How to replace pack myself with salvaged unit?

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hillzofvalp

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Joined
Oct 31, 2014
Messages
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I'm seeing a lot of low mileage salvage leafs in my area. What would it take to swap packs? Is it plug and play (aside from maybe using different brackets) with the original computer? Or do you need a certified nissan tech to reset something in the brains?

I've got a shop that's somewhat interested in helping me drop the packs. It's just a matter of economics getting it out of the salvaged vehicle.
 
The pack is heavy. You'll need something big to support it. Take a look at the stretchla blog here for an idea of what this takes.

You'll also need Nissan to program the VCM (main computer) to accept the pack. As far as what years/packs to go with I'd only recommend going model years 11-12 to 11-12 or 13+ to 13+ at this point. It's more than a different "bracket"- it's a small HV DC wiring harness to interface the newer pack style with the older DC junction box. High current, super important stuff.
 
I called the dealership here today.. they said they would have to have both cars here to perform the swap, and they would likely not accept a lone battery off a pickup truck. I sort of expected that, which is why I was looking to have it done at a porsche/audi shop.

So if I put a 2013-2014 pack in a 2012, I need mainly the harness?

What are the real world risks? I think that nissan is overly cautious because they are trying to protect their PR. Someone sooner or later is going to be doing "unauthorized" pack swaps, especially given how many salvaged leafs there are.

I would think that if the pack is untouched in a collision, it is probably fine unless it has been sitting overly discharged for some time. the bms will likely protect against water damage or shock damage...

Edit: How long until someone reverse engineers the "pack learning" computer that the nissan techs use to "accept" a new pack?
 
Pack swapping is no big deal, but I wouldn't cross the MY boundries. 11-12 into an 11-12, etc.

Put the car on a side lift, get a transmission lift, lower the old one, bring in the new one, and jack it into place.

You will have to go to a friendly dealer and have it programmed, but no big deal.

Then sell me the old one for home power storage
 
hillzofvalp said:
So if I put a 2013-2014 pack in a 2012, I need mainly the harness?
...
Edit: How long until someone reverse engineers the "pack learning" computer that the nissan techs use to "accept" a new pack?
Click to expand...
You need the kit that Nissan uses to put a heat resistant "lizard" 2015 battery into a 2011 or 2012 LEAF if you purchase a replacement.
I have not seen a detailed description of what is in the kit.
Clearly wiring harness as the connections are different.
But may be more to it than that.
2013 forward design is different.
If you look at the on line video of the Smyrna assembly plant, 2013 pack is lifted up to the vehicle and bolted in place robotically.
2011 and 2012 required assembly. A lot more time.
The kit has to make it possible for the pack assembly to bolt to the car and connect with the original harness.
 
I think the 2011/2012 was also bolted on. They may not have had the tooling at the time to do it robotically, so I imagine that's why you only saw it on 2013 video. I don't know enough about it, but imagine the hand disassembly process is very similar on all leafs plus or minus 1 hour. I highly doubt the 2011/12 "REQUIRED" hand assembly except for minor things like tucking wire harnesses out of the way. Again, I have no idea, but my logic could be on track

Does anyone have resources on the necessary steps to remove it? I need to be able to tell a non nissan dealer how to do it without nissan manual. Every bolt, the sequence, etc. I might disconnect the pack harness for them so they don't have any risk of shock.

How much would you pony up for a 70-75% SOH pack, killawhat?

How do I find a nissan dealer that will program it? It's such an unheard of thing. I would hate to get the pack in and tow the car to the dealer just to find that they changed their mind and I now have a perfect brick of a car
 
hillzofvalp said:
I think the 2011/2012 was also bolted on. They may not have had the tooling at the time to do it robotically, so I imagine that's why you only saw it on 2013 video. I don't know enough about it, but imagine the hand disassembly process is very similar on all leafs plus or minus 1 hour. I highly doubt the 2011/12 "REQUIRED" hand assembly except for minor things like tucking wire harnesses out of the way. Again, I have no idea, but my logic could be on track

Does anyone have resources on the necessary steps to remove it? I need to be able to tell a non nissan dealer how to do it without nissan manual. Every bolt, the sequence, etc. I might disconnect the pack harness for them so they don't have any risk of shock.

