Install Charging Station Before Buying Leaf?

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MDWyatt

New member
Joined
Apr 14, 2015
Messages
3
Greetings and Salutations!

I just bought a new house, and one of the main reasons I wanted a house was so that I could have a garage and a charger for a Nissan Leaf. I've been thinking this whole time that I should get the charging station installed before I trade my Juke in for a Leaf, but every time I talk to the dealership they're trying to pressure-sale me into getting the Leaf ASAP.

My question to Leaf owners: Did you get your charging station installed before you got your Leaf? Or did you get your Leaf and then have to wait days or even weeks for the charging station to be installed? Also, if you got the Leaf first, what was your experience with charging your Leaf?

I can't wait to get my Leaf! I'm going to get a 2015 super black SV, and I'm getting "Black Lightning" decals and some lightning custom vinyl stickers all over. At least, that's the plan until I get a better idea.

MDWyatt
 
Got my EVSE well after I well after I got my Leaf.
Was using the "trickle" EVSE for 10+ hours a night sometimes...

It worked until I got my 240v EVSE.
And the wait made me appreciate my 240v EVSE even more.. ;-)

desiv
 
I did install my EVSE (charge station) before I got the LEAF. But I also did the work myself, so it only took a few hours after I got all the parts together.

It doesn't really matter if you get the LEAF first because you can use the Level 1 (120 V) EVSE that is included with the car until you get your Level 2 EVSE installed. Yes, Level 1 is very slow but it should suffice for a few days. If you do use the L1 EVSE, make sure that the 120 V outlet is in good condition and is not shared with any other devices. And make sure the plug and outlet don't get hot, a sign of poor wiring.
 
I didn't put in the charging station first, but I did have someone come out and frame my assumptions of how much it would cost to install one. I was lucky to have my panel on the other side of the garage wall so it wasn't that challenging or costly to install. I wound up buying a EVSE that was a little more draw then the existing wiring could support (as I was trying to re-purpose my dryer outlet) as a result, I had to get new wired run in the wall and put in a new outlet, which added about $400 to the install cost. Had I known this in advance, I would have bought a different EVSE with slightly lower draw. Anyways, I'd recommend getting someone out to look at it just to make sure. You don't want to run into an instance where you have to run a new line across the house and upgrade the main panel. These things can get expensive and as a result, you may be re-thinking the whole EV cost/benefit analysis thing. I used the existing L1 charger that came with the car for about a month, it was less than ideal, but my wife does have chargers at her work. Another thing to keep in mind is that you will likely be able to switch your electric plan over to a time of use plan, which will mean that your power will be much cheaper during off peak times (when you charge the car). Without a L2 charger, you will need to charge the car during peak time as well and doing so will mean that you'll pay much more for your electricity. Its not a huge deal for a short period of time, but here in CA, the peak rate is 4x the off peak. 40 cents per kwh vs. 11 cents per kwh.

Also, with regard to the car you are buying, just an FYI that the black cars are not preferred because the black paint absorbs heat and the car will be hotter as a result. Heat is not your battery's friend and can do bad things to the life expectancy of your battery. The 2015 batteries seem to be more heat tolerant, but that's just my 2 cents. Personally I'd stay away from black. The new titanium color is pretty sweet. If you're leasing however, you may not care about the battery life, but keep it in mind if you intend to purchase at the end of lease.
 
http://www.plugshare.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

create an account and you can see home chargers/EVSEs too. If there are public EVSEs or another nice home owner near you that you could walk to, or wait a couple hours at then you won't be stuck if you need a full charge in under 5hrs. It's not ideal but it might help alleviate the concern. With the warm weather now if you're not going to drive more than 50 miles a day and you have at least 12hrs to charge it then you'll be fine with L1. If you do 60 or 70 1 day and keep charging it 12 hrs you'll get caught back up. If you needed 70+ on multiple days then you're probably in the territory of needing a 240v unit. I charge for 10hrs at work on L1 every day I get 40-55% back in depending on outside temp and what SOC the leaf is at and my pre cool/heat use.


Also use plugshare to map out your usual routes and try to visit any sites that don't have current reviews before you buy to make sure they are actually working/still there.

Do not rely on the map guide of chargers the leaf comes with, mine still says that a hydro company near me has an EVSE, it hasn't been there for 4 years.
 
Thanks for the responses, everybody!

You've given me something to think about with the super black color. I'm hoping it won't be as much an issue since I'll be parking in my garage at home and in a huge parking garage at work. The only time my Leaf will see the sun is when I'm commuting to work. Otherwise, we'll be driving my wife's Versa. Still... the potential is there for White Lightning instead!

You've also given me some hope that I could go ahead and get my Leaf this weekend, and I'll just get the charger installed when I can.

