Another is this car right for me with a twist

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Doomsday

Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2016
Messages
20
Hi guys. A little about me. Im 49, been in IT work for over 25 years mainly supporting windows computers and now some coding (not actual coding, more like scripting installs).

I have been and am intrigued with Solar, electric vehicles, I been flying electric RC planes and helicopters for 20+ years so I really enjoy the whole genre of getting and storing energy and such.

Now with that said, I have never really looked at actually purchasing an EV until now. Here is where it gets a little twisty lol.
My wife of 29 years passed away last year. 3 years Prior to that I suffered a stroke. Totally screwed up my left side, as of now, I got maybe 30% usage of it. On top of all of that, I been working from home for several years even prior to the stroke.

Now with that back history, a little more about myself. I dont ever go anywhere. Even before the stroke I would get out a couple times a month and fly rc but dont even do that now. Sure my wife would drag me out of the house on occasion but for the most part, Im perfectly fine hanging out in the house lol. My gas usage is INSANELY low. Im talking 1 to 2 tanks a year. I get most everything delivered and only go out a couple times a month to pic up stuff for me and my daughter and even then, we are talking 10 miles round trip.

Here is the thing. I hate driving that van. Its a conversion caravan setup for my daughters wheelchair, It drives fine, its not like im scared of it at all, I just dont really like it. Im not planning on getting rid of it because would still need it to haul my daughter around but I was thinking of getting a second used car that might be small and fun to drive. Obviously with my driving history over the last several years its not that I even need a second car, in fact if my wife was alive she would be giving me an absolute no on getting an EV or frankly a second car at all. (I had a second car but after her death, my brother needed it after his broke down so I just gave it to him dropping me back down to 1 vehicle).

Ok so now that I have almost given you my life history here lol. Like I said, im starting looking for a second car to do these small errands in. It obviously would not save me any money whatsoever in terms of gas usage. In fact our state has a $100 usage tax each year for electric cars so it would actually cost me more money to own one.

This wanting a second car started before I gave mine to my brother actually. When I heard about the Chevy Bolt. That thing just intrigues the hell out of me lol. I want one so bad but its purely greed on my part but of course I dont want to be paying 40k over the next 70 months for it. I just cant justify that. I almost cant justify buying a used leaf either. I have found a couple sv's that are 2013 lease returns that are around $9k. Which I could do and finance for say 36 months. So am I crazy for wanting this lol? Of course my friends say im nuts, not because its an EV, just that I dont drive much and it would kinda be a waste.

Im pretty sure that EV designers did not have me in mind when designing these things. Only being used a couple times a month? Would I need to just leave the trickle charger connected all the time? Would I need to put a trickle charger on the 12 volt battery in the car to? I already hate doing that with my van. Winters here, can cause my vans battery to go out in just over a week of not driving. Its a bad battery anyway and usually are lows are in the teens to twenties when we get fully into winter ( I mowed my yard last week due to my grass still growing lol)

So im basically trying to justify getting another vehicle. I had kinda settled on the leaf, It seemed the biggest of the EV cars (not interested in a $70k tesla either lol) so it might not be as hard for me to get in and out of. Would you guys have some recommendations perhaps? Tell me im nuts for wanting to do it? lol. Like I said, my current looking is at used 2013 leafs and am trying to get either the sl or sv. Im kinda wanting to get the fully loaded or mostly loaded version which is another reason I was looking at these lease returns everywhere because I couldnt really justify going all out in a new car. Now while I am a fairly technical guy, my knowledge of EVs is extremely limited to just what I been researching the last few months/weeks. Lots and lots of videos, reviews, trying to find web sites to see folks experiences and such. Its kinda how I got here. If I have a goal and im not saying I do, but I thought maybe getting one of these used ones for 3 year term and would be in time to pay it off and possibly trade it in for a used chevy bolt when they start coming off lease (if they live up to the hype). Anyways, thanks for reading the big wall of text if you made it this far lol. I appreciate any thoughts you guys might have.

Edit note. Sorry i meant to put thi in the general owners forum so if a mod wants to move it, cool.
 
The heart wants what the heart wants.

Technically, the car keeps the 12 v charged even if you don't run it, unlike an ICE, but the 12 v in a used Leaf may need replacing. Some here have gone with 12 v lithium, search for that.
 
