. http://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/104393/to-what-extent-are-pure-sine-wave-power-supplies-marketing-spin" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
With the hatch closed, gen out of sight and piece of mind, I'm happy with the result of this project.

chuck101 said:

You have put lots of thinking and time into this solution. I am wondering why it has to be level2. If you are planning for an emergency, why not have a smaller, cheaper, simpler, lighter choice that you are dragging around every day and will maybe use once a year at most?
Why not keep a cheap spare 110 volt charge cable and a simple harbor freight generator.
I like this one:
http://www.harborfreight.com/2500-peak2200-running-watts-47-hp-125cc-portable-inverter-generator-61171.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Probably it would produce cleaner power as well. No need it blowing up your onboard charger with some poor power output from a basic generator. You'd take longer to charge, but at 4 miles of charge per hour, unless you are really out in the sticks, running the gen for an hour will get you where you need to be. This is also arguably more quiet than your generator solution.

Thanks for sharing your solution, these are just my thoughts.

Click to expand...