Another question for y'all: Who has used the Nissan "preferred" AeroVironment turnkey installation for two grand? Is it worth it to buy the unit for one grand and shop around for an electrician to install it?

http://evsolutions.avinc.com/products/home_charging/nissan

I am not an electrician, and I don't want to die... so I'll definitely have to get someone else to do it for me. I wish I was as savvy as dgpcolorado, but if it's outside of a computer case I'm not going to risk it.
 
MDWyatt said:
...Another question for y'all: Who has used the Nissan "preferred" AeroVironment turnkey installation for two grand? Is it worth it to buy the unit for one grand and shop around for an electrician to install it?

http://evsolutions.avinc.com/products/home_charging/nissan

...
NO! There are many less expensive EVSE options than AeroVironment. You can have the Nissan/Panasonic EVSE supplied with the car upgraded to 240 V by EVSEupgrade.com for about $330. You can purchase EVSEs from Clipper Creek or at Home Depot for $400 to $500. How much it will cost to install depends on the wiring in your garage and where the electrical panel is. Ask several electricians for estimates (and be prepared for widely different results). It might be as little as a few hundred dollars or as much as a thousand dollars for a difficult wiring upgrade. You won't know until you ask an expert.
 
dgpcolorado said:
NO! There are many less expensive EVSE options than AeroVironment.

Awesome! I will be looking into that. Does using an off-brand charger affect the Leaf's warranty?

dgpcolorado said:
You won't know until you ask an expert.

And that's exactly why I'm asking you guys. And so far I have received much, much better information here than from either Grubb's Nissan or Don Davis Nissan (in DFW, Texas). I really appreciate you guys, and I can't wait to be a Leaf-owning member of this group.
 
dgpcolorado said:
MDWyatt said:
...Another question for y'all: Who has used the Nissan "preferred" AeroVironment turnkey installation for two grand? Is it worth it to buy the unit for one grand and shop around for an electrician to install it?

http://evsolutions.avinc.com/products/home_charging/nissan

...
NO! There are many less expensive EVSE options than AeroVironment. You can have the Nissan/Panasonic EVSE supplied with the car upgraded to 240 V by EVSEupgrade.com for about $330. You can purchase EVSEs from Clipper Creek or at Home Depot for $400 to $500. How much it will cost to install depends on the wiring in your garage and where the electrical panel is. Ask several electricians for estimates (and be prepared for widely different results). It might be as little as a few hundred dollars or as much as a thousand dollars for a difficult wiring upgrade. You won't know until you ask an expert.
+1. The $2K flat fee Nissan wanted was a little pricey for my taste. In my situation, worked out the wiring plan details before making a final decision on a Leaf (car would be useless for me if could not charge L2). Then, pre-wired the rough-in for the EVSE in a manic moment the weekend before committing to the purchase. By that time getting a Leaf became a quest. Then ordered the EVSE from Clipper Creek the day I took delivery and made due with the L1 cord that came with the car for a few days until it arrived.
 
Also, with regard to the car you are buying, just an FYI that the black cars are not preferred because the black paint absorbs heat and the car will be hotter as a result.

Oh Sure Sure, another color based opinion :D :D

I have a black car, and yes, it's hot in the summer, but It's also warmer in the winter !!
With tinted windows, it also looks very nice......

I have not noticed a correlation between body color and battery temp.
Don't think the body color will affect the temp of the battery installed under the car very much, but I'd listen to opposing views.

I installed an Aeronvironment EVSE before my Leaf arrived, but I waited months to get the car.
I ordered it direct, and installed it my self (although getting an electrician is kind of DIY)

Mount it as close to center in the front of your garage as you can.
1 EV families have a tendency to become 2 EV families, so might as well make it easy to get to either vehicle

Good luck.
 
Personally, I did the install beforehand. Do your homework first. Shop around and search on here, and find out what your EVSE equipment options are. Then have someone come out and give you an estimate on running the circuit so you'll know exactly how much it's going to cost you before buying. Some people have been surprised because some oddity in their electrical service caused a lot of extra expense. Knowing the equipment options will let you discuss alternate ideas with the electrician if that happens.

Before you decide you can start out on 120v, you have to consider how many miles a day you will be driving to make your commute. If it's more than 45 or 50 or so, you won't be able to get enough of a charge overnight on 120v to keep the battery charge high enough so that you can make the trip five days in a row. The exact figure is dependent on your schedule and any opportunities you might have to charge away from home. Also, if the 120v outlets in your garage are old or are shared with other equipment, they may not be suitable for nightly charging anyway. Safety first.

P.S. Don't count on driving that Versa all the time. Most LEAFers find themselves driving the car much more then they planned. I know mine became the "go to" car for the family on the weekends.
 
I installed my EVSE the same day I picked up my Leaf. I had trouble getting a Leaf in my area. It took my local Nissan dealer a couple of weeks to get one that I was OK with. It just happened by coincidence that I had ordered and received my EVSE, got the parts together, and got it installed the same day that my dealer had my Leaf ready.