How much would you pony up for a 70-75% SOH pack, killawhat?

How do I find a nissan dealer that will program it? It's such an unheard of thing. I would hate to get the pack in and tow the car to the dealer just to find that they changed their mind and I now have a perfect brick of a car
Click to expand...

The LEAF service manual is readily available and I thought it contained instructions on how to drop the pack...
 
thanks!

http://www.nicoclub.com/FSM/Leaf/2012%20Leaf/evb.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
 
It looks like on page EVB-39 it describes the resets done.

I'm wondering --by swapping cells out instead of whole sealed packs--if you can work around the "SAVE BATTERY INFORMATION DATA" and "WRITE BATTERY INFORMATION DATA" and ignore "CLEAR BATTERY GRADUAL CAPACITY LOSS DATA" and
"CLEAR BATTERY GRADUAL CAPACITY LOSS DATA" since the later do not matter.

If GID meter relies on this than it might be annoying, but I think you could figure out the new scale in leaf spy... right?

In any event, it would appear that the vehicle will still work without these resets done. I think they just harvest the information and say that it is required.. but it's probably not. What do you think?
 
Personally, after swapping packs I would just find a Nissan service manager who will perform the resets for some token 1 hour labor, or whatever. Its still has to be a lot cheaper than having them do all the work.
Also, if it was me, depending where you live of course, I wouldn't even think of putting anything but a 2015 pack in my Leaf. It shouldn't be too hard to find out the part numbers for the extra harnesses. 2015 packs are probably very rare right now, but I think buying any other year is not only a crapshoot, with unknown capacity, but is going to degrade just as fast as your original pack.
 
I'm in Tennessee with 30,000 miles, 79%. I know another guy here with second bar lost at 42,000 or 78%. We have similar usage.

It all depends on the price of the salvaged pack. If I can get the cost of the pack swap down, then I could do it every 40-50k and always have above 75%. There is a big market for used modules for ebike enthusiasts... so may even be able to recoup $1k-2k off of a 70% pack.
 
I know a guy who did this.
All you need to to is change the BMS from the old pack in to the new one.
Then you don't need to go to Nissan at all.
But of course it will have to be the same generation battery pack.
I have already taken apart 4 of these battery packs and the BMS is easily accessible.
No need to modify anything.

I guess you could buy an different battery pack from 2013 car and simply change all the 48 batteri modules in to your old pack. Gets a little more complicated but can be done.

The "old" BMS will slowly learn the capacity of the new battery modules and SOH will increase during some days.
 
I have, and i will get one more the coming week.
But i also have 5 more persons on waiting list for modules.

And, I live in Norway.
 
mwalsh said:
How come so many people in Norway are wrecking their cars? Or do you get them from Sweden and Europe too?
Click to expand...

It's likely a result of the high numbers and bad driving conditions. A huge portion of the leased LEAFs in the USA go to Norway after lease end. They are bought at auction by individuals and sent over, thousands in fact.
 
Yes, we are passing 50 000 electric cars here soon in this small country.
Nissan Leaf is nr one, and Tesla nr two.

And as mentioned, there can be some difficult driving conditions here.
Might be cruel but i am hoping for a very slippery winter ;)
 
What are the steps to swapping the bms? I'm assuming it's a matter of unscrewing it and disconnected it and swapping it over like a pc mobo

Can you confirm that this is absolutely necessary? And why? What will happen if you don't?

Also, why would using an old BMS in a new pack matter? The only real problem I see is if the connectors/pinout are different, but that's easy to fix.
 
hillzofvalp said:
Can you confirm that this is absolutely necessary? And why? What will happen if you don't?
Click to expand...
The 2012 service manual section EVC page 191 shows a DTC (P3102) if the BMS ID does not match
that in the VCM. However interesting that on page 77 of the same section, "Ready" is not disabled,
it only shows "Traction motor output is limited".
 

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