The one thing you wouldn't want to do is leave the car plugged in to the charging cable or charging station - that will drain the 12 volt battery. Some Leafs, especially of the 2013 era and earlier, have issues with the car not keeping the 12 volt battery properly charged. If you really want a used Leaf, here are a few suggestions:

* Save money by getting a Leaf with substantial lost capacity. Leafs built from 2011 through March of 2013 lose capacity quickly if the packs get hot, and they do it more slowly even if they don't get hot, except in a few really cool climates. If your maximum needed range is, say, 30 miles, then look for either a 2011/2012 Leaf with 2 or more lost capacity "bars" on the dash gauge, or a 2013 one or two lost bars. These are worth less for most people but should be fine for you. The 2011/2012 cars have a heater that works much more slowly and wastes power, so consider the earlier cars only if you live in a mild climate. If you have real Winters, get a 2013 or newer car. The S has just a resistance heater, while the SV and SL fom 2013 on have heat pumps as well.

* Get a Leaf S. These cars are simpler, and unless you want to be able to preheat or precool the car remotely, the decreased Winter range the S has won't matter to you. These cars are also cheaper.

* Get a brand new, deep cycle 12 volt battery for it. Something like an Optima Yellow Top. These batteries aren't as good as they once were, but are still vastly better than the OEM battery.

* Hardwire a battery maintainer lead into the charge port compartment. This would let you plug in a Battery Tender, Battery Tender JR, or similar unit easily. You could do that once a month or less with a deep-cycle battery installed.

* If you can park the car in a sunny location, consider a Leaf SL. The little solar panel on the spoiler is largely there for show, but it will add a little charge to that pesky 12 volt battery if parked for hours in full sun.

* Charge the car only as needed. The pack will hold a charge well, so it would be easier to charge it to 80 or 90% once a month, with occasional charges to Full to equalize the cells, than to charge after each 10 mile trip. Just charge it when it gets below 30% or so.
 
+1^, especially on buying a car with a degraded pack. You don't go anywhere, a car nobody else will want means a good bargain for you.

But if you really want someone to talk you out of it, for the money you'd spend and the effort involved for so little driving in return, you could just Über.
 
It makes absolutely no economic sense to buy any car in your situation. Uber is by far cheaper. That said, a 2013 or earlier LEAF will serve you well and be fun to drive. Do it if you can afford to have an expensive toy and want to.
 
Financially, only you can answer that for yourself as to whether it's the right thing for you to do. On some other points, this is what I have to say:

1. Are you homebound as much as you are because you hate driving that van? You might find that driving a car you really enjoy driving might make you more likely to get out of the house more frequently. One thing we warn new Leaf owners (lessees especially) is that once they fall in love with the quiet operation and instantaneous torque, they'll find excuses to drive it as much as they can.

2. Regarding your medical condition, as long as you have the strength in one hand (and decent coordination) to plug in the charging handle, you should not have a problem with driving the Leaf. It is one of the easiest cars to drive. Also, The Leaf is an extremely easy car to get in and out of. The high roofline makes for goofy styling but also means you're bumping your head into the roof less often. The seat cushion is also quite high, not as high as an SUV but higher than a typical modern passenger car.
 
Me being homebound is due to a few things. I really dont like driving the van but thats not really an excuse as I rarely got out when I had my suv and I loved that thing. Its part laziness lol and since I have to use a cane to walk, im pretty slow moving (much faster now then 2 years ago) but I really just dont have much I need to go anywhere for. Used to be we went all kinds of places, ate out a lot and what not but since we gave up fast food, there just isnt much I need to go out for now. I been doing all my shopping online for the last several years (thank goodness for amazon lol) and so it just ended up that I dont need to go out much. Before the stroke I had gotten me a little 50cc scooter just to play around with and loved that thing. Really fun to tool around the area with and I actually went driving it around the neighborhood about every day due to it being so fun. Something freeing about riding on two wheels without a cage surrounding you, even if your top speed is only 40mph downhill with the wind at your back lol.