I direct ordered the Aerovironment EVSE that Nissan pushes only because I didn't know at the time that there were other options available. It's a nice unit, was easy to install, and I have had no problems with it - but it is kind of expensive. I bought the unit that plugs in, so I can use the 220 plug for other things if I need to. I had wanted another heavier 110 outlet and a 220 outlet in my garage for quite awhile, so I kind of wanted to do that installation anyway. The EVSE gave me a reason to finally do it. I installed the EVSE closer to the front of the garage. That way I can plug it into the car inside the garage, or parked outside in front of the garage.

The only time I have ever used my 110 EVSE that came with the Leaf is once just to make sure it worked in case I ever need it.
 
I'll concur with others that you can drive a LEAF while charging on the 110V trickle charge cable. We did so for 2 weeks before our 240V EVSE was functional. A few additional comments:

1) I know nothing of your house, but in a few cases LEAFers with older houses with older wiring found that they couldn't use the 110V trickle charge after all. The LEAF charger drew too much current for the wiring. For this reason it's not a bad idea to get an electrician out to assess your wiring as well as estimating the cost of installing a garage 240V circuit in advance of getting a LEAF.

2) You have a ton of options for a home 240V EVSE. Just search for "charging stations" at homedepot.com or lowes.com, for starters. Aerovironment is definitely way too expensive compared to the others. The list of EVSEs available is always changing and the price has been dropping on them for the past two years. I haven't looked recently at the options, but you want an EVSE that: 1) is rated for 30 volts or better - most LEAFs (except model S without the charging package) will be able to charge at 30 volts using the on-board 6.6. kW/charger so can charge from empty to full in about 2 hours. The 16 volt EVSEs do it in about twice the time. You want to make sure that the cord is long enough for your situation (at least 25' recommended, generally). After that it's about bells and whistles and price.

3) Your best bet is to have an electrician wire a new 240V circuit into your garage with a normal outlet (such as would be used for an electric dryer), then wire the EVSE you buy to plug right into the new outlet. This gives you flexibility to move the unit around later, which you might not have if you direct wire it.

4) You were SO right to want home charging, and to want level 2 (240V) charging. Yes, a lot of LEAFers are able to make due with just level 1 charging at home, or maybe just charging at work. However, having a home level 2 charger greatly simplifies everything. Just plug it in when you get home, unplug when you leave, and that's all. The faster charger (per point 2) at 30 volts means the maximum wait time for a full charge is 4 hours. Now, if you live in a place where the local utility offers TOU (time of use) rates you may find it advantageous to sign of a TOU electric meter and charge during off hours at night, and in that case you have additional complexity of charging timers. In that case, there are plenty of topics on this web site covering how to do that. But even then, once you have the timers set up you still have the convenience of just plugging in when arriving home, and unplugging when you leave. No worrying about gas stations or if the public charger will be blocked.

5) Regarding dealers trying to get you to buy now, search this site for advice on how to get the best deal on a LEAF (or any other car) In general, when YOU are ready just send emails to all the dealers and let them do the bidding. The dealer will try to make you feel like if you don't buy now you won't get as good a deal - in almost call cases that's not true.
 
cgaydos said:
...2) You have a ton of options for a home 240V EVSE. Just search for "charging stations" at homedepot.com or lowes.com, for starters. Aerovironment is definitely way too expensive compared to the others. The list of EVSEs available is always changing and the price has been dropping on them for the past two years. I haven't looked recently at the options, but you want an EVSE that: 1) is rated for 30 volts or better - most LEAFs (except model S without the charging package) will be able to charge at 30 volts using the on-board 6.6. kW/charger so can charge from empty to full in about 2 hours. The 16 volt EVSEs do it in about twice the time. You want to make sure that the cord is long enough for your situation (at least 25' recommended, generally). After that it's about bells and whistles and price...
I think you meant "30 amps", "16 amps", not "volts". Don't want to confuse the newcomer!
 
MDWyatt said:
dgpcolorado said:
NO! There are many less expensive EVSE options than AeroVironment.
Awesome! I will be looking into that. Does using an off-brand charger affect the Leaf's warranty?...
No, using another brand of EVSE will not affect the warranty. All the charge stations that use the J1772 plug standard (Teslas use their own system) will work on a LEAF (in North America, other places have their own standards).

There was one model of EVSE that didn't play nice with the early LEAFs but it was due to a fault in the LEAF design, which has been fixed. Nissan repaired damaged cars under warranty.
 
MDWyatt said:
dgpcolorado said:
NO! There are many less expensive EVSE options than AeroVironment.

Awesome! I will be looking into that. Does using an off-brand charger affect the Leaf's warranty?

The charger is inside the car under the hood. The thing you plug into the wall is called an EVSE or charging station.

It doesn't matter what you plug into it won't affect the warranty unless it starts a house fire or something clearly outside the car.

As in they don't care who provides the electricity you do that at your own risk and that isn't a warranty item.

If the charger inside the car stops working they won't decide to honor the warranty or not based on how you charge.
 
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