Financially, I can afford a used $10k car. I have no major bills anymore. Its just my brain keeps saying you dont need this. You dont go out much and you have a perfectly working van under the carport. Basically this would be just a big grown up toy for me. Im not a save the planet kind of guy but like I said, I love the idea of things like solar and wind and hydro that could help a home be completely self sufficient. Its not even like our electricity is even high, I think its around .08 per kwh here. I would love to see my house be 100% able to produce its own electricity but again, its still just to expensive at this juncture. To me its the same with EVs. Great idea but it seems to me that everywhere you turn, everyone is out to try and stop them from being the future. The infrastructure in the US is horrible. Its like they are purposely dragging their feet in hopes that people will get frustrated and just quit buying them. Even today, the tesla or the bolt. I would not be able to drive from here back to my home town. My father lives 2 hours away from me and there is no way a brand new leaf would even get to him without turning the 2 hour trip into an all day trip, 1 way. I do see their potential in driving around the city although if truth be told, I would rather see city folks drop their cars for scooters for most city driving but thats just the scooter person in me wanting out lol.

As for buying a leaf with a depleted battery, yes that would certainly be the cheapest way possible to go but then I have to look and say, ok I might get a 2011 for $5k with a bad battery but just a couple K more and I can have an almost fully loaded newer model. Here is where my twisted mind comes in. IF I am going to spend say $5-6k for a car, why completely cheap out. For just a little more, I am riding in luxury without spending $40k to do it. Its not that I need remote start or remote climate control. But 360 cameras, leather seats, heated seats, infotainment center and such are very nice to have and you just cant get those in the basic package. BTW, no garage here. Just a driveway behind the house so things like level 2 charging probably wouldnt happen unless I got a second carport or such.
 
If you get one, your Leaf will be as fun to drive as your scooter was.

You are wrong about the Leaf not getting to your father's house 2 hours away without taking all day. If you get a QC equipped Leaf, 1 QC charge in the middle should make the trip easy. If you go with a 2016 or 17 with 30KWh battery, it might make it without charging. Without QC, I have a 80 mile highway range and anything past that requires L2 charging at about 25 miles per hour of charge.

Plenty of L2 EVSE's that can be mounted outside in the weather near where you park at home.
 
It sounds like you want an SL with Premium Package. In 2013 you could get an SL with both the Quick charge and Premium packages, so I'd look for one of those. Note that a 2013 built before April of 2013 (the date is on the driver's door jamb sticker) will likely have several lost bars and will keep losing range, while a later 2013 build, even if it has one bar gone, will lose range much more slowly. So you get to choose between lower price and more stable battery chemistry.

If you do get an SL, park it so that solar panel is in the sun as much as possible, and get a new Optima 12 volt battery anyway. Make sure it's fully charged before or right after installation. If you don't leave the car plugged in, you might have no problems with the 12 volt system.
 
BillHolz said:
If you get one, your Leaf will be as fun to drive as your scooter was.

You are wrong about the Leaf not getting to your father's house 2 hours away without taking all day. If you get a QC equipped Leaf, 1 QC charge in the middle should make the trip easy. If you go with a 2016 or 17 with 30KWh battery, it might make it without charging. Without QC, I have a 80 mile highway range and anything past that requires L2 charging at about 25 miles per hour of charge.

Plenty of L2 EVSE's that can be mounted outside in the weather near where you park at home.

That was the problem, there are no QC areas to charge at between me and him. There are a couple L1 spots but that looked about it. He lives out in nowhere land. Its not a big deal I guess, I would still have the van. I dont know if it would be as fun as the ol scooter but I would consider a level 2 EVSE if I did start driving the hell outta it lol. I saw the video on youtube that talked about why an L1 EVSE is probably all you need and it was pretty convincing especially for my situation.
 
What about L-2 stations en route? If those are available, then definitely narrow your search to a Leaf with a 6.6kw onboard charger. That means any 2013+ SV or SL, and any 2013+ S with the Charge (QC) package. The faster onboard charger is only really needed when you are charging away from home, but at those times the difference is really felt. A 6.6-equipped Leaf will add about 1% charge every two minutes at a commercial L-2 station, while the 3.3 will only add 1% every four minutes or so.
 
I decided on a 2013 SL w/ premium package. Has quick charge port and the 6.6 onboard charger. It is being detailed and will be here wednesday :) It was a hair more then I was planning on spending but the one I found only had a hair over 9k miles on it with only 1 owner and all its maint was done so looks like whoever had it really took care of it.. Its also made late in 2013 so looks like it has the new battery chemistry. The other one they had was over 30k miles but was made early in 2013 and didnt have as much options as the first one. Thanks to everyone for the suggestions. My next purchase will be to upgrade the 12v battery to an optima yellow. I guess I also need to decide if I want to upgrade the cellular in it since the 2g service seems to be gone. How does the leaf get its updated maps of charging stations? Is it through cellular? Also, Happy New Year to everyone!
 
Doomsday said:
How does the leaf get its updated maps of charging stations? Is it through cellular?
Yes, but if it hasn't stopped working, it will soon. You'll need to pay $199 to have the TCU swapped out to support 3G: see replies from http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=477550#p477550 onward and https://www.nissanusa.com/connect/faq under "NissanConnectSM EV

IMPORTANT FAQS REGARDING 2G CELLULAR NETWORK CHANGES AND IMPACT TO ACCESS TO NISSANCONNECT EV[*]"

The charging station data via Carwings/NissanConnect sucks anyway. Don't depend on it. Use Plugshare, the web site and their smartphone apps instead.
 
When you get the Yellow Top battery installed, make sure they charge it fully! ICE vehicles will usually charge the battery completely within a hundred miles or less, so I'm guessing most shops don't pre-charge them all the way. Sounds like you got a great car.
 
Oddly enough, It was much cheaper to order it through amazon then it was my local auto parts store by a fair amount. I have a charger that I can charge it up to full with so that shouldnt be a problem. Time will tell on if I got a great one or it turns into a lemon on me in a few weeks lol. I am hoping, everyone seemed honest but I tend to expect folks being honest and thats bit me on a few occasions.
 
As I understand it, they moved production of these batteries from the US to either Mexico or China some years ago, and the quality suffered. Hopefully it was Mexico, and the quality has come back up by now.
 
Doomsday said:
Oddly enough, It was much cheaper to order it through amazon then it was my local auto parts store by a fair amount. I have a charger that I can charge it up to full with so that shouldnt be a problem. Time will tell on if I got a great one or it turns into a lemon on me in a few weeks lol. I am hoping, everyone seemed honest but I tend to expect folks being honest and thats bit me on a few occasions.
Thats where I got mine, Amazon and it was as you said, quite a bit cheaper than locally! I believe Costco used to sell Optima and years ago I purchased a blue top marine battery for my UPS that only failed recently, I believe Sams may still sell the brand but I no longer belong. I also went with the Yellow Top, for both my Leaf and also Prius that uses smaller than standard posts, time will tell....I like the idea of the battery being sealed, especially for the Prius where it's located inside the cabin, albeit in the trunk area. Don't want acid or gas leaking out.
 
ok, Some probably stupid questions since my car should be here wednesday.

Never had keyless entry and whatnot before. If you get out of the car and walk away, does it automatically lock and arm the security system or do you have to do that manually on the fob? Will sat nav still work without the 2g cellular service? Looks like the maps are loaded onto an sd card so was assuming it would still work but wanted to check.

What is the prevailing opinion about running on all weather tires year round? Affect range much? I know it seems people say you should run at 40 psi but didnt really see much on all weather tires.
Last but im sure not least lol, Can you get in your car, turn on climate control and get back out taking the fob with you and it still stay on?
 
Doomsday said:
Never had keyless entry and whatnot before. If you get out of the car and walk away, does it automatically lock and arm the security system or do you have to do that manually on the fob?
No on the first. You can muck w/the fob buttons but you don't need to. You can press the button on the front door handles to lock, as long as the key fob is on you.

I found this video and have only semi-watched the first 2.5 minutes of it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fqIQ0JK5eo.
Doomsday said:
Will sat nav still work without the 2g cellular service? Looks like the maps are loaded onto an sd card so was assuming it would still work but wanted to check.
Yes.
Doomsday said:
Can you get in your car, turn on climate control and get back out taking the fob with you and it still stay on?
Yes. The fob exiting the vehicle or losing communication w/the vehicle does NOT turn off the car.
